I have a 2017 1.0 MPi Fabia and it’s a great little car, but, it can be very reluctant to go into first or reverse gear. It doesn’t make much difference if it’s hot or cold, and sometimes it goes into gear very easily, especially if the engine has just been started. If I go in and out of a couple of other gears I can get around green problem but this isn’t ideal in stop start traffic etc. Many thanks for any help

A quick thought, if it's a manual gearbox, is that the cables from lever to box might need sorting, videos and info around.

 

Also if the idle revs are too high perhaps, then of course there's clutch and other issues, operation of gear lever (particularly if not manual box), I  doubt it's the gearbox itself (unless DSG/auto perhaps) but if you put which gearbox it is or look for problems on that gearbox if required.  Does your model have anything like dual mass flywheel, dual clutch or other exotic stuff.

 

Also do a search as there might be the other issues around this covered in previous threads for Fabia Mk3 but I can't remember the details.

 

All being well someone else will be along with more relevant info and knows the models more but more information about your gearbox. clutch, transmission might be also useful to them.

 

Good luck.

 

Thanks Nigel

thats a good point, yes it is a manual gearbox, I didn’t realise they made automatics, I bet they’re interesting to drive. I did try searching on here before posting and found a couple of threads that hadn’t been answered. If it was the cables would it still be difficult without having the engine running because it’s easy to go through the gears with the engine switched off. The tick over isn’t high but I’m not sure if the flywheel is dual mass I’ve always thought they were reserved for diesels. By the way that looks like a very nice Estelle. Cheers Tony

Tony, I'm (almost) sure(?) there was something about this before, perhaps it wasn't in the Fabia Mk3 forum, when others see this thread they'll probably have chapter and verse on it.  In the meantime if you want to clarify more. 

 

5 or 6 speed manual?  Where is reverse position with the gearstick in relation to reverse?

 

Have you had the car from new?  How long  have you had this difficulty?  How often does it happen?  Does anyone else who drives the car report this issue?

 

It depends on what and how you like to drive if DSG autos might be interesting to you, I've never driven one other than a smart at the turn of the century.  If you've  a 6 speed manual the gearing is so low you might as well have an auto box I think, save all the VW computer programs pestering whilst you're supposed to be driving but they want to tell you how to drive, like a nervous and interfering passenger, well to me anyway. 🙂

 

With the engine running you have moving parts so things could become more awkward.

 

In the old days (when it was all fields around here) you'd check the box oil level and perhaps clutch operation or even gear lever rubber rubber grommet or anti-tizz springs cup but now there's so much more including all that's needed for the various computer programs.

 

I'm very unusual here, and other places, but particularly here because I'm not a VW fan (Golf Mk1 GTi being the exception) and find in my very limited experience of VW engines they sound badger's bottom rough and the manual Fabia 2015 5-speed gearbox and 2023 6-speed gearboxes to be a clunky feel of shift, decidedly family car, I don't rush a gear change and make sure the clutch pedal is fully depressed and not pressed or lifted too quickly and foot fully off accelerator pedal.  I have found reverse can take a little bit of rolling to get it on cog more than other cars I've driven but can't think of any issues getting 1st.

 

Thanks for the comment on the Skoda 130 Coupe, unfortunately the photo is from 1986/7, before becoming a VW brand and the Skoda Dealerships were small friendly backstreet garages and not the Velcro name badge places of today.

 

Tony, as the last time I put such a suggestion it caused some posters here some upset I'll put - this is what I might do if the car is mine and out of warranty and I thought it wasn't cable adjustment and if it's easy to get the gear lever cover off or out of the way.  As the gear lever mech tends to be VW fantastic plastic of some sort I would see what movements there are from going from neutral to 1st and neutral to reverse and I would treat these areas with a careful little spray of lubricant and work that in by constantly selecting those gears a good number of times.  If it worked I'd be happy, if it didn't I'd have wasted a bit of time, effort and spray.

 

You and others may not agree, want or bother with the idea and that's fine ,it's just what I might try as I loathe farting about with my own car and want a quick easy thing to try and I don't really fully trust most at Dealerships and garages.  The lubricant can be whatever is suitable or personal choice.  I'd avoid WD-40 Multi-Use as it's not a long lasting lubricant and would use GT85 (or a silicone spray I'd run out of GT85 by using it on stuff I do for neighbours).

 

https://gt85.co.uk/

 

Release the hounds. 😁 

Thanks for your suggestions Nigel, I have tried lubricating the linkages to no avail. In reply to your earlier questions it's a five speed with reverse next to fourth gear. I have tried a few things this week to see what makes the gear selections easier.

