@GeneralPurpose

Your experience of the Momentum only bringing engines back to their original performance (or in the main) is rather strange and it is your experience, 

personally that is why i never really believe much of what you post

 

 

Tesco Momentum 99 is £2.25 a tank more than Tesco 95 Unleaded and the same as Shell FuelSave and other majors unleaded, 

so hardly more expensive long time compared to buying non supermarket Unleaded.

If the car runs cleaner, feels better, gets 1 or 2 MPG more or even no more it has cost an extra £2.25 max.

 

WLTP Approved / Certificated engines are less than a year old in the main and 1.0TSI ones will have GPF's.

?

Really is detergents for engine cleaning required to take them to the Maximum BHP / Nm Torque, which actually is the Minimum BHP / Nm Torque that should be getting produced at below 3000 ft above sea level in the UK, especially on a Dynometer with cooled air being blown at the intake.

 

They do actually benefit from 99 ron minimum, so a simple question, were you testing 2018 on VW 1.0 TSI's with 99 octane (ron) minimum petrol?

Were 1.5 TSI EVO engines tested?

Edited 24 July, 20196 yr by Roottootemoot

@GeneralPurpose

I had not spotted this post, interesting stuff indeed.

 

There is a Thread in Singletrack Forum on Super Unleaded and Small Capacity Engines that is saying much the same as you.

Typically awkward reply from you George! However, in response to your questions...

 

Yes 1.0TSI had a PPF/GPF.

Yes, cleaners & detergents are vital for max power testing.

No, 1.5TSI not tested.

 

Thanks for the vote of confidence George! Thankfully it doesn't matter if you believe me or not. Our findings for the tests we carried out have been replicated over and over by other engineers who like me actually undertake this type of work, rather than just read Google articles & post often difficult to understand replies. But it takes all sorts I guess.

 

But the best bit is, I'm now fully retired...again!...lol. Contract finished...yay!

7 minutes ago, Roottootemoot said:

@GeneralPurpose

I had not spotted this post, interesting stuff indeed.

 

There is a Thread in Singletrack Forum on Super Unleaded and Small Capacity Engines that is saying much the same as you.

Thanks George. Have a good un. 

At least you do lots of miles so your experience of fuel counts for something.

Bikes and cars and a couple of dodgy TSI's which finally you moved on from.

Yeah, it's been interesting. It's a shame we didn't meet a couple of weeks ago George. I was hoping we could have had lunch and I could have taken you to the next job I had (blueprinting a new engine) at one of our workshops in Scotland. It would have been the ideal time to try out the C4 in case you wanted it. But never mind.

 

My mileage in my own car is now going to plummet as I'm not going to be doing any more work, at all! I barely do 7,000 miles a year in normal driving. (probably at least that again though on my motorcycles). A nice easy life from now on I'm hoping. My wife is still recovering from a severe illness and spending several weeks in a London hospital at the start of the year, so it will be great to be with her more. As for you lot,..lol, I'll look in from time to time.

 

All the best George and keep helping people, you're good at that.

Sorry but i have no idea what you are talking about with the C4 or lunch.

I have driven C4's and been looking at them for a few years to get an accident damaged one to repair, then one from Motability but decided against that.

I read one of your posts where you said you liked them and were waiting for one to come up and you had your eye on a motorbility one. I posted to say that our 2018 was coming up for sale on an 18 plate with 18k+ on the clock. It was going at a great price due to higher mileage and was unmarked in white with every conceivable extra including EAT6 autobox. All I said was I had to come to Newcastle then up to Scotland for work and I could bring it with me for you to look at if interested. I'd hoped to have a meet etc. But my post was taken down as it was of course seen as me selling something (I'm not Freedom). You don't have your pm's turned on so that opportunity was lost. Never mind.

Thanks for that it was nice of you.

I was not looking to actually spend on a New Style C4 i like the bubble wrap one and it was to replace a Jimny and be a keeper, but really i needed something higher to get in and out easily while i wait to get my new EV.

Yeah, I like the bubble wrap ones too. Hope the EV purchase goes well.

13 hours ago, GeneralPurpose said:

Hello Paul, just been going through the figures. The 110ps TSI 1.0 engine showed 106.5ps at 250 miles. This increased to a maximum of 112.1ps at 2000 miles. This on 95 ron. Using 99 octane, power dropped to 107.9ps. Figs quoted are averages of 3 runs each. One should not forget that the power output of an engine varies from day to day depending on temps, humidity, fuel used, state of tune etc etc.

 

 

Hi GeneralPurpose, thank you very much  .

On 24/07/2019 at 07:44, GeneralPurpose said:

Our testing showed 95 and 97 Ron to be the best all round fuel for best power and fuel economy. Most euro 6+ cars didn't benefit in any way from higher octane fuels, with many actually having worse performance, albeit by just a little that many owners probably wouldn't notice in normal driving. In fact many owners would I'm sure tell you their cars actually go better! However, don't forget, the engine designers develop everyday car engines to run on mainstream 95 ron. This is the most commonly available fuel everywhere in all parts of the world where modern small cars are sold.

 

A while ago i stopped on the M1 as i probably wouldn't have made it home (needle on zero, 0 range estimate on the display)

Put in some V-Power 99, which was £1.65 per litre vs £1.60 for normal (damn motorway ripoffs!), since i only put about £10 in i figured why not?

 

I found;

Engine braking was reduced (less friction).

Low end torque felt marginally better.

Ever so slightly more responsive.

Engine ran a lot smoother and a little quieter overall.

Top end power felt ever so slightly lacking.

 

Obiously that's no scientific test, but there was a large difference in engine smoothness and engine braking, clearly at least the detergents were doing something!

From reading elsewhere about premium fuels, it's only ever really worth it for the detergents.

