As title really.

Used to do this in my old 1.7td cavalier with no big issues, and am interested to hear of peoples experiences. I appreciate that the Fabia uses a much more modern engine, so I've had a read up on the old interwebs, and I get mixed messages about using it on the PD engine.

Wouldn't run straight, probably more a 50/50 or 70/30 mix with normal derv.

Not interested in 'my mate says', I'd like to hear if YOU have done it yourself on a PD engine, preferably the PD130.

Many thanks!

I haven't done it personally but I'd be pretty damn sure it would knacker the fuel system if not the engine !

So on that note, I wouldn't bother

I use to run veg oil (50/50 mix with diesel) in a peugeot 205 about ten years ago with great results a no problems. Did try it in my pd 130 once and it lost power big time so didn't bother again. The problem is the cost of veg oil had rocketed so it's just not worth doing it anymore plus modern engines won't like it.

I've can buy it off the shelf here for 93p/l.. That's for sunflower oil, which was preferable over normal veg oil back in the day too.

As I said, there's mixed info on t'interwebs about it, looking for actual experiences in a pd130. =)

Don't, just don't. Unless you have deep pockets for a complete fuelling system replacement/rebuild.

That is all.

Hmm. So the naysayers on the web may be onto something then..

I did this one with used vegetable oil (can get 20litre drums week at a time from my work). I thinned it down with white spirit to give it a diesel like viscosity, 3% to be exact and mixed it 50/50 with diesel. I noticed a drop in power (not too much) and also my engine was quieter? I have yet to use it since, but have still got 5-6 drums in my garage waiting to be thinned. Its risky business and one that can not be said for certain if it harms the engine or not untill someone uses 24/7 and sees if it breaks.

My car was a Skoda Fabia 1.9TDI 100bhp

Edited 1 May, 201214 yr by Barneylita

Get some nuts. Be the first.

No personal experience but loads of info and opinions (diverse!) on tdiclub.

http://pics.tdiclub.com/data/500/FIEM.pdf

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showpost.php?p=3698714&postcount=8

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=288613&highlight=svo+pd

Fair to state that Drivebywire isn't a fanof the stuff.

J.

I'm intriigued by all this discussion over bio.

That fellah sure slags it off but the injection system simply needed a darn good professional clean after 140k miles. How much did that cost? How much was saved by running bio for 140k miles.

I've got LOTS more reading to do on the subject for sure, but on the face of it the maths certainly seems to look good. I could understand all the naysayers if PD enginesd were croaking it all over the place after 20k miles, but that simply isnt the case!

I used to do this 10 odd years ago and researched it an awful lot. I was even involved in converting council buses and vehicles to run 100% veg oil with a special kit.

Although not done it on my vRS. What I can say is this.

I used this mainly in a 1994 Mitsubishi Shogun and was running 50/50 without problems apart from once when I lost power, I nursed it home and just found the fuel filter had clogged, replaced it and good to go.

My dad is currently using it (thinned down) in a CR Ford Connect and has no problems whatsoever.

As regards power loss this surprises me as Veg oil has a higher Cetane level so in reality power should increase.

As to knackering your engine, if its the correct viscosity there should be no problem whatsoever, the thing that is the issue here is the diesel pumps. They are designed to pump diesel not anything thicker so I have heard of people having problems with pumps when they try to run larger percentages of veg oil.

To overcome this and to just be on the safe side really, I did along with a few others I know fit a short length of heated fuel line which was basically fuel line in a rubber housing that you tapped into the cooling system so as the coolant heated up it heated the fuel running through the fuel line which made it thinner. (I have website details for these parts if your interested, just looked at it and the homepage has a 2005 Caddy PDI just been converted).

Lastly I read and heard a lot more people had problems with diesel pumps when using Sunflower oil so I only ever used Veg oil.

I really wouldn't try this on a PD. Don't think the pump or the injectors are up to it!

I used to use it straight in my old Pug 306 1.9D (with the Bosch pump) and had no problems. Loved the smell of it!!

