The technology in modern cars is the basis of the 4WD/AWD 

http://www.unsealed4x4.com.au/issue033/?utm_source=ActiveCampaign&utm_medium=email&utm_content=(Links+Fixed)+The+Death+of+Low+Range&utm_campaign=Unsealed+4X4+Issue+033+-+Send+001+(resend)#66

People that need Offroaders to go offroad & that are reliable and easily fixable will keep using Old Tech because Electronics are not where it is at.

Those who need vehicles that can wade so can be water proofed and all weather proofed with simple engineering.

 

There will always need to be basic vehicles that have ability to do a job without costing a fortune.

Land Rovers 90 & 110 or even 130/150 are starting to have some crazy asking prices as they are getting bought up to be refurbished.

Older Nissan Patrols & Toyota Land Cruisers hopefully will be available for years to come.

Right on George!

You won't find the modern RRs in our High Country........unless he's a multi millionaire.

When I initially saw the thread title and the headline of the article, I was preparing for an article bashing the move away from transfer cases. But they make some good points on the topic.

 

9- and 10-speed gearboxes are available now: this is no different to a 2-speed transfer case on the back of a 5-speed gearbox. So if you can do it all inside one casing with fewer moving parts, why not. Lighter, more reliable, cheaper. Win all round.

 

I suspect there will continue to be a small market for mechanically simpler solutions for specialist applications (military, extreme environments, etc) which will fall to specialist suppliers. I think even the new Land Rover Defender won't suit this role any more from what I've seen of it.

10 minutes ago, chimaera said:

When I initially saw the thread title and the headline of the article, I was preparing for an article bashing the move away from transfer cases. But they make some good points on the topic.

 

9- and 10-speed gearboxes are available now: this is no different to a 2-speed transfer case on the back of a 5-speed gearbox. So if you can do it all inside one casing with fewer moving parts, why not. Lighter, more reliable, cheaper. Win all round.

 

I suspect there will continue to be a small market for mechanically simpler solutions for specialist applications (military, extreme environments, etc) which will fall to specialist suppliers. I think even the new Land Rover Defender won't suit this role any more from what I've seen of it.

The simple bash n crash vehicles like the old Nissan Patrols are our preferred mod choice.

11 hours ago, chimaera said:

When I initially saw the thread title and the headline of the article, I was preparing for an article bashing the move away from transfer cases. But they make some good points on the topic.

 

9- and 10-speed gearboxes are available now: this is no different to a 2-speed transfer case on the back of a 5-speed gearbox. So if you can do it all inside one casing with fewer moving parts, why not. Lighter, more reliable, cheaper. Win all round.

 

I suspect there will continue to be a small market for mechanically simpler solutions for specialist applications (military, extreme environments, etc) which will fall to specialist suppliers. I think even the new Land Rover Defender won't suit this role any more from what I've seen of it.

YHGBSM!! Just how many more times do you have to move the gear lever with a 10 speed?

Edited 6 February, 20179 yr by KenONeill
Typo

Obviously an auto and I guess the HDC/'low range' is 1st selected by a button to emulate it.

The Forester Mk1-3 had a low range selector. My Mk4 doesn't but it has a dedicated off-road mode instead, which changes the CVT, throttle, diff and brake behaviour massively, partly in a way that makes it feel like a row range. Its obviously not a dedicated off-roader but I found it very competent in muddy fields and woodland. Technology has moved on and new ways of doing things have come along.

& are not yet reliable enough or fixable where there is no Dealership, Technician or Mobile Phone / Internet Connection.

 

Suzuki Jimny Automatics had a Manual Transfer Box Shifter then the Push Button Electronic Transfer box was introduced and that was one to avoid.

Over 10 years ago that happened.

Even now Skoda / VW do Haldex Units that can not cope with H20.  

Sealing from H20 yet having breathers still matters.    

 

Many especially VW have not yet sussed H20 & Electrics together in perfect harmony and corrosion free.

 

Muddy fields and loose surfaces are not where low gearing and traction might matter most, 

it is when you start descending and you get that 'Oh sh!t' moments and you remember, keep your feet away from the brakes. 

let the vehicle do the job, you have Hill Descent Control & an Off Road Button. Ye right, not everyplace is a purpose built offroad test centre with prepared tracks and routes graded.

 

Sometimes you might be lucky and there is still a Hand Brake or Transmission Brake and you can do what we used to do in Trials with old AWD's which was apply a bit of handbrake...or give it a bit more throttle until the tyres start turning and gain control rather than the vehicle becoming a sledge.

Edited 6 February, 20179 yr by Offski

It's all part of the general dumbing down going on everywhere.  An old fashioned vehicle with a driver who knows what they are about will see off modern tech.  Most drivers don't know what they are actually doing so will welcome the tech to make them look good.  The ultimate is an electric transmission with all wheels fitted with individual motors for ultimate control until it goes wrong (and it will).  At that point an early Land Rover / Land Cruiser / Jeep suddenly looks like a good idea.  Let's see you fix a problem with the hill descent system with a big hammer and baler twine!

What exactly is the wading depth of a five year old electronic AWD?.

Mechanical systems will continue to be replaced with electronics as it is cheaper to build and in numerous cases these systems are good enough for the standard buyer and in some cases better. Very few people actually need to use their vehicles in a situation where low range would make a difference so it doesn't make sense to load up standard vehicles with it.

 

I see the point about mechanical systems being fixable with a hammer in the field, but on the flip side, each additional mechanical system is an additional piece of hardware that wears out and needs maintenance. EDLs and hill descent control systems are nothing more than a programmable extension of a simple ABS module. So while harder to fix (and by fix, that generally means connect a laptop to it rather than spannering), it has a lot lower chance of breaking. The 'low range' on my Subaru is a throttle, CVT and engine map. It's not likely to break in the field without a total drivetrain failure. Whether its as capable as a Jimny, well, I doubt it, certainly not one that has been modified heavily, but then I don't need it to be and I don't believe it was designed to be.

 

You've highlighted I don't really know what I'm talking about as I've not done anything serious off road in it, but I did give my car to someone who regularly uses a proper offroader as they work in the place I had a play about and they were impressed with how my 'road car' handled the terrain we took it on. My ego didn't let me ask him to clarify if by impressed he expected it to immediately get stuck or whether it matched the capabilities he required for his job

 

I have no doubt that like anything else, someone will continue to provide for a specialist market, but for the standard consumer, lighter, cheaper, simpler electronics are a better choice. Low range is not dead in general, its probably just going to vanish from the consumer market.

Edited 7 February, 20179 yr by Huskoda

All our new cars have to have ESP/DSC which is the electronics basis for so much the makes a modern AWD.

I would be happy with one of these for daily use and a Unimog for offroad.

 

Edited 7 February, 20179 yr by Offski