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HID Conversion

DionJ
in Skoda Octavia Mk2 (2004 - 2013)

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Leaving the well-documented legal stuff aside for the moment (self-levelling, headlight washers and non-ECE/E-marked bulbs), the recommendation from various users is not to have a can-bus "error-free" ones. Get someone with VCDS to program the ECU for HIDs (IIRC there's a setting for HID installation and also one so the diagnostics ignores the headlights).

It has been mentioned that the "error-free" ones have the potential to do unpleasant things to the ECU.

As long as you can get a pattern on the bulbs you'll be fine legal wise,

I would ask people on here who have already converted theirs, loads of people have done it.

As long as you can get a pattern on the bulbs you'll be fine legal wise,

I would ask people on here who have already converted theirs, loads of people have done it.

Just out of interest: what part of the legal profession are you in?

When I'm back at work on Tuesday, I'll give you the DfT contact who will give you (again) the legal clarification on that one. ;) ;)

(Hint: the 2006 Fact Sheet on The Law still applies.)

Oh look: it was updated in 2010 too:

http://assets.dft.gov.uk/publications/dft-information-sheets/aftermarket-hid-headlamps.pdf (note that the document comes from the Department For Transport, they kinda know a thing or two about UK motoring law ;) ;) )

That contains the e-mail addres [email protected] which is one refered to above.

The relevant extract is:

In practice this means:

1. The headlamp unit (outer lens, reflector, bulb) shall be type approved to ECE 98 and be "e-marked" to demonstrate this. That can only be done by the headlamp supplier - Hella, Valeo etc. - who must test the headlamp in an independent laboratory.

2. Once fitted to the vehicle it must have headlamp cleaning and self-levelling (which can be for the headlamp or can be in the vehicle suspension - some expensive estate cars have "self-levelling suspension" and that is adequate). Also the dipped beam must stay on with the main beam.

3. The headlamp must be maintained in good working order, kept clean, and aligned/adjusted correctly in the same way as any other headlamp.

Under the Road Traffic Act 1988 it is an offence to supply, fit or use vehicle parts which are not legal.

In summary: it is not permitted to convert an existing halogen headlamp unit for use with HID bulbs. The entire headlamp unit must be replaced with one designed and approved for use with HID bulbs and it must be installed in accordance with the rules stated above.

================================================================================

There are those who will go to great lengths to tell you that The Law is just "best practice" and how, if you read the sheet with rose-tinted glasses, it doesn't apply in many many different ways and that you can ignore ECE approval and 'E' markings.

In short:

If you are comfortable with the legal situation (as clarified by DfT) then fit them. If you're not comfortable, don't. It's your choice.

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    • Like 1

    Just out of interest: what part of the legal profession are you in?

    When I'm back at work on Tuesday, I'll give you the DfT contact who will give you (again) the legal clarification on that one. ;) ;)

    (Hint: the 2006 Fact Sheet on The Law still applies.)

    Oh look: it was updated in 2010 too:

    http://assets.dft.gov.uk/publications/dft-information-sheets/aftermarket-hid-headlamps.pdf (note that the document comes from the Department For Transport, they kinda know a thing or two about UK motoring law ;) ;) )

    That contains the e-mail addres [email protected] which is one refered to above.

    The relevant extract is:

    In practice this means:

    1. The headlamp unit (outer lens, reflector, bulb) shall be type approved to ECE 98 and be "e-marked" to demonstrate this. That can only be done by the headlamp supplier - Hella, Valeo etc. - who must test the headlamp in an independent laboratory.

    2. Once fitted to the vehicle it must have headlamp cleaning and self-levelling (which can be for the headlamp or can be in the vehicle suspension - some expensive estate cars have "self-levelling suspension" and that is adequate). Also the dipped beam must stay on with the main beam.

    3. The headlamp must be maintained in good working order, kept clean, and aligned/adjusted correctly in the same way as any other headlamp.