Phil

PD = No, the injectors in particular won't do well, with a suitable thinner the viscosity can be altered to reduce the pump damage but the answer is still no. With an SDI on the other hand the answer is yes. If you need further information google is your friend.

PD = No, the injectors in particular won't do well, with a suitable thinner the viscosity can be altered to reduce the pump damage but the answer is still no. With an SDI on the other hand the answer is yes. If you need further information google is your friend.

Yup. I think I'm right in saying that the SDI's have a Bosch pump which is very strong and more than capable of coping.

The way the PD injectors work is what means they are not suitable.

Phil

The way the PD injectors work is what means they are not suitable.

Can someone explain what the problem is with with PD injectors and veg oil. If the veg oil was the same viscosity as normal diesel surely it would work as the injector is in effect doing the same job whether its veg oil or diesel.

Cheers

Can someone explain what the problem is with with PD injectors and veg oil. If the veg oil was the same viscosity as normal diesel surely it would work as the injector is in effect doing the same job whether its veg oil or diesel.

Cheers

Yes and no really. The PD injector incorporates a pump in each injector that pressurises the fuel (up to about 2,000 bar- common rail is about 1,600 bar). The fuel release is then controlled by the ECU. The way vegetable oil atomizes under high pressure is different to diesel so although it may work there are no guarantees to the long term reliability of the engine.

You would probably end up with coked up injectors due to the fuel not atomixing fully which would no doubt mean new injectors pretty soon.

Possibly chirping in with something obvious here... but my friend had a Vito fully converted to run on Oil. She had 2 tanks, the original Diesel and a second for the oil. A switch on the dash flipped between the 2 fuel sources.

When I questioned the need she explained that the engine itself was happy with the oil, but that starting and stopping was the problem, and that this was simply down to the veg oil thickening up in the injection system when cold.. So you had to run diesel through a moment before you stopped, and until the engine was warm to start with..

For this reason alone, surely it's a massive no no? Because even thinned and mixed it'll still clog up when cold, won't it? The garages switch to winter diesel don't they?

Edited 2 May, 201214 yr by Rob.

For veg oil and bio-diesel info, suggest starting here;-

http://www.vegetableoildiesel.co.uk/forum/index.php

as there is a wealth of info/experiance, both good and bad. i run a PD but general concensus is that it should not be used. I previously ran a Citroen Zx and a Xsara on both veg and bio.

A better question would be why aren't you considering bio diesel as apposed to a blend of VO and diesel? Your're PD would like you much more for it.

Thanks for the comments all. I've done a lot of reading on this subject, and you're all pretty much spot on with what I've read.. Main cause of killing the fuelling system is due to the crystallization of veg oil when put under the enormous pressures of a PD fuel rail. This can be possibly be avoided by using the correct additives. In my mind, what better additive is there than pump derv itself? Big risks but potentially big rewards - I could save 25p a liter if I run at 50/50. That's over a tenner a tank.

I covered about 12,000 miles in my cavalier on a variety of oils (new & used) with lots of different mixes with normal diesel, additives and things. Bit of a mad professors workshop going on in the garage. The car smelt like a chip shop too!

Only problem I ever encountered was on way to Wales on a tank just filled with neat new veg oil, without adding anything else. It got a bit lumpy near Bridgend when we hit about 2 degrees outside, so topped the tank off with some derv, and it immediately fixed the issue.

Think I'm going to have to have a serious think about this one.

FWIW

I have ran 1000l of Bio through a PD100 without problems but went back to pump diesel as the economics made it less worthwhile

I found power down and MPG way down but the engine did sound smoother. in the end the cost difference was so close that I couldnt be bothered with the hassle.

if I can find a good supplier then I may go back but it has to be a lot cheaper than diesel to make it worthwhile

you also have to be prepared to change fuel filters as bio will "clean" all of the crud that builds up in the tank through and block the fuel filter

crystallization of veg oil when put under the enormous pressures of a PD fuel rail.

it's glycerol the same thing you get 'round the top of a chip pan and that takes some shifting