Best oil for CUNA engine?

[Genoa1893]

HI all,

being old school, long before first mandatory oil change I think of exchanging my oil having less than 5000Km.

 

Given VW50x, and the fact that IIRC Skoda officially recommends Castrol EDGE 5W-30 LL, does anybody know if there is a better quality oil available (e.g. motul 8100 x-clean+, or.....)?

 

 

 

 

[BATVANVRS]

I've seen a few people use different brands of oil being Liqui Moly, Millers Nanodrive, Motul but personally I find nothing wrong with the Quantum oil (now made by Fuchs) or the Castrol oil, my vRS petrol has an oil change every year to Castrol 5w-30 & I only do between 6000-7000 miles a year at a push.

 

As the other brands mentioned above so folks will or probably use 5w-40 but most of us that have a petrol vRS will just use either Castrol or Quantum 5w-30.

 

The choice is yours but either won't harm if your going to be dropping the oil on a fixed service schedule or before. 

[Ootohere]

For a TDI Euro 6 it is VW 504 / 507 spec you want,

so that is 5w 30 FS Long Life. 

 the Brand does not matter and being Castrol does not matter either.

 

New Euro 6d temp is VW 508/509 that is recommended, 0w 20 FS LL, that does not make it 'Better oil'.

 

The car left the factory with good oil for a new engine and to be changed at 9,400 miles or even 18,000-20,000.

Changing oil & filter at 9,400 miles might be simply clever.

?

What is old school about changing oil in 3,000 miles with a new car or a used one, it is just not giving the engine a chance to 'drive in'

& spending money for no reason really IMO Unless maybe a race engine.

Decades ago Diesels had a 3,000 mile Service / Oil & filter change Interval & Petrols 6,000 miles.

First service at 1,000 miles or maybe 500. Decoking of heads, grinding in valves, re-torque head after 500 miles etc.

Oils have changed and engines in 40 plus years.

Edited 6 October, 2018 by Offski

[shyVRS245]

21 minutes ago, BATVANVRS said:

I've seen a few people use different brands of oil being Liqui Moly, Millers Nanodrive, Motul but personally I find nothing wrong with the Quantum oil (now made by Fuchs) or the Castrol oil, my vRS petrol has an oil change every year to Castrol 5w-30 & I only do between 6000-7000 miles a year at a push.

 

As the other brands mentioned above so folks will or probably use 5w-40 but most of us that have a petrol vRS will just use either Castrol or Quantum 5w-30.

 

The choice is yours but either won't harm if your going to be dropping the oil on a fixed service schedule or before. 

Agree happy with the Castrol Edge Long Life in my petrol VRS. Only £12 per litre from the Skoda dealer, why would they recommend it if it was not up to the job?

[Genoa1893]

Guys, I'm not saying Castrol isn't fine, just was interested in your first hand experience (if any) with supposed better quality oils.

 

@Offski Don't know if you are interested, and it depends on how you care for your engine, but there are definitely differences among oils - and - if you look at the color of oil in diesel engines after a few mile (easy to check on your dipstick), you will perhaps change idea about the opportunity to change it more frequently. If there is engine break-in (and in my world, there is also in mowadays engines), the thin metal debris will keep circulating. Thanks anyway for your thoughts, but I rest on my not "clever" idea.

 

@shyVRS245...because of commercial agreements, first of all , then because in the end it doesn't harm. This doesn't mean it is the best choice

 

[Ootohere]

Genoa1893,  are you telling me that there are Engine oils for diesels that are not black after 5,000 km?

I am interested which is why when i started as an apprentice mechanic we changed oil in diesels every 30,000 miles. Over 4 decades ago.

 

Why do French Manufacturers recommend Total, or Japanese there own oil or Mobile.

Why have German Manufacturers of engines the worst reliability of engines out of Warranty and only give 2 or 3 year Warranties?

 

Here is what VW / SEAT's Factory oil looks like after a year and before a variable service when a Dealership says it is not getting changed yet under a Service Plan .

But then it looked like that after 500 miles, and the same after the Oil and Filter change 100 miles later.

 

PS.

shyVRS245, in your TSI i would not be running the Recommended oil, maybe with your Remapped TSI you should think again and move on from 5w 30 FS LL even if doing Fixed Services.  Vorsprung Durch Technik.  Better Oil & Better Spark Plugs...

 

If you want nice clean / golden engine oil get a Petrol Engine, 

& if you want the risk of buying lots of oil get a Euro 5 1.2, 1.4, 1.8 or 2.0 TSI and give it VW;s recommended Long Life Oil.

Or remap one and use it and have higher Oil temps than you could have with other than 5w 30 FS LL.