At the traffic lights I tend to keep the car in neutral and I select first just before setting off, if this is rushed the first gear is hard to select, but if the clutch is depressed in advance by a few seconds to allow the gears to slow down it is easier, to get around the problem another gear can be selected before first which makes this a lot easier. Third then first is better than second then first, presumably because both first and third are in the same direction for the gear lever, when selecting reverse this is made easier by selecting fourth gear beforehand, also same direction of travel. I think a different grade of gear oil would help but need to know which grade is best. When the engine isn't running all the gears select  easily.

Yes going in different gears before might help, making sure the revs are right down to idle especially for reverse, sometimes letting the car roll forward or back a very small amount can help for first.  Pushing the clutch down twice before selecting gear might help too, bit hit and miss if i's "off cog".

 

2 hours ago, montecarlo said:

I think a different grade of gear oil would help but need to know which grade is best. When the engine isn't running all the gears select  easily.

Probably not a different grade but wider grade and better quality oil might help when the gearbox is very cold or warm/hot - but these may be very marginal differences if your existing gear oil is at correct level and good condition.   Any change in gearbox oil you notice will be pure placebo, any mechanical engineer will tell you this and they are never wrong, as they will always tell you. 😄  They are why travelling Encyclopaedia salesmen went out of business, if you know the old joke.

 

Tony,  I change the gearbox oil on my wife's 2015 Fabia at 5 1/2 years old and 38k-miles and she said she did notice the difference and we've been together far too many decades for her to say anything just to please me.  If I was you I'd go for something very good like Millers EE Performance MTF 75W "Fully synthetic gear oil with ester technology".  It will protect more and for longer.  Look for it selling at lower price somewhere.  As the box appears to have a 1.1 litre refill you could either go for one 1-litre bottle as residue oil is always left in the box, or go for two 1-litre bottles and use some of the second botte (warmed in water or left out in the sun on a warm day on warm tarmac or concreate) as a  good rinse-flush after the last drops of existing oil has drained.  I found the gearbox overfilled I presumed from factory so if yours is the same with plenty left in a second bottle you could if you want to and wanted to go to the bother overfill again but I'd not bother, perhaps the overfill makes selecting gears more difficult.  🤣

 

Millers EE Performance MTF 75W "Fully synthetic gear oil with ester technology" - https://www.millersoils.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/8327.pdf

 

If you do an oil change get the gear oil warm/hot before draining, leave to drain to drops, warm flush-rinse oil if you want, always check you can fully remove the fill plug before you remove the drain plug for obvious reasons.  But like forgetting to put the engine oil drain plug back in and torqued before putting fresh oi in these mistakes do happen.  On my wife's Fabia the fill and drain plugs were close to each other in position of both depth and proximity.  The fill plug was a PITA to get at with the tools I had available.  I don't have a pressure filler so I used an always very relucent "glamorous assistant" to till the gearbox from the engine bay using a funnel and garden hose off-cut whilst I laid under the car making sure the 1/2" pipe stayed in the filler hole and to shout stop when the oil started coming out.  I also have to take the plastic under-shield off and put it back on which is always a PITA thing for me, I am always a very reluctant "mechanic" on my cars or this VW product (simple jobs on neighbour's cars a lot less so).   

 

Whether you do an oil change or not let us know how you get on.

 

I had the gearbox oil replaced with Napa 75W-80 MTF oil and Wynns transmission treatment additive. It did make some difference but selecting first was still difficult. After waiting about 200 miles to see if the effect of the oil change got any better, and it didn’t, I decided to check the adjustment of the gear change cables, I also lubricated the connections of the cables and the base of the gear lever, this seems to have made a small improvement but I think I will have to resign myself to selecting third before first when it doesn’t want to go into first gear. I have noticed that if I try to put the gear lever into first as I am pressing the clutch down this helps, as does selecting first when the car is still slightly moving, which suggests to me that it might be a synchromesh problem although it never crunches into gear so maybe it’s just hydraulic pressure. Who knows!

4 hours ago, montecarlo said:

Napa 75W-80 MTF oil and Wynns transmission treatment additive.

I've now used Millers EE Performance MTF 75W "Fully synthetic gear oil with ester technology" a noticeable improvement, and possibly quieter, at £30.64 (including P&P) for two litres it would only be a few pounds more that what you got.  The story seems to be that the gearbox is a 2.1 litre, presumably dry fill, I keep meaning to check but I keep forgetting (other companies make this task a lot easier than VW).  I forgot to put last time, I think the box is an "overfill" as oil spills out filler plug on level ground so atilt from opposite corner on fill (and drain) but it's not much overfill.

