Hi there. I'm attempting a flywheel replacement on my mum's car after a quote for a garage to do it pretty much wrote off the vehicle. They wanted £2000 + parts ex VAT. Brutal.

 

Its a 2012 Skoda Superb Estate MKII 2.0 TDI 16v 4x4 automatic.

 

Easily the biggest job I've done on a car so far. I'm at the stage where I'm trying to separate the gearbox from the engine. I have the engine suspended from an engine support beam, and a second chain wrapped completely around the gearbox so I can slowly lower it, and 2 jacks underneath to control the descent. While the top, front and bottom seem to be separating, I'm getting a lot of resistance from the transfer box area (yes I've done the bolt in the starter motor hole). Most of what I've found on the job (which isn't much) indicates the transfer box stays attached and comes out with the gearbox. Indeed from a fairly in depth visual inspection it would indicate the transfer box and engine have been kept completely separate from the angles I can see from. The only bolts I can see or feel only connect it to the gearbox. Should I just give it the beans? Or am I missing something? The transfer box appears to be connected to the gearbox by 4 bolts, one of which is completely impossible to get to so far as I can tell. I could barely get a finger on it to discover it was there.

 

Any help much appreciated!

 

 

There is a support bracket around the RH (viewed from inside cabin) driveshaft flange that bolts to the engine block, a pig to get to!

40 minutes ago, J.R. said:

There is a support bracket around the RH (viewed from inside cabin) driveshaft flange that bolts to the engine block, a pig to get to!

Great. Thanks for that. I'll crawl under tomorrow when the light is back and see what I can find.

I hope both my memory and the description are good enough!

 

I think you are right to leave the angle drive gearbox connected, yes it's heavier but I could see nothing but inconveniences and risks through detaching it, risk of oil seal failure, need for a long reach special torx tool etc.

So I think I found the bolt. I'd just bought a flexible head ratchet spanner set, so I thought I had just the tool for the job. It started undoing fairly easily but was longer than I had expected. I then realised I'd backed my self in to a corner, in that I cant get the spanner off, and I cant reverse the ratchet as it's only one way and I seem to have undone it as far as the space allows. I thought to remove the flange to get more room. The whole in the middle though is over 30cm and seems to go right through to the gearbox. I don't own anything remotely long enough to get down there, if that's even how you get the flange off.

 

I've got some pictures.

 

Any further advice? I think my next step would be to try and cut the bolt if the flange isn't easily removed. I suspect I've damaged the thread anyway.

You might need to remove the flange. If not just leave as is and deal with it when gearbox is down. Depends on 2 types of different brackets used on these engines. If need to take flange out: Use a 450mm long hex pipe, I believe it is a hex 5. Could also use a 1/4" very long extension with a hex 5 bit attached. When bolt is loose, use a pry bar to get the flange out. If not doable, use a slidehammer and a 3 arm pulley. That should knock it out. But, remember to drain axle fluid first or else you make a mess. But if doable, just cut off the bolt and replace with a shorter one when assemblytime. I just did this myself.

Disregard bold text: To reach the most inner 16mm bolt on the bracket, a round head long 140mm hex 8 is the tool you need. No other hex tools will fot to get the bracket loose. You might have to undo the turbo oil pipe as well with a 27mm open end spanner to gain access.

And now you know why this job on a 4x4 tdi cr is priced the way they are...

Hope you took down the subframe. No other way to get a 4x4 engine gearbox down without removing it (imho). And if you dont have subframe guiding pins, you will likely need to get a wheel alignment as well. 

Edited 5 January, 20251 yr by rbhelle

But why havent you removed the dpf? It gives a whole lot more room to work in back there. Personally, I hate working in tight spaces, so removing the dpf is mandatory for me just to save some space and time. But yeah, I admit, nothing is nice on those engines with 4x4 and dpf....

 there is a bolt on the right side of the gearbox. It is the only bolt on that side directly into the gearbox. All others are form the left side (passenger side) You have found the one I am talking about?

Edited 5 January, 20251 yr by rbhelle

might find some advice here as well

 

 

Haha. I think I'm gonna cry! The previous biggest job I did on a car was replacing the sub frame in my SMAX so this was quite a big step up. There is no time constraint though, and I'm up for investing in necessary tools. I do want to learn cars more thoroughly. This job is tricky though, as I've found pretty much no media on the steps, so I'm making it up with reference to the none 4x4 videos, and 1 single, relatively poor walk through of a manual 4x4 gearbox removal, so not a great amount to go on. If you know of any sources, they would be a huge help.

 

Sub frame is removed with both axels and control arms. The other side facing bolt (the one nestled right under the transfer box) is removed. I did cut the bolt in the above pictures (1 hour with a hack saw!). I've got about 1cm of separation so I know I'm close.

 

So far the DPF hasn't been in the way, but with the next steps you say I need, it will probably have to come out.

 

Do you know where I can buy those 450mm hex keys? I can't find anything quite long enough from my usual sites. Will it likely be the same size as the flange on the other side of the gearbox? I can reach that one to find the size.

 

Thanks for your help! This is a pretty steep learning curve.

Since the bolt is cut, no need to tale flange off. Just remember the flange with screws when assembly of gearbox. It might be a PITA to align the box on to the engine, so after struggle you dont want to do it again of you forgot the adapter 😀

The tool I used is a special vw tool, but you find it on ebay. Its just a f...long hex 5 bitpipe with 1/2" connection. A long 1/4" extension will suffice with a 1/4" hex 5 bitpipe attached to the end.

https://m.autodoc.co.no/hazet/19418422

 

Here is hex key I got

I never removed the flange nor the DPF, the whole transmission unit came out and went back in relatively easily but I worked slowly.

