Vaping - retired smokers, and ecigs

[VWD]

I quit 9 years ago cold turkey after illness.

I don't buy into these aids helping the majority as too many I know who've used patches etc have all failed to give up, and are either still on them or back to smoking within 6 months.

Ref vaping, too little is known about it. Whilst it uses food flavours which are known to be safe, there is almost no data/testing/studies to prove they are also safe when vapourised. There's a number of food colourings which are known to become unsafe as a vapour.

I believe new European legislation is being drawn up on vaping, and the government is still debating a ban inside. A number of restaurants, cinemas etc already ban use in their buildings.

I never consider my self as free from the weed, but I last smoked a ciggie 11 years ago, and have stayed off with help from patches.BUT how many doctors clinics only looked at the financial returns to get folk off ciggies, without looking at other health problems imminent due to increased appetite etc, leading to an increased risk of diabetes.

But IMHO- ex smokers are only as free up till their next ciggie ,just as alcoholics are free till their next drink. Again, IMH0 ,you can try several times to stop, but it's time /place & a good reason to bolster will power that gives that extra bit of oomph to will power. TBH- smokers help me stay free- as the stench is abominable, though I have to lie to SWIMBO, who has cut down dramatically thanks to her magic flute.

I'm in two minds about vaping, the unknown bothers me, but then how much of the "facts" presented by the medics are in truth "facts".

But then, not so long ago, we heard all the good reasons for sweeteners in drinks as opposed to sugar , but no mention of health risks. now one of the main ones (Aspartame) is linked to heart problems- NOT the sort of thing a type 2 ( who wants a soft sweet drink without sugar) wants to hear.

Edited 14 February, 2016 by VWD

[SuperbTWM]

I'm 50 years old and smoked from about 8 or 9 years old.

I stopped some 3 or 4 years ago did about 14months on an electronic cigarette before stopping completly.

I had a sudden thought....what the hell am I doing sucking some crappy liquid in a electric cigarette looking thing, that at the time I was buying off an internet shop and was claiming it was this or that % nicotine but was not regulated in anyway whatsoever.

So I stopped the lot and luckily haven't missed it.

I now find it mind boggling they can openly advertise a blatant imitation of a banned thing like cigarettes in the form of an electric thing and get away with it.

I know of people that never smoked but have now become regular vapours! WTF this is possibly because they are portraying it as harmless???

Won't be long before they realise that long term effects of glycerine or some other substance may be worse than smoke, who knows?

I don't think people starting to vape is any more ridiculous than people starting to smoke cigarettes.

Edited 14 February, 2016 by SuperbTWM

[XLBaconDoubleCheese]

I don't think people starting to vape is any more ridiculous than people starting to smoke cigarettes.

 

I think it is, these days we have much more info about health issues, we are much more aware of illnesses that can be caused by untested things. Sucking burning liquid into your lungs is never going to end well, to start E cigs or normal cigs in this day and age is just mind boggling. 

 

I can understand going from normal fags to E Cig in the hope the latter will not kill you or kill you slower but to go from nothing to them seems stupid. 

[mender]

I think it is, these days we have much more info about health issues, we are much more aware of illnesses that can be caused by untested things. Sucking burning liquid into your lungs is never going to end well, to start E cigs or normal cigs in this day and age is just mind boggling. 

 

I can understand going from normal fags to E Cig in the hope the latter will not kill you or kill you slower but to go from nothing to them seems stupid. 

+1 and I can understand the help for a diabetic smoker both giving up smoking and helping with sweet cravings, as I guess they will die from smoking and diabetes related illnesses quicker than with a vape related illness, but to go from nothing to vaping is sheer lunacy.

 

.....and the advertising appeals to new starters and youth culture....

[SuperbTWM]

I think it is, these days we have much more info about health issues, we are much more aware of illnesses that can be caused by untested things. Sucking burning liquid into your lungs is never going to end well, to start E cigs or normal cigs in this day and age is just mind boggling. 

 

I can understand going from normal fags to E Cig in the hope the latter will not kill you or kill you slower but to go from nothing to them seems stupid. 