 

Yes selecting another gear first might help if only for the delay it takes to do that but perhaps not or other.  Previous posts have covered all my thoughts, other than perhaps checking with a Dealership to see if there are any "technical Bulletins" or whatever they call them ("TPI"?) for this issue on your VIN or perhaps some sort of recall, semi-secret or not.

 

I've never thought these VW gearboxes were that great but I don't think they should be as bad as yours, as I put before I think I've seen something similar on Briskoda but can't remember the details, a Google search might be better than site or forum search (and bring you back to Briskoda which is a bit annoying after doing a site or forum search but Google do have massive resources that small sites can't even dream of or probably know what fully existing, never mind Skynet. 😆

 

If you find an answer let us know, good luck Tony.

 

Edited 15 September, 20241 yr by nta16
£ sign

On 21/04/2024 at 12:48, montecarlo said:

I have a 2017 1.0 MPi Fabia and it’s a great little car, but, it can be very reluctant to go into first or reverse gear. 

 

I've usually associated reluctance to go into first or reverse gear with clutch drag,

Thanks for the advice, if clutch drag is the cause what is the solution?

Update..........

 

During the frosty weather the selection of first gear became so difficult I had to do something about it. I guessed it must be something to do with the oil becoming too thick during the night in the cold temperatures, because the gearchanges became easier after a few miles of driving. After doing some research I found a German brand of oil which was developed for VW gearboxes like this one so I bought a litre of it and arranged for my local garage to change the oil again. The garage advised me not to buy more than one litre because it would be enough even though the capacity is meant to be 1.1 litres.  The transmission code shown on the boot floor sticker is QAE

 

I'm pleased to report that the gearbox is now changing gears much more smoothly and so far I haven't been locked out of first gear like I was before.

 

The oil that I bought is this one and it cost £21.95

 

Liqui Moly - Top Tec MTF 5300 70W-75W - Fully Synth. Transmission Gear Oil - 1L

 

I should also mention that the garage said the filler bolt was so difficult to undo that there was a real chance of breaking the filler, so they had to remove the reverse sensor switch and fill the gearbox through that instead.

 

I hope this helps someone else in the same position as we were almost considering selling the car at one point but using this oil has made it pleasant to drive again.

 

Tony, thanks for reporting back and the best of luck.

 

Very few will believe that gearbox oil makes any difference.

 

Personally I would never have bothered with a NAPA oil, it might be good or very good but who knows unless you have a safety sheet to suggest whose oil it might be then you don't know the model quality of the oil.  With a good or very good quality oil you don't need additives (subject to using the correct oil type and grade) and perhaps state of the gearbox.

 

It makes sense that another lot of German engineers will be able to sort out the compromises of the first lot of German engineers.  To me German engineering (good) quality started to diminish at the change of century/millennium only the undeserved good reputation continued with the help of marketing and UK snobbery for BMW and Merc.

 

I takes two oil changes to really change the oil over and that's being thorough with both changes which garages rarely have the time and inclination for but if you have sufficient good to not so good mix ratio, not so good not diluting the effect of the good too much, splashing around in the box it should be fine and your results so far have proved this to be the case.

 

I had to tip my wife's car to empty and refill the box more and I'm still not sure I got all out and back in but it was enough of each and the English company (Millers) oil has given good results but I might drain and top up another litre in spring just so I know the contents is the EE as much as is possible but that might depend on weather, health and if I can be arse farting about on a car, particularly a VW.  😁

 

Definitely thanks for your feedback. When buying my Fabia I investigated the PROs and CONs and saw a gearbox issue reported in a French press article.

I checked on Moly's web site and entered several car models to see if it changes the recommended product and it does.

Then I entered Fabia III MPI and it replied the one you have used ...

 

By the way ... was 1 litre enough or did you have to add some more ?

Thanks !!

@fabia29 as montecarlo hasn't seen your post yet.  Bear in mind there is always a residue left in unless you remove, strip and dry the inside of the box.  Dry fill capacity is different to service fill capacity and how much you actually get in depends on how thorough the change is but is normally optimistic even for a DIYer with no time pressures and the interest and desire to be as thorough as is reasonably possible. 

 

Different gearboxes will have different capacities.  You could look up your car and see the dry and claimed service fill capacities they have on their database for your mode and gearbox. - https://www.millersoils.co.uk/which-oil/

 

Hi Fabia29, yes there was just enough oil, a few drops left in the bottle afterwards. Good luck with yours

Very interesting feedbacks !! Thanks both.