Edited 6 October, 2018 by Offski

[BATVANVRS]

2 hours ago, Offski said:

If you want nice clean / golden engine oil get a Petrol Engine, 

& if you want the risk of buying lots of oil get a Euro 5 1.2, 1.4, 1.8 or 2.0 TSI and give it VW;s recommended Long Life Oil.

Or remap one and use it and have higher Oil temps than you could have with other than 5w 30 FS LL.

 

I haven't seen any warranty or engine fails on any vRS mk3 within or outside warranty? I ain’t seen any threads on here either! Maybe I’m missing something? Maybe I’m not looking in the right place, I’m not doubting what your saying Offski, I do understand what your explaining & it does make sense if that is the case but I use 5w-30 Castrol on my vRS 2.0T remapped stage 1 & I’ve seen my oil temps stay between 98-108 depending on driving conditions etc, which to me seems pretty decent.

My car does sometimes require a top up of oil during the 12 months but that’s me checking my oil & keeping it where I like the level to be on my dipstick.

Unless I had a car burning oil like mad or if I was doing pure race track days a lot then I would potentially look to use 5w-40 maybe even a Ester oil? But seeing that I drop the oil every year 6000-7000 (max) miles surely 5w-30 even if you was remapped to stage 2 would be fine? Unless oil consumption is an issue?

 

[shyVRS245]

9 hours ago, Offski said:

Genoa1893,  are you telling me that there are Engine oils for diesels that are not black after 5,000 km?

I am interested which is why when i started as an apprentice mechanic we changed oil in diesels every 30,000 miles. Over 4 decades ago.

 

Why do French Manufacturers recommend Total, or Japanese there own oil or Mobile.

Why have German Manufacturers of engines the worst reliability of engines out of Warranty and only give 2 or 3 year Warranties?

 

Here is what VW / SEAT's Factory oil looks like after a year and before a variable service when a Dealership says it is not getting changed yet under a Service Plan .

But then it looked like that after 500 miles, and the same after the Oil and Filter change 100 miles later.

 

PS.

shyVRS245, in your TSI i would not be running the Recommended oil, maybe with your Remapped TSI you should think again and move on from 5w 30 FS LL even if doing Fixed Services.  Vorsprung Durch Technik.  Better Oil & Better Spark Plugs...

 

If you want nice clean / golden engine oil get a Petrol Engine, 

& if you want the risk of buying lots of oil get a Euro 5 1.2, 1.4, 1.8 or 2.0 TSI and give it VW;s recommended Long Life Oil.

Or remap one and use it and have higher Oil temps than you could have with other than 5w 30 FS LL.

Audi RS3 coil packs, RS7 spark plugs and oil cooler will be fitted in the next twelve months don't worry.

[Genoa1893]

18 hours ago, Offski said:

Genoa1893,  are you telling me that there are Engine oils for diesels that are not black after 5,000 km?

I am interested which is why when i started as an apprentice mechanic we changed oil in diesels every 30,000 miles. Over 4 decades ago.

 

Are you kidding? No, I didn't say that. I told that since oil does get dirty black after jusy a few miles and since is the first oil put in the engine, I want to change it sooner AND I asked for first hand knowledge or experience with supposed better performing oils.

 

Don't see the reason why you posted all of that pictures since the point that oil gets black in diesels is well known and I bet it's pretty well known that oil in petrol is generally cleaner (at around the same mileage).

 

Anyway don't want to turn this in a one to one discussion. I'm not saying you have to change your oil sooner, but asking for opinion on oils.

[BATVANVRS]

@Genoa1893 I would just stick to the Quantum or Castrol oil they are perfectly fine  Don't get me wrong the brands mentioned above probably will be of better quality but with that comes a bigger price & being a Diesel (as the oil gets blacker far quicker) It's perfectly fine for Petrol boys so you will just be spending a lot of money, you will be better off buying the Quantum or Castrol & dropping that twice a year (if you wish) & you will still be saving money, seeing you can get Quantum or Castrol for around £20-£25 (5 litre bottles) from the Briskoda parts section.

 

But if you want better quality oil (so to speak) then PM @oilman oil's https://www.opieoils.co.uk/

 

EDIT: I use to use Mobil 1 oil in my old Astra 1.9cdti 16v (08) & that oil was perfectly good but I could of used the GM oil which is also perfectly fine too (Basically I only used the Mobil 1 because that was the 1st oil from my service book that was used in the Astra so I just continued to use that)

Edited 7 October, 2018 by BATVANVRS

[Genoa1893]

@BATVANVRS Thanks for your genuine opinion and great suggestion about the Briskoda parts section. I was just reading opieoils and looking at that Motul.