Yes, I totally agree with you but my point is, we know all the health issues with smoking. we know they give you cancer and clog up your insides but yet people are still taking up smoking tabacco

[brown2110]

I've been on the vapes for 3 years. Within a few weeks I instantly felt different. I look back on when I was a smoker and remember how horrible I began to feel each time I lit up.

Cleaner, cheaper nicotine.

Win win for everyone.

Bonus is we can vape on the shop floor at work, so all the smokers have now given them up and now stay inside vaping. Management love it as production is up due to nobody having fag breaks.

Don't forget there is nothing wrong with nicotine in the doses we smoke. Nicotine is only bad in large doses.

It's just a stimulant like coffee. It will not kill you!

[Octabus]

Good to hear a mix of opinions on this one - from both sides of the fence!

 

As a fairly heavy cloud maker, I am (as most others quite surprisingly) more than happy to discuss the outsiders views on my habbit, just as much as I like to share experiences with fellow users.

 

Just to summerise my thoughts on some of the usual comments (from here and general human interation)

 

Them things are probably worse for your health than cigs!

Short term an ecig produces less of the known nasty chemicals found in cigarettes.. tar that coats the lungs for example.

We don't have 50 years worth of studies to determine if the other chemicals and the way they are processed by our bodies, are likely to cause mass problems

Some people  (myself included) can have an allergy to propylene glycol (PG) in my case I got a sore throat, some people have more severe reactions. PG can be used as a bulk ingredient, as a carrier for flavours, and as a carrier for the nicotine. Some of the flavourings used (essentially food flavourings) contain diacetol, which is not considered safe for baking, due to how it reacts with heat. Do the big companies use these? no, does the guy on ebay batching them in his shed use them... who knows?!

In the same breath (!) Are the ingredients of a shop bought pack of lambert and butler, the same as in the fag-house bought pack of langbert and bottler? 

Personal experience, as most have said, my health has improved a lot from switching from cigs to e-cigs. I may gain again if I gave up vaping, but for now.... i'm quite happy not waking up to cough out half a driveway, to not have a cold or chest infection every 2 weeks of winter, to not get out of breath walking more than 50 yards, to not have part burnt yellow rolly fingers, and to not smell like the aftermath of a stolen car....

...... I would also highlight that some people have nut allergies, most people don't. both my grand fathers smoked, one barely made his mid 60's before cancer intervened, the other saw his 92nd birthday, and died of natural causes - despite heavily scarred lungs from TB in his 40s! Humans don't come with a care manual, so its trial and error.

 

That stinks!

Some of the sweet flavours can be sickly, I agree! I had a blueberry cheesecake one last month that was delicious - but the stench of sour milk followed it. I also happened to be stood in greggs behind a young lady whose perfume put me off my steak bake. I once threw a friends magic tree out of his car window as it smelt horrible to me, he loved it... I can't stand the smell or cigarettes now - turns my stomach. I even make my mates bird go outside to smoke when I'm at their house! We all like/hate different smells, so if i'm at work, or with friends, I tend to use the more subtle flavours, and don't fog up the enclosed spaces.. the same courtesy I would pay to others if it was a cigarette, fart or deodorant!

 

Argh! I can't see ... where did all that fog come from?!

If you have been victim to a smokers discharge, or a vapers discharge, I apologise on their behalf, they are a disrespectful, selfish and generally unpleasant individual. The high VG, high output devices can fill a room/car quickly, anyone doing this deliberately to innocent passers by is doing it for attention - give them a kick, as this sort of thing is only giving ammunition to the ban clan! ...although I admit I find it hilarious to fill my mates car up so when he comes back to it and opens the door, it looks like snoop dog is in the passenger seat!