I have not done this yet but I am suffering particularly in these days with the cold temperatures.

I have to move the clutch (engine off) and go to speed "2" to "unstick" a bit the mechanism and eventually I turn the engine on and after one or two times, it is OK !!

@fabia29 do you park on a slope, do you leave the car in gear when parked, what's your routine when parking up just before and after turning the engine off, I'm just wondering if the weight of the car and how, where, it's parked might be working against it, you.

Good evening NTA16, Excellent remark, thank you!

I park on the sidewalk, slightly tilted:

"right front wheel and right rear wheel"

are lower than

"left front wheel and left rear wheel"

Concerning my routine : don't laugh because I am overcareful (kept my previous third hand car for 19 years) :

1./ when arriving home, despite it is not TSI, I stop the Engine after 30 sec, 1 min without touching any pedal of course

2./ when taking back the car, despite I have the Kessy button, I turn it on in several phases :

a./ press the Kessy button

b./ wait 3 seconds for the gas pump to initiate

c./ clutch + button to turn the engine on

d./ wait until the automatic starter brings it from the initial 1200 to 800 rpm !!

And of course when I use the clutch, I press it deeply ...

Edited 11 March, 20251 yr by fabia29

I think you have riled out my thought(s) with how you park and what you do.

I think it is good thing not to get in the car, start the engine and drive straight of as almost one action. I am with you, Get in the car then turn the ignition on whilst you check all the warning lights and instruments and also put your seatbelt on before starting the engine and then after starting the engine listening to the car and engine and make sure all the instruments and warning lights are as they should be before driving. I don't think you need wait as long as for engine idle to always drop to 800 but if you prefer that is fine.

I also suggest not turning any electrics on, other than safety items, before you start the engine and always turning all electrics, other than safety items, off before turning the engine off and listening to the car and engine for a short while before turning the engine off.

Do I take it you are not in the UK, or not from the UK with "sidewalk"?

Third hand would have been very few owners for some of the car's I have had. 🙂

Hello NTA16,

I know, I am too procedural :-) I live in Brittany (the weather is similar to yours) in a suburban area where I can park on the sidewalks.

Eventually, if I understand you correctly, there is no point in parking facing the other way; it will not change the 1st and R gears, which only stick when starting. So in priority replace the oil with "Liqui Moly Top Tec MTF 5300 70W-75W"...

Hi, yes, parking the other way round will make no difference. I was thinking of if you park on a reasonable slope with front or back of the car pointing down against gravity and depending on your parking and engine off procedure might be putting the weight of the car against the gearbox and lever.

A change to a better and fresh oil may help with gear shifting a little but it won't overcome gearbox issue if it is too rough but for cost and effort and overall possible slight improvement it's worth a try.

If you are doing the oil change yourself then just be thorough to get as much existing oil out as you can which means you can get more fresh new improved oil back in and there is less residue old oil to dilute the effects of the fresh improved oil (same for engine oil changes). Many (most) dealerships, garages and mechanics don't have the time or inclination to do a really thorough job which usually is OK but not as good as doing the job thoroughly.

If you are doing the oil change yourself I can give you general tips, your gearbox is different to the one in my wife's 2015 5-speed manual but sounds like it might be easier to do.

Millers Oils 'Which Oil?' database show a 2020 1.0 MPI with a 0CF (MQ100) 5/1) box as a service fill capacity of 1.1 litre (dry fill 1.3l) so in real life a 1 litre bottle is normally enough for refill, if someone has been so thorough and lucky enough to get 1.1 lire out then then can always filter some of the previous oil and put it back in the box.

The old oil can be check by looking and feeling it for any big bits of whatever and generally how the oil looks (or sent off for analysis if really concerned but the old oil on a 4-5 year old should look like it's totally fine, you can't see 4-5 years of use and age in it.

Cheers.

I will do it myself next time I hire a lift for full service.

I did such an operation several times in the past on my old Seat Ibiza. The only thing that fears me is what MonteCarlo wrote :

"should also mention that the garage said the filler bolt was so difficult to undo that there was a real chance of breaking the filler, so they had to remove the reverse sensor switch and fill the gearbox through that instead."

If I remove the reverse sensor : not only I never did such a thing but it also implies that I might need to replace the seal that probably comes with it ...

I will try the classical fill keeping fingers crossed ...

How did you proceed on your wife's Fabia ? Was the filler bolt easy to remove in your case ?

Thanks.

Edited 12 March, 20251 yr by fabia29