    Under the Road Traffic Act 1988 it is an offence to supply, fit or use vehicle parts which are not legal.

    In summary: it is not permitted to convert an existing halogen headlamp unit for use with HID bulbs. The entire headlamp unit must be replaced with one designed and approved for use with HID bulbs and it must be installed in accordance with the rules stated above.

    ================================================================================

    There are those who will go to great lengths to tell you that The Law is just "best practice" and how, if you read the sheet with rose-tinted glasses, it doesn't apply in many many different ways and that you can ignore ECE approval and 'E' markings.

    In short:

    If you are comfortable with the legal situation (as clarified by DfT) then fit them. If you're not comfortable, don't. It's your choice.

    This will be my last reply to you, you seem to like trolling and are trying to hijack this thread. The MOT regs (jan 2012) seem to differ with you. Also my 2008 laguna has factory fitted Xenons and NO washers or 'self levellers'. Funny that!?

    How many people have failed their mot's for not having headlamp washers or self levellers? None!

    If you want to continue this conversation please feel free to pm me but don't try to hijack this persons thread.

    This will be my last reply to you, you seem to like trolling and are trying to hijack this thread. The MOT regs (jan 2012) seem to differ with you. Also my 2008 laguna has factory fitted Xenons and NO washers or 'self levellers'. Funny that!?

    How many people have failed their mot's for not having headlamp washers or self levellers? None!

    If you want to continue this conversation please feel free to pm me but don't try to hijack this persons thread.

    Erm, OP asked what he needed. I assume "being legal" would have been a requirement. If you think that clarifying the legal situation, with documentation from official UK government sources is trolling you, then I leave that up to you. Be hard to be trolling you if I posted a reply before you, wouldn't it? If my post hadn't mentioned legality, I can guarantee yours wouldn't have, in fact from the reply you gave, you didn't even answer the OPs question. So, who's trolling who?

    This will be my last reply to you, you seem to like trolling and are trying to hijack this thread. The MOT regs (jan 2012) seem to differ with you. Also my 2008 laguna has factory fitted Xenons and NO washers or 'self levellers'. Funny that!?

    How many people have failed their mot's for not having headlamp washers or self levellers? None!

    If you want to continue this conversation please feel free to pm me but don't try to hijack this persons thread.

    My Scout passed its mot last year at a Skoda dealer with factory fit xenons and headlight washers that weren't working.

    Cured them since (was just a fuse) but two services and one mot at dealer and they never even noticed (despite the car throwing a fault code) or just weren't bothered.

    Spanner in the works, my vRS has passed it's MOT 3 years on the bubble with a HID kit fitted, requirement for an MOT is - IF self levers and headlight washers are fitted, they MUST work.......

    Imho if they are a good quality kit, correctly fitted and aligned and in a projector headlight housing they are as good as factory fit, in the 3 years of having them in, I have never been flashed! :thumbup:

    Edit: I went for non CANbus, and had controller 9 coded via VCDS. These are the ones I have, although they were £49.99 when I got them - :(

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    • Like 1

    Spanner in the works, my vRS has passed it's MOT 3 years on the bubble with a HID kit fitted, requirement for an MOT is - IF self levers and headlight washers are fitted, they MUST work.......

    Imho if they are a good quality kit, correctly fitted and aligned and in a projector headlight housing they are as good as factory fit, in the 3 years of having them in, I have never been flashed! :thumbup:

    Ah, those MOT regulations were derogated before their in-force date this year, so even if fitted, they don't have to work. They were in the original (iirc the May draft still had them in) but the October draft had them removed. The MOT also doesn't check for ECE compliance either. ;) (IIRC the tester cannot adjust or disassemble what is being tested.)

    And I whole-heartedly agree: "if they are a good quality kit, correctly fitted and aligned and in a projector headlight housing they are as good as factory fit" and unless you do have a seriously anal MOT inspector or police officer (no! say it ain't so) the chances are you'll never get stopped either. Doesn't detract from the legal issue though.

