I am getting a juddering at the bike point in first gear. No slipping though, and wondering is it the clutch or flywheel? (2015, 80k)

 

Anyone had these replaced? Is the general advice to get the flywheel changed at the same time while working on the gear box?

Most likely will be a flywheel starting to fall apart.

replace clutch and flywheel together, I know it’s not the cheapest of parts but it’s worth it rather than doing a job twice

I have never known a DMF flywheel to fall apart, clonk, rattle & vibrate yes but not fall apart, however the Sachs pressure plates of that era are well known for it.

 

I do agree that when doing the job both the clutch and DMF should be replaced at the same time, my Luk kit cost £280 delivered.

 

The OP should not wait for the situation to develop, if it is the pressure plate it will be cutting its way through the gearbox casing.

are you describing this sound? 

https://youtu.be/wvynDD57Xio?t=26

Is it always juddering in first gear or is it when the car is first used? - I've known condensation cause a bit of judder first drive in a morning on a previous car. Also - any sign of an oil leak or hydraulic fluid leak?

 

I would have thought that DMF failure would be not as likely on an 80k 1.4tsi as the engine has much less torque compared to the bigger diesel versions - never say never though.

 

 

I've been thinking about this. I think my older mkII Superb EA111 1.4tsi 125ps is fitted with a Single Mass Flywheel and I presumed the later more powerful manual mkIII Superb EA211 1.4tsi had a Dual Mass Flywheel. After a bit of research I'm now not convinced :- https://www.skoda-parts.com/spare-part/03c105269p-flywheel-32125.html. Also I now believe the clutch slave cylinder is external on the 1.4tsi models so unlikely to be a hydraulic fluid leak issue. 

 

Probably unrelated but my previous mkI Superb 1.9pd  (owned from 18 months old) had a bit of clutch judder first thing in a morning just after a service that went away after a few miles. In addition the oil level on the dipstick dropped fairly quickly down to half way then remained there until the next service. It was almost as if when full on the dipstick it was too full. When out of warranty and I moved servicing / maintenance to my local indy I asked them to slightly underfill when it was serviced I never had clutch judder again. I do wonder if there was a crank rear oil seal weep although it did it from nearly new.  

Edited 23 April, 20224 yr by bigjohn

Thanks folks, still not sure the best course of action. Yesterday the clutch pedal stuck to the floor, had to lift it up with my foot and since then has behaved. Not sure what that was about but maybe linked to the erratic juddering? 

 

Could be master or slave cylinder too, a bit befuddled at this stage!

41 minutes ago, Steviedakota said:

Thanks folks, still not sure the best course of action. Yesterday the clutch pedal stuck to the floor, had to lift it up with my foot and since then has behaved. Not sure what that was about but maybe linked to the erratic juddering? 

 

Could be master or slave cylinder too, a bit befuddled at this stage!

 

Not wanting to be a doom monger but when my Vx pedal stuck to the floor the clutch/DMF needed replacing about 6 weeks later.

I'm kind of preparing myself for this eventuality!

On 01/05/2022 at 22:50, Steviedakota said:

Thanks folks, still not sure the best course of action. Yesterday the clutch pedal stuck to the floor, had to lift it up with my foot and since then has behaved. Not sure what that was about but maybe linked to the erratic juddering? 

 

Could be master or slave cylinder too, a bit befuddled at this stage!

 

Possibly a clue!

 

Is it fitted with an external clutch slave cylinder(on top of gearbox outside bellhousing)? or is it concentric (inside the bellhousing)?

 

If it's an external slave - change this FIRST as it's a cheap job. They have a "protection valve" to protect the clutch from too rapid a release - I've known this on another make of car fail causing the pedal to stick to the floor(when hot in that case). If it's playing up I suppose it could cause judder.

 

External will look something like this (follow hydraulic pipes to check):-

 

 

Edited 7 May, 20224 yr by bigjohn

The internal concentric slave cylinders(on the 6 speed gearboxes at least) have the same peak torque limiter valve AKA clutch bleed block although it is located externally and clips on to the inlet stub of the internal concentric cylinder.

 

Equally easy to change, cheap and I agree, definitely something to be ruled out first.

12 hours ago, J.R. said:

The internal concentric slave cylinders(on the 6 speed gearboxes at least) have the same peak torque limiter valve AKA clutch bleed block although it is located externally and clips on to the inlet stub of the internal concentric cylinder.

 

Equally easy to change, cheap and I agree, definitely something to be ruled out first.

 

On the mkII the 1.4tsi 6 speed has an external slave, not sure re the mkIII. Eurocarparts lists both types.

 

But as you say it needs ruling out. The car we had this valve fail on was actually a Fiat Panda! After being stuck in traffic Mrs BJ ended up stranded with the clutch pedal stuck to the floor.  Replacement slave cylinder/ valve assembly restored normal service - infact the clutch was transformed so must have been on the way out for a while.

 

 

I don't like them, its another bit of complication that can go wrong and makes it impossible to modulate the throttle and clutch when you do need to make a speedy standing start say across a junction in a gap between oncoming traffic. It can also slip when upchanging if you are using full acceleration making use of the power band, if overtaking and perhaps you have not left quite as much room as you thought for the manouvre that is exactly when you would make a faster than normal gearchange.

 

VAG would rather the clutch burnt out than have a gearbox failure and their vehicles do not perform as they should when you most need them to.

 

I modified one of mine by drilling out the return restrictor valve, the clutch feel was much better but I replaced it with a new standard one while I was ruling out all the possibilities before having to replace my DMF, Clutch & slave cylinder, with all new parts I thought it best to leave it as standard, I'm beginning to wonder now.

Thanks for the replies guys, super helpful. Looks like mine is external thank goodness, had a feel around it and no sign of any leaking. 

 

The clutch hasn't stuck to the floor since that one time but still getting the intermittent juddering, so is the thinking that this is probably a good place to start?

 

Interestingly I had a Passat with the same engine a few years ago and and had the the slave fail in the first year of ownership. In that case the pedal went to the floor and never came back.

5 hours ago, Steviedakota said:

. 

so is the thinking that this is probably a good place to start?

 

 

Yes, I'd say so. Especially as it's a cheap job. 🍀

 

Edited 9 May, 20224 yr by bigjohn