Hello all.

I was driving along the M54 recently and they are preparing a large stretch of it for roadworks. In the olden days this would have meant sticking some cones out and a portacabin for the provision of tea. But now I see they've installed some average cameras; and they certainly don't look temporary! They've been installed on proper concrete foundations which I imagine must have cost quite a fair whack. I can't help thinking that after going to all that effort, and expense, that they will be reluctant to remove them once the roadworks are finished. And that really scares me as it is just one very small step away from a Big Brother utopia society.

Does anyone know how much it costs to install these average cameras? Don't get me wrong I appreciate the need to contain and control speed when people are working on the roadside, but this can be achieved through effective education and policing. I don't see the need in being made to drive at 50mph along a perfectly normal piece of motorway for mile after mile for no apparent reason (see the M62 for proof).

Moreover, how effective are they as I always seem to see people travelling in excess of the 50mph speed restriction despite the presence of the yellow average cameras looming ominously overhead...

We've had them on the M62 near Leeds for years now. There was some news article a while ago where they showed they pulled in a huge amount of money. The roadworks are there to put up permanent variable speed cameras...

We just use CC at 50 through them, will be more annoying when they're variable.

I too have seen a lot of people sailing past them and a number who brake suddenly as they get to each one, I presume they don't know how they work until they get some SP30s through the post.

This is just typically symptomatic of a government that thinks all road problems ever are the result of exceeding speed limits. More and more people are driving like idiots, or with lights out etc, I've even seen a few cars now where the wheels are wobbling and about to fall off (I always try and flag them down) because all the police have been replaced with speed cameras because that's the only thing that causes a danger on roads. Sigh.

skodanonrman, they are not temporary by any means! Road works in this country last decades LOL.

@Huskoda - educatin people? No chance, most get all the eduction they need from sitcoms and The Sun (the educated lot ) the rest doesn't even read anything... Speed cameras are there to provide income and have absolutely nothing to do with road safety, another general public brainwash. There is enough (not widely publicised and discredited in most cases by village idiots thinkiong that speed is the devil incarnate) evidence to prove speed camers have no effect on road safety. In some cases removal of them improced safety records!

The cameras have to be securely attached to the ground, down south we have had them for ages. Even temporary ones are mounted to proper concrete bases which are then removed when the roadworks have finished,

@Huskoda - I see many of the variable speed limits signs on the gantrys are accompanied by a speed camera on the rear of the signs.

Great, mile after mile of these things on the M62 now.

Welcome to the future of motorway driving :(

I wouldn't say that they don't work at all. I would be quite happy for a speed camera to be outside every school in the nation, but they should be used in combination with other road safety measures. Studies have shown removing road markings improves road safety in town IIRC.

Mannyo, I see what you're saying; but the whole thing looks very permanent and that not being the case, it must be very costly to erect and then remove afterwards. All leads to my belief that they aren't put there on road safety grounds at all.

@Huskoda - I see many of the variable speed limits signs on the gantrys are accompanied by a speed camera on the rear of the signs.

Great, mile after mile of these things on the M62 now.

Welcome to the future of motorway driving :(

I am led to believe that the cameras mounted on the gantries on motorways, like on the M6 near B'ham, are only active when the variable speed limit is in place.

I am led to believe that the cameras mounted on the gantries on motorways, like on the M6 near B'ham, are only active when the variable speed limit is in place.

Until some bright spark realises there is some money to be made by switching them on permenantly.

I have come to the conclusion that over 80% of drivers actually dont know what the word Average means, and over 50% of the cars that are breaking this limit have Cruise !!!!!!!

Having seen lots of drivers doing 60-70 & the brake lights come on when they see the camera actaully makes me wonder most times if the driver should actauly have a driving licence.

Last November coming back down the M1 toward the M25 where there were avg cameras I actually had a truck very close to the back of me trying to bully me to exceeding the limit when i had my CC set at 50 ( prob 48 in real ), he overtook me & honked his horn which made me howl with laughter.

Now these roadworks have gone from the M1 i have seen the overhead cameras slowly dissappearing.

When I am in a car equipped with cruise control I generally set it at 52mph.

When I am in a car equipped with cruise control I generally set it at 52mph.

53mph here, probably could get away with higher but it usually keeps me up with the flow.

Except for the odd car that zooms through at about 80mph.

We've had them on the M62 near Leeds for years now. There was some news article a while ago where they showed they pulled in a huge amount of money. The roadworks are there to put up permanent variable speed cameras...

We just use CC at 50 through them, will be more annoying when they're variable.

I too have seen a lot of people sailing past them and a number who brake suddenly as they get to each one, I presume they don't know how they work until they get some SP30s through the post.