    (Projector being the operative word too. HIDs in reflectors are just, well, crap and dangerous, and blatantly obviously illegal)

    My contention is not their legality (never has been), but acceptance of their legality. "I know they're illegal - so what" is perfectly acceptable to me. ;)

    They'll be on Nelly, once she's been repaired - I will fit them, knowing their legal status and wholly accepting that, and any consequences arising. (Am looking for ones with small enough ballast to fit inside the recess on the back of the headlight unit, so it'll all be contained neatly) Some people may decide that, given their legal status they won't fit them after all (informed decision). However, should you ever get stopped: ignorance of The Law is no excuse and "some bloke on the internet said they was legal, officer" will be no defence either.

    Just 'cos you never get caught, doesn't make it legal.

    Jack The Ripper was never caught, doesn't make what he did legal. ;)

    Edit: I went for non CANbus, and had controller 9 coded via VCDS. These are the ones I have, although they were £49.99 when I got them - :(

    Yeah I knew there was a CANbus coding. From what I remember it's something like "Xenons with shutter fitted" or something close. What size are the ballasts?

    (Ouch, I feel your pain on the price reduction too)

    I have from the same place as Pagey, and took to the mot testing centre straight away to have them adjusted so no dazzle, they have passed two years on the trot also

    It’s fair to assume the ability, competence and professionalism of MOT testers is just as likely to vary from garage to garage as is the ability of Skoda mechanics...

    ...and we all know how this can differ from one day to the next let alone from one dealer to another!

    Just because a car passes an MOT test doesn't make it road legal.

    There has been lots of discussion on this on many different threads, all stirring up a good degree of constructive and interesting debate.

    I've read most of them and also came to conclusion that xenon/HID headlights must have a self levelling and cleaning system by law.

    I had illegal number plates on a car for a number of years but was never pulled by the Police or failed an MOT because I 'knew' the tester. Doesn't make it right but proves that an MOT certificate doesn't always mean a lot!

    I've read most of them and also came to conclusion that xenon/HID headlights must have a self levelling and cleaning system by law.

    Not trying to start a argument here but then why are cars sold with factory fitted xenons/HIDs without cleaning or self levellers? My car proves this.

    Just to note, my car is registered 2008 and the 'fact sheet' is dated 2006?

    As far as I can tell the MkIII Renault Laguna with factory fit xenon's does have self levelling and headlight washers.

    You can see the caps covering the headlight washers in this picture.

    If you don't have the headlight washers then perhaps your Laguna doesn't have factory fit xenon's?

    LagunaXenonHeadlight.jpg

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    • Like 1

    Not again :wall:

    As far as I can tell the MkIII Renault Laguna with factory fit xenon's does have self levelling and headlight washers.

    You can see the caps covering the headlight washers in this picture.

    If you don't have the headlight washers then perhaps your Laguna doesn't have factory fit xenon's?

    LagunaXenonHeadlight.jpg

    That's a higher spec than mine, I can assure you it does have xenons but no washers!

    Hmm, really? I'd be very suprised if it did. Could a previous owner have retrofitted a HID kit? Could it be an import I wonder?

    Here is a non-xenon equipped Laguna, it still has projector headlights (some people confuse these for xenon's) and you can also see the manual headlight adjustment wheel on the dash and the lack of headlight washers.

    LagunaHalogenHeadlight.jpg

    LagunaHeadlightAdjustment.jpg

    Here is a MkII with xenon's and even this model had the headlight washers. If indeed you do have factory xenon's you have a very rare car indeed!

    MkIILaguna.jpg

    By the way (sorry for being off-topic), the silver Laguna pictured above looks immaculate. I'm not brave enought to part with my hard-earned on a used Renault but this one seems a lot of car for not a lot of cash?

    http://www.autotrade...l13yd?logcode=p

    Edited by silver1011

    It’s fair to assume the ability, competence and professionalism of MOT testers is just as likely to vary from garage to garage as is the ability of Skoda mechanics...