 

Even non smokers are starting

Zero nicotine is available, but why anyone would want to start vaping with nicotine is a mystery to me? I do think it should be sold in the same way other tobacco products are sold - behind the counter, not hanging by the till with lighters, papers and sweets like they do in poundland! Many heroin addicts go to methadone, some start on methadone... its their choice, but the tobacco age limit is getting applied to a lot of reputable sellers. My local vape shop lady told me she recently refused to serve a man because he told her he wanted to buy an e-cig for his 14 year old daughter to stop her smoking - that's a moral dilemma! Bottom line is everyone has a choice, you can choose to smoke, vape, eat fruit, get drunk, throw yourself off a bridge, join a running club, get your giggly bits out in asda, buy a skoda, eat roadkill, join the taliban, adopt a whale, cross dress, visit foreign countries, state your opinion, own a cat, iron your underclangers, choose warburtons over hovis despite in store promotions, change the batteries in the tv remote or watch dwarf p0rn, buy lots of useless things from china on ebay so you get a random surprise delivery a month later.. if you think its right for you, you are going to do it - why should you let someone else decide?

 

Its just another craze

Yes, but its also a way out of the cigarette trap.. and its an addictive hobby with all the different flavours and gadgets to try! (and its more acceptable than getting kicked out of asda every thursday night in the name of self amusement)

 

ooo, thats a big one!

Its also a great talking point, I have met a lot of new people and got chatting to various sorts due to curiosity and comparing devices. Much better than the usual crowd of characters usually found loitering by the pub back door - certainly better conversation anyway.

 

Have you switched to vape, or are you quitting that too?

This is the big question really, I do think now the market has kind of peaked, for me there's no "next stage" just different brands and flavours, nothing completely new to try like when the first sub ohm tanks appeared, and kangetech brought out stranger things (aero tank turbo was a beast!) or when there were only 4 flavours (tobacco, cherry, menthol or toilet duck.. sorry, "apple") I think i am spending less time looking for new products, and just topping up the stock.... I don't seem to be using it quite as much recently... last year, i would say i couldn't ever give up my ecig.. this year I say by next year, I might not vape at all. Time will tell

 

..just got a triton tank, got it last month, its still sat in the draw... I tend to be using the nautilus (1.6ohm), the arctic (0.2ohm) and the drippers when at home now. 50w eleafs are an all rounder for all atomisers I use

atomic fireball is still flavour of the month!

[Octabus]

oops.. so much for a summary! 

[gadgetman]

A number of NHS Trusts, our local one included, ban ecigs too from buildings and grounds.

Cinemas and an increasing number of restaurant & bar chains also ban them.

[mender]

Good to hear a mix of opinions on this one - from both sides of the fence!

 

As a fairly heavy cloud maker, I am (as most others quite surprisingly) more than happy to discuss the outsiders views on my habbit, just as much as I like to share experiences with fellow users.

 

Just to summerise my thoughts on some of the usual comments (from here and general human interation)

 

Them things are probably worse for your health than cigs!

Short term an ecig produces less of the known nasty chemicals found in cigarettes.. tar that coats the lungs for example.

We don't have 50 years worth of studies to determine if the other chemicals and the way they are processed by our bodies, are likely to cause mass problems

Some people  (myself included) can have an allergy to propylene glycol (PG) in my case I got a sore throat, some people have more severe reactions. PG can be used as a bulk ingredient, as a carrier for flavours, and as a carrier for the nicotine. Some of the flavourings used (essentially food flavourings) contain diacetol, which is not considered safe for baking, due to how it reacts with heat. Do the big companies use these? no, does the guy on ebay batching them in his shed use them... who knows?!

In the same breath (!) Are the ingredients of a shop bought pack of lambert and butler, the same as in the fag-house bought pack of langbert and bottler? 

Personal experience, as most have said, my health has improved a lot from switching from cigs to e-cigs. I may gain again if I gave up vaping, but for now.... i'm quite happy not waking up to cough out half a driveway, to not have a cold or chest infection every 2 weeks of winter, to not get out of breath walking more than 50 yards, to not have part burnt yellow rolly fingers, and to not smell like the aftermath of a stolen car....

...... I would also highlight that some people have nut allergies, most people don't. both my grand fathers smoked, one barely made his mid 60's before cancer intervened, the other saw his 92nd birthday, and died of natural causes - despite heavily scarred lungs from TB in his 40s! Humans don't come with a care manual, so its trial and error.

 

That stinks!