This is just typically symptomatic of a government that thinks all road problems ever are the result of exceeding speed limits. More and more people are driving like idiots, or with lights out etc, I've even seen a few cars now where the wheels are wobbling and about to fall off (I always try and flag them down) because all the police have been replaced with speed cameras because that's the only thing that causes a danger on roads. Sigh.

Idiots!! We had a geezer in a white Peugeot Partner van cut us up on the M23 last week as he pulled off a junction and was laughing as we passed! What a ******! I have to say that a lot of idiots seem to drive a certain German marque that is not a part of the VAG group!

Also the road works on the A23 north of Brighton are 40mph even when there is no work going on late at night.

My trips around the south side of the m25 have been quicker with those ave speed cameras up. i dont mind them, the amount i did last weeks got me just over 300 miles out 1 tank in the octymk1

I did lots of driving in my 5-Series over the past weeken. Almost all drivers were in terminal shock as I kept to 70mph on CC, was stuck to left lane of dual carriageway, was letting right lane drives go by while on approach to slower moving lorries even if it meant slowing down instead of cutting them off by changing lanes - I reckon my actions alone improved Beemer drivers rep by 75%

Well, 8 road workers have been killed on M'Ways in the last 3 years.

I (many years ago) used to work in Civil Engineering on M'Ways, and saw first hand what it's like.

As far as I'm concerned, you can be as paranoid about ASC's in roadworks as you like, I like ASC's and wish we'd had them back in my day.

As regards the fixed, permanent traffic management ones, as someone said above, where they are in use (mainly during rush hours) they do in fact speed the traffic flow up. Instead of the d!ck heads who fly down a slip road and immediately try to force their way across to the outside lane causing sudden waves of braking, traffic tends to simply carry on moving at 40 / 50 / 60 mph.

I'm all for improving work place safety and in that regard I support ASC's, but I think they should be used in conjunction with education - anyone remember those signs of the little boy at the side of the road that says "my dad works here" or something to that affect? I also don't think they should go on for mile after mile before and after the 100m of roadworks. Nor do I think it needs to be strictly 50mph when no work is taking place. And I vehemently suggest they are removed the very instant the roadworks are completed.

They had variable speed cameras on the new M8/9 function to the Forth Bridge approach road for many months and removed them once work was finished.

The average speed cameras around Newport are awful. Up and down between 50 and 70mph and all to calm traffic down around the tunnels. And what's on the traffic report every weekday? The tunnels reporting an accident

Makes me laugh seeing people fly through average speed checks, braking each time they approach a camera!

I on the other hand keep my speed up until I see the first camera coming, then I adjust my speed for when I get clocked by it then keep to the limit. I find doing this pretty useful as I come across plenty of "average speed check" areas with no cameras on them.

IIRC the contracts for works on the motorway by the highways agency include a requirement to install the cameras.

Also they need quite beefy foundations because of the shape of of the gantry, you don't want it falling onto the carriageway.

The matrix signs have serious foundations, often piled, as the forces which act on them are very lopsided.

A normal Gatso camera by comparison is just a box on a pole and are quite happy with a smallish lump of concrete.

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To be honest, with regard to these average and variable speed limit cameras I would be happy if they did activate them permanently.

To be honest, with regard to these average and variable speed limit cameras I would be happy if they did activate them permanently.

I'd be happier if they replaced the damn things with a police car to improve the standards of driving.

I'd be happier if they replaced the damn things with a police car to improve the standards of driving.

Absolutely! The blue line is far too thin.

Yes the M62 is a joke From chain bar to nearly Doncaster average 50 cameras,. A month ago a Belgian plated Hgv Artic passed me at 70 in the outside lane he was tailgating me before that ( about a foot away, he hung back then blasted past.I blew my horn, then he stamped on his brakes locking the wheels on the trailer as we levelled next to each other he swore at me with more expletives than I have ever heard in a COCKNEY ACCENT ! the tractor unit had gb plates on it although left hand drive. As others have posted quite a few speed up then slow . Even this is not the scariest , at the very end of the average limit, 200 yards before it you have an entry slip so cars are arriving onto the motorway where traffic in all 3 lanes are still doing bang on 50 , they then weave in and around, going to be a huge smash one day .

I've got an idea on this . It's called self financing road works . First DOT ( or whatever fancy title they now use) decide that a stretch of major road needs a repair. Then a bean counter works out the cost /how long and the frustration factor of various speed limits . Then the realtionship between the cost and the frustration factor is worked out . That produces a speed limit for the stretch. Next stick in speed cameras/average speed cameras . Their job is to raise the cash for the project. Nice /neat =no cost to road budget ,as said SELF FINANCING