 

19 minutes ago, wilcopshot said:

This job is tricky though, as I've found pretty much no media on the steps, so I'm making it up with reference to the none 4x4 videos

 

That was all I had to go on, I worked out a few things along the way where I differed from what Youtube would have me do like leaving the steering rack in situ but hanging in space.

 

My biggest error was being ignorant of the existence of and need for the subframe locating pins, the car crabbed severely afterwards and would ditch dive if you released the steering wheel which was well off centre when driving in a straight line.

 

If you need advice on how to realign things without paying a fortune to someone to use a 4 wheel alignment set up that they probably dont really understand then I am your man but thats for later, it seems you are about ready to drop the transmission. I hope you have raised the front end really high if you are intending dragging it out from under the car.

 

Oh ok. So just to clarify the removal of the flange was just to get to that 1 bolt. So this gearbox should come out now if I give it a bit of levering, twisting and more than gentle persuasion?

 

I've currently got it hanging from the engine suspension bar with a long chain wrapped around, but I think this is actually working against me as I think the whole thing might have to twist slightly to clear that flange from the engine block enough to get the distance I need towards passenger side. I'm doing this all on axel stands, so I can get a couple of jacks up to it as well for safety, provided there is still room for me underneath!

I used a pair of ratchet straps around the engine support bar, its better to have someone help you at that stage, they can progressively release the straps from above (make sure they know what they are doing and that you can trust them) while you manoeuvre it from below.

 

4 eyes are better than two (one in my case) and if it all goes Pete Tong the person above can call the ambulance!

 

If you have moved it one cm then its ready to come out.

Yeah I hadn't heard of those locating pins either. Is that something that  standard wheel alignment can fix? Or is this taking the alignment beyond the scope of the adjustment bolts?

 

Yeah right now I'm just worrying more about getting this flywheel replaced and the car back together. Very daunting job!

I have just thought, while the gearbox is out is a good time to replace the propshaft rear Guibo joint if it is perished, the propshaft has to be moved forwards to remove it which is all but impossible with the transmission fitted, you have to move the whole engine forward.

 

My Guibo is still sitting on the shelf  4 years later and each time I have to show it to the CT tester who wants to fail the old one showing him that the splits he sees are actually moulded into the new one!

3 minutes ago, wilcopshot said:

Is that something that  standard wheel alignment can fix?

 

No, effectively the front axle will likely no longer be parallel to the rear axle and will also be displaced sideways. Correction is simple but the measuring and setting out time consuming.

Very time consuming 😆😆 

Here are the pins I am using. VW T10096 I believe is the correct ones for your car.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/144224199219?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=J4A9zjIQQnq&sssrc=4429486&ssuid=0QZxub5gQRy&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

1 hour ago, rbhelle said:

Very time consuming 😆😆 

Not really, just some DIY to make a fixture to hold a laser spirit level and a cardboard target, once done its 10 minutes to take measurements from all 4 wheels and some reflection on what corrective action to take.

 

Even if a technician can do a 4 wheel alignment set up in that time you are going to be charged an hour.

 

My set up cost nothing, I already had a laser spirit level with a broken vial, the other parts were scrap material.

6 minutes ago, J.R. said:

Not really, just some DIY to make a fixture to hold a laser spirit level and a cardboard target, once done its 10 minutes to take measurements from all 4 wheels and some reflection on what corrective action to take.

 

Even if a technician can do a 4 wheel alignment set up in that time you are going to be charged an hour.

 

My set up cost nothing, I already had a laser spirit level with a broken vial, the other parts were scrap material.

Nice to know. Did align my ATV once, and it was a pain due to running around all the time adjusting. Probably my nemesis when it comes to car repairs. After that I take all precautions to avoid the need for alignment. If I have to, well, thats the one thing I actually let the workshop do. A 4-wheel alignment/adjusting cost approx 130 GBP here in Norway.

For sure avoiding the grief of the actual adjustment by using the location pins is the way to go, the measurement is fairly easy.

 

My rear axle was slightly out of alignment, the front a long way from not using the guide pins but also perhaps the frontal impact which wrote the vehicle off, I needed to adjust both as I could not move the front axle far enough to align with the misaligned rear but I could not get enough purchase laying on my back to release the rear subframe fixing bolts.

 

My compromise solution was to pull the front axle to the rear with a ratchet strap before tightening to front fixing bolts to FT torque!

@wilcopshot so, dmf fixed/replaced mate? All according to plan?

I only managed to get back under the car today. And only for an hour or so, but it was productive. After some more levering I decided there was definitely something I had not undone. I got an 8mm hex and took off the surround sheet of metal above the flange (picture 1). I hadn't tried it yet as it appeared to only be attached to the transfer box. Once off it revealed a super secret bracket. 2x 16mm bolts (pic 2) later and the gearbox is swinging with ease, ready to drop. Then the alarm went off to get the kid from school and my time had run out. I'll get that gearbox dropped at the weekend and start on the actual flywheel. Then I'll try and remember how it all goes back together. I'll watch some videos on alignment before I do the final tighten on the sub frame bolts, and see if I can get ahead of any alignment issues. I'll also look in to those prop shaft couplers while I'm at it.

 

Is there anything else that is worth looking over while I'm £1k of labour deep on this thing?