 

I'm perfectly fine when I'm told that different oils may result very similarly (this is a forum, and I asked for feedback and opinion, not to hear "Yes, you're wright") but any chemical engineer will laugh at sentences negating the sometimes huge differences among oils, although complying to same standards.

 

Thanks for sharing

[Ootohere]

There are huge differences in oil, and engines and environments around the world.

 

You are asking about a Euro 6 TDI vRS though with a DPF,  and the oils really make little difference if any,  correct temp range, correct spec.

There are millions of these engines running just fine on whatever oil they get at services.

 

If you want to look at what Volkswagen Group are now using maybe look at VW 509 00  / 0w 20 FS LL.

That is what they are now bigging up. They say not necessary to use on the engines that they never filled it to at the factory though.

 

Remember the Haldex Oil needs regular servicing, that is not the best of stuff for a long life.

[BATVANVRS]

8 minutes ago, Genoa1893 said:

@BATVANVRS Thanks for your genuine opinion and great suggestion about the Briskoda parts section. I was just reading opieoils and looking at that Motul.

 

I'm perfectly fine when I'm told that different oils may result very similarly (this is a forum, and I asked for feedback and opinion, not to hear "Yes, you're wright") but any chemical engineer will laugh at sentences negating the sometimes huge differences among oils, although complying to same standards.

 

Thanks for sharing

 

No worries bud  Listen I do agree with Offski to a certain amount of degree in what he is saying about using 5w-40, I fully understand the better benefits for engines etc (Heck I've just had a service, I might even try the 5w-40 on my next year's service, just to see whats what & monitor engine temps & see how the vRS runs on it) but a lot of folks being a mk3 vRS petrol or Diesel, remapped or not, still use the 5w-30 & to be honest I've not seen or heard of any mk3 vRS failing because of 5w-30 oil was used! Most important thing I personally would say if using a 5w-30 or 5w-40 is just make sure it meets the spec as Paul Barrett from Deutsche auto-parts recommends below:

 

"Make sure you are using oil that meets the required spec.  As per the owners manual you can use 5w-30 or 5w-40 but the oil must meet the required Volkswagen Spec of "VW 502 00".  All of our MK7 GTI maintenance kits include oil that meets or exceeds this spec"

 

What Oil weight do I need to use in my VW 2.0t TSI GTI?

On most VW models, including the MK6 GTI, Oil weight (ie 5W40) is not as important as oil spec.  VW has specific oil spec requirments that must be met to be a valid oil.  This spec varies (see your owners manual for detail) but is generally VW502.00.  This is required to keep your engine running properly, but more importantly to maintain the warranty, or potentially warranty extensions that might exist.

 

Here are a few links

https://www.shopdap.com/blog/post/service-schedule-for-mk7-gti-2015-2016.html

https://www.shopdap.com/blog/post/service-schedule-for-vw-mk6-gti-2010-2014.html

 

I know I've shown petrol models via the links etc but you can use this as a guideline & then come to your own conclusion. 

[Ootohere]

^^^ We are off the point with the TSI's and hundreds of thousands of Euro 6 TSI even thousands of remapped will be just fine on 5w 30 FS LL as they do 70 mph / 90/ 100 mph maybe occasionally for some trips in the UK , or maybe some track time.

or flat out for awhile abroad.

 

We will only know how they are in 8 or 10 years after 8 or 10 years though.

Vorsprung Durch Technik.   Are they bothered about your keeper after it is 5 years old?

Edited 7 October, 2018 by Offski

[Genoa1893]

@Offski, thanks for raising up the haldex oil subject, I was thinking of refreshing it too ! About the specs, in my previous Octavia (PD170, CR150)  I always topped up and changed oil, staying within specs. I want an oil that protects my car when "stretching her legs", can't see the reason why save a couple quid on oil which is essential to car proper running, this at least IMO. And I agree with you I bet they are not bothered at all (that's why I don't necessarily trust factory recommendations, and can't trust at all Long Life)

 

@BATVANVRS If I read well, I think that 5w-40 would be a little too thick at "normal" ambient temperature, at least for a new engine. I fear it might impair engine fluidity, at some degree, at least.

 

Thanks for feedback

[Ootohere]

Who mentioned saving money, just not wasting it on un-necessary oil changes.  If you mean by changing oil less often then that is saving money maybe, 

as to oil prices that is not a matter of more expensive being better, and as for paying £12 a litre to a Main Dealers as shyVRS245 mentioned that is crazy.

(some want £17 a litre for VW508/509.)