Some of the sweet flavours can be sickly, I agree! I had a blueberry cheesecake one last month that was delicious - but the stench of sour milk followed it. I also happened to be stood in greggs behind a young lady whose perfume put me off my steak bake. I once threw a friends magic tree out of his car window as it smelt horrible to me, he loved it... I can't stand the smell or cigarettes now - turns my stomach. I even make my mates bird go outside to smoke when I'm at their house! We all like/hate different smells, so if i'm at work, or with friends, I tend to use the more subtle flavours, and don't fog up the enclosed spaces.. the same courtesy I would pay to others if it was a cigarette, fart or deodorant!

 

Argh! I can't see ... where did all that fog come from?!

If you have been victim to a smokers discharge, or a vapers discharge, I apologise on their behalf, they are a disrespectful, selfish and generally unpleasant individual. The high VG, high output devices can fill a room/car quickly, anyone doing this deliberately to innocent passers by is doing it for attention - give them a kick, as this sort of thing is only giving ammunition to the ban clan! ...although I admit I find it hilarious to fill my mates car up so when he comes back to it and opens the door, it looks like snoop dog is in the passenger seat!

 

Even non smokers are starting

Zero nicotine is available, but why anyone would want to start vaping with nicotine is a mystery to me? I do think it should be sold in the same way other tobacco products are sold - behind the counter, not hanging by the till with lighters, papers and sweets like they do in poundland! Many heroin addicts go to methadone, some start on methadone... its their choice, but the tobacco age limit is getting applied to a lot of reputable sellers. My local vape shop lady told me she recently refused to serve a man because he told her he wanted to buy an e-cig for his 14 year old daughter to stop her smoking - that's a moral dilemma! Bottom line is everyone has a choice, you can choose to smoke, vape, eat fruit, get drunk, throw yourself off a bridge, join a running club, get your giggly bits out in asda, buy a skoda, eat roadkill, join the taliban, adopt a whale, cross dress, visit foreign countries, state your opinion, own a cat, iron your underclangers, choose warburtons over hovis despite in store promotions, change the batteries in the tv remote or watch dwarf p0rn, buy lots of useless things from china on ebay so you get a random surprise delivery a month later.. if you think its right for you, you are going to do it - why should you let someone else decide?

 

Its just another craze

Yes, but its also a way out of the cigarette trap.. and its an addictive hobby with all the different flavours and gadgets to try! (and its more acceptable than getting kicked out of asda every thursday night in the name of self amusement)

 

ooo, thats a big one!

Its also a great talking point, I have met a lot of new people and got chatting to various sorts due to curiosity and comparing devices. Much better than the usual crowd of characters usually found loitering by the pub back door - certainly better conversation anyway.

 

Have you switched to vape, or are you quitting that too?

This is the big question really, I do think now the market has kind of peaked, for me there's no "next stage" just different brands and flavours, nothing completely new to try like when the first sub ohm tanks appeared, and kangetech brought out stranger things (aero tank turbo was a beast!) or when there were only 4 flavours (tobacco, cherry, menthol or toilet duck.. sorry, "apple") I think i am spending less time looking for new products, and just topping up the stock.... I don't seem to be using it quite as much recently... last year, i would say i couldn't ever give up my ecig.. this year I say by next year, I might not vape at all. Time will tell

 

..just got a triton tank, got it last month, its still sat in the draw... I tend to be using the nautilus (1.6ohm), the arctic (0.2ohm) and the drippers when at home now. 50w eleafs are an all rounder for all atomisers I use

atomic fireball is still flavour of the month!

Some inspired points

My issue is that I'm all for freedom of choice, but then I don't seem to have the freedom to escape from other peoples' vaping backdraft and it makes me feel really rough, in the same way as air fresheners, some perfumes and most scented candles...

[Aspman]

Vaping seems to be a good way to quit. I suppose because is mimiks the action of smoking so much.

 

Filling your lungs with vaporised glycerine and other chemicals isn't going to be good for you, but it'll be a lot less bad than the cofffin nails.

 

I wouldn't say having a vape cloud drift over you is nice but again it's a lot less unpleasent than cig smoke.