Seemed to coast with no throttle damn near forever!

 

As i mostly run on the cheapest supermarket petrol i can get my skint lil' hands on, when i get chance i do put in proper branded fuel for the better detergents, but not the high-octane stuff, unless the price difference is very low (unusual), as it's not worth it.

@FabiaGonzales

Really less engine braking just with some Super Unleaded in!

 

When you use 102ron like Hiperflo 250 it has not got the detergents just the Octane

 

 

The higher cetane diesel with might be called Premium Diesel.

 

As to the likes of 95 Unleaded Shel Fuelsave, BP unleaded, Texaco Unleaded, Esso Unleaded you are not getting anything special 'Detegent' wise from the 95 Unleaded 

at Morrisons, Tesco, Asda & why would you need it.

 

Super Unleaded is about Octane and the Detergents are not special between Shell V-Power, Tesco Momentum 99 or Costco 99, or Sainsbury 97, BP 97, Esso 97, Gulf 99.

 

Slight correction needed there, Costco is now 97.

Noticed that rum4mo.

 

A while ago the Shell guys told me that when they analysed BP 95 ron, it had similar quality first grade cleaners and detergents in it to the Shell 97 ron. Most 95 ron supermarket petrols apparently still have less aggressive cleaners in them, but these are better fuels than they used to be even from just  6-8 years ago. My lot didn't test the latest petrols for cleaners because we didn't use branded petrol for our power testing. It was good honest generic untreated 95ron or 97ron petrol with our own first grade cleaners added, and no other additives such as you would get from buying good branded petrol. It was done this way for lots of test reasons. So there is still a benefit from buying good branded petrol from the big guys it seems. I suspect that the benefit is slightly less now over what it was 6-8 years ago though because of the way modern engines burn fuel and the need for very high grade cleaners in them to keep valves clean.

 

@GeneralPurpose

Which country is this Shell 97 ron from? & is this BP Unleaded in the UK as they do different fuels globally.

 

http://wikipedia.org/wiki/Shell_V-Power

In the UK Shell Super Unleaded was 98 ron (minimum)  until reformulated and renamed Shell V-Power & then again as Shell V-Power Nitro + which is 99 ron minimum in the UK.

 

http://costco.co.uk/kirkland-signature-fuel

http://costco.co.uk/fuel-q-and-a

 

 

Edited 31 July, 20196 yr by Roottootemoot

In the UK near me its actually cheaper to stick Sainsbury's 97 ron super unleaded in the car than branded 95. I intend to stick a tank of shell v power in it once or twice a year for the extra cleaning. Unfortunately I can't find out what's in Sainsbury's super unleaded but the 1.0 tsi seems to run well on it.

Just the same as in the other Super Unleaded 97 rons in the UK and not the octane booster that makes the other 2 99 ron.

Sometimes the Sainsbury is the same as 99 ron as that is the minimum octane it has to be.

 

Really if these Fuel Producers, whole sellers and retailers had something special to show as to cleaning properties and increased fuel efficiency they would do side by side testing and give the results and not leave it to the likes of Fifth Gear to do.

 

Those that run large fleets of vehicles surely know what 95 ron in the UK would be most economic for their drivers to use.

As with diesel, billions of litres used annually from all different depots, pumps, brands.

 

Actually there are quite a lot of tests on shell v power's cleaning ability relative to other fuels.

 

We were not talking 'Cheap' Gas, as in the UK what you get is 'Gas' that might be less expensive than more expensive, but all to a standard, and often sourced from the cheapest source / supplier by retailers.

 

Then 95 unleaded, and is one different from another or Super Unleaded @97 ron or Super Unleaded @ 99 ron.

Do Royal Dutch Shell have a superior Additive Package in the fuel that they import with their partners Greenergy that produce and sell Momentum 99.

Or do BP, Esso or Gulf put in better additives in 95 than what Morrisons, Asda, Tesco, Sainsbury, or in the 97ron?

 

Below was published in 2012.

Edited 1 August, 20196 yr by Roottootemoot

So after making this post i switched to Shell Fuel save instead of using V-Power My results where i seemed to get better mpg and the car WAS for sure smoother or umm less grunty? not sure if that means less power but it seems to accererlate better too, i felt like there was often delays in the throttle with v-power where this does not seem to be as bad. gonna try another tank after this 1 see if its any different again. 

 

where i live is extremely hilly everywhere i go is cold starts up a hill so my mpg is terrible if my mrs is just using it for her 3 mile commute. (like 29 mpg)  still trying to keep my mind open to either fuel

@seanhan12345

It would be handy if you said which power of 1.0tsi you have and is it pre or post GPF.  Also when was it built and how many miles has it done?

1 minute ago, Roottootemoot said:

@seanhan12345

It would be handy if you said which power of 1.0tsi you have and is it pre or post GPF.  Also when was it built and how many miles has it done?

 

Certainly. 1.0 tsi 110 Dsg 2017 model i think its pre GPF (almost certain) and i'm currenty on 20500 miles i've done 275 miles in current tank with an average of 52 mpg. just under half left (took a trip to skeg)

These days you would be lucky to get 100% petrol

Probably in a 40 litre fill are getting 36-38 litres of petrol and the other 2-4 litres as bio-ethanol

 

In theory, not a problem as all EU engines are designed to run on upto 10% bio-fuel

 

However the biofuel is much harder to store, so a fuel station with poor tanks is more likely to cause it to deteriorate, it has a much shorter storage period.

 

I started using premium Diesel in my Yeti and it did reduce the incidence of DPF regeneration.

I use premium petrol in my new Fabia 1L tsi 110ps I don't do a high milage, so I figure, use low ash

fuel and oil in this highly stressed little motor. I did the same in a 1L Micra overhead cam engine.