After sale Bi-xenon mount

[langers2k]

I've changed headlight to OE bi-xenon  and tried to adapting it without a malfunction.  I've bought adapter from 9 pin to 7 pin , and I failed to make the lighting stable and always when it work, it`s illuminate and then shut down for more than three time then works...is there any ideas for coding ...? 

 My car octavia mk3 2015 and here you are my scan befor installation:

 

Got an scan after installation and list of what you've changed?

 

Did you compare the adapters to the stock wiring diagrams for your car and a xenon equipped modules to make sure they are correct wired?

 

I assume you fitted a xenon controller as well to avoid blinding other road users with lights that won't automatically or even manually adjust without a screwdriver?

[hpoct]

Hi, has anyone managed to successfully install OEM xenon headlights into their Mk3 Octavia?

[hpoct]

On 26/04/2016 at 16:36, langers2k said:

 

Got an scan after installation and list of what you've changed?

 

Did you compare the adapters to the stock wiring diagrams for your car and a xenon equipped modules to make sure they are correct wired?

 

I assume you fitted a xenon controller as well to avoid blinding other road users with lights that won't automatically or even manually adjust without a screwdriver?

Did you manage an OEM xenon install on an Octavia mk3?

[langers2k]

10 hours ago, hpoct said:

Did you manage an OEM xenon install on an Octavia mk3?

 

I've done it on a MK2 FL Octavia and it's probably a similar process on the MK3. It'll just be different part numbers and slightly different wiring

[hpoct]

1 hour ago, langers2k said:

 

I've done it on a MK2 FL Octavia and it's probably a similar process on the MK3. It'll just be different part numbers and slightly different wiring

Amazing, i'm assuming your car has headlight washers but no auto levelling? Was the auto levelling built into the light itself and have other motorists ever flashed at you?

 

In terms of parts:

LHS xenon with LED headlight

RHS xenon with LED headlight

2 x ballasts

2 x wiring looms

 

Is there anything else i need to consider or purchase?

Where did you purchase your wiring loom from and how is it wired up? via the fuse box or joined into existing headlight wiring?

 

Thanks.

[langers2k]

4 minutes ago, hpoct said:

Amazing, i'm assuming your car has headlight washers but no auto levelling? Was the auto levelling built into the light itself and have other motorists ever flashed at you?

 

Correct, my car had headlight washers as standard.

 

When I added the xenons, I also added the AFS module and level sensors so it works exactly the same as any factory installed xenon headlights. The self levelling components worked out