 

You have no choice with a TDI but to be using long life oil, but every choice to not do Variable / Flexible or as some call it Long Life Servicing.

http://volkswagen.co.uk/owners/servicing/regimes

 

Edited 7 October, 2018 by Offski

[oilman]

On 07/10/2018 at 17:47, Genoa1893 said:

@Offski, thanks for raising up the haldex oil subject, I was thinking of refreshing it too ! About the specs, in my previous Octavia (PD170, CR150)  I always topped up and changed oil, staying within specs. I want an oil that protects my car when "stretching her legs", can't see the reason why save a couple quid on oil which is essential to car proper running, this at least IMO. And I agree with you I bet they are not bothered at all (that's why I don't necessarily trust factory recommendations, and can't trust at all Long Life)

 

@BATVANVRS If I read well, I think that 5w-40 would be a little too thick at "normal" ambient temperature, at least for a new engine. I fear it might impair engine fluidity, at some degree, at least.

 

Thanks for feedback

 

As long as you do not have one of the new 508.00/509.00 0w-20 engines 5w-40 is not too thick. It will be happy on either 5w-30 or 5w-40, in theory 5w-30 will give slightly better fuel economy and 5w-40 should reduce consumption if there is any. The differences are minimal though.

 

Cheers,

 

Guy

[Ootohere]

That is 5w-40 may reduce oil consumption or excessive oil consumption if there is any, 

and might suit the operating temperatures the vehicle / engine is running in.

& might have no affect adverse or otherwise on consumption.

But cooling oil uses energy, and if oil is cooler and is quicker to get back to Normal & Efficient operating temp, eg in the 92*oC range that can same fuel as much as using the likes 

of 0w 30 or 0w 20 to gets cars through the WLTP / RDE tests.

[oilman]

9 minutes ago, Offski said:

But cooling oil uses energy, and if oil is cooler and is quicker to get back to Normal & Efficient operating temp, eg in the 92*oC range that can same fuel as much as using the likes 

of 0w 30 or 0w 20 to gets cars through the WLTP / RDE tests.

 

Hi Offski,

 

Please can you explain this a bit more? I am not quite sure what it is you are saying.

Cheers,

 

Guy

[Ootohere]

I am saying, drive a TSI Engine, 1.2, 1.4,1.8 or 2.0 a bit sportingly, getting it hot, doing a bit of nipping about, remapping etc and maybe use some oil or not, 

then 5w 40 FS VW502 can have the engines oil working nicely, and not using any more petrol.

 

Toyota went Euro 5 and customers were complaining on the Fuel Consumption and then they changed oil in some engines from 5w 30 to 0w 30.

 

Others have over the years.

VW had Implausible C02 g/km in 2015/16 and had to change figures of emissions and EU Fuel Figures, then had to get WLTP results, 

in come VW 508/509 to get the Test Results.

 

Obviously new oils are needed for Hybrids, better oils, but as for 0w 20 and the likes, time will tell, and time will tell how many 'Oil Change' places even get that right.

[oilman]

Thanks, In other marques such as Honda 0w-20 has been used for sometime, they are now onto 0w-16 for their latest hybrid cars. All in the chase for fuel economy and emissions.

 

I have 0w-16 oils on the shelf and they are visibly thin to say the least!

 

Cheers,

 

Guy

[fabdavrav]

9 hours ago, oilman said:

Thanks, In other marques such as Honda 0w-20 has been used for sometime, they are now onto 0w-16 for their latest hybrid cars. All in the chase for fuel economy and emissions.

 

I have 0w-16 oils on the shelf and they are visibly thin to say the least!

 

Cheers,

 

Guy

0w16??

WTF???

 

I changed my CHPA from long service to short "502"...& used a 502 spec which happened to be Castrol edge titanium 0w40...way thinner than the 5w30 that had been in there..from the previous services..but the engine is nicely run in now...so all the "wear" was done using a thicker oil which is correct way to do it...

 

also did a can of wynns engine flush before I drained down the 5w30....& left  it for 2hrs...

 

Main thing on oil is get one which states it meets VW spec 502/504/etc...ie the correct spec for engine..then decide if you want the long life spec or the short life spec....the short life is always thinner & usually means a 0w can be used..this is better for colder engine starts...eg in winter..which I do..

 

[Ootohere]

^^^? WTF.

Are you saying that VW502 so 5w 40 FS is thinner oil than VW504 5w 30 FS Long Life?

 

?

You are in the UK in Scotland are you not and even at the coldest that will be -15*oC, so why the 0-40 FS?

Edited 10 October, 2018 by Offski

[fabdavrav]

3 minutes ago, Offski said:

^^^? WTF.

Are you saying that VW502 so 5w 40 FS is thinner oil than VW504 5w 30 FS Long Life?

 

the new 0w40 Castrol oil was visibly clearer....& thinner..less gloopy/..poured more like water....compared to the new 5w30 Castrol....which was more gloopy/thicker when pouring

[Ootohere]

You said,  "the short life is always thinner."   so not all short life the short life you got!