    ...and we all know how this can differ from one day to the next let alone from one dealer to another!

    Just because a car passes an MOT test doesn't make it road legal.

    There has been lots of discussion on this on many different threads, all stirring up a good degree of constructive and interesting debate.

    I've read most of them and also came to conclusion that xenon/HID headlights must have a self levelling and cleaning system by law.

    I had illegal number plates on a car for a number of years but was never pulled by the Police or failed an MOT because I 'knew' the tester. Doesn't make it right but proves that an MOT certificate doesn't always mean a lot!

    The mot tester is not a mate, and I asked 1st about legality, he said maybe in the future but ok now

    • Author

    Spanner in the works, my vRS has passed it's MOT 3 years on the bubble with a HID kit fitted, requirement for an MOT is - IF self levers and headlight washers are fitted, they MUST work.......

    Imho if they are a good quality kit, correctly fitted and aligned and in a projector headlight housing they are as good as factory fit, in the 3 years of having them in, I have never been flashed! :thumbup:

    Edit: I went for non CANbus, and had controller 9 coded via VCDS. These are the ones I have, although they were £49.99 when I got them - :(

    These look like the ones for me then =)

    Thanks

    That's a higher spec than mine, I can assure you it does have xenons but no washers!

    has it got xenon marked on the headlamp just under the projector?

    • Author

    Ok, seend the 2 kits below on ebay, read a lot about the canbus ones causing problems with the ECU, the canbus ones are twice as expensive. If I get the non canbus ones will they work ok without recoding?

    This is what the seller says :

    Full Money refund (including postage) if the kit does not work on your car.

    all new shape cars have CAN BUS system, almost all HID kit in the market can not work well on these cars,

    there are problems such as, light can not turn on, light turn off automaticlly when start car and bulb fault warning on the dash etc.

    The HID kits come with special ballasts have building in decdoers which can solve the problems.

    No Canbus : http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/330379335700?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2648#ht_5025wt_905

    With Canbus : http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=370440024720

    Please no more replies about legality, this isn't constructive and there is plenty of info on the other posts. It's my risk and I just want to get the right ones :think:

    Ok, seend the 2 kits below on ebay, read a lot about the canbus ones causing problems with the ECU, the canbus ones are twice as expensive. If I get the non canbus ones will they work ok without recoding?

    This is what the seller says :

    Full Money refund (including postage) if the kit does not work on your car.

    all new shape cars have CAN BUS system, almost all HID kit in the market can not work well on these cars,

    there are problems such as, light can not turn on, light turn off automaticlly when start car and bulb fault warning on the dash etc.

    The HID kits come with special ballasts have building in decdoers which can solve the problems.

    No Canbus : http://www.ebay.co.u...8#ht_5025wt_905

    With Canbus : http://www.ebay.co.u...em=370440024720

    Please no more replies about legality, this isn't constructive and there is plenty of info on the other posts. It's my risk and I just want to get the right ones :think:

    Yes, but you will have the headlight warning on:

    http://www.briskoda.net/forums/topic/237185-canbus-hid-kit/page__view__findpost__p__2787126

    ....all the re-code appears to do is tell the ECU that there's a different configuration of light at the end of the cable and behave accordingly.

    Personally, I'd go for the non-CANbus ones and re-code accordingly. (Is more in-line with how Skoda would have done it from the factory). If you don't code, the warning will be on all the time and you won't know if there's another bulb out (e.g. brake light)

    • Author

    The HID kit has been delivered. I tried one side out and if I switch it on with just the ignition on all is fine but if I start the engine and put the light on the HID flickers and goes off. All ok again when I turn off the engine. Is this because I haven't coded them yet?

    Probably, did you only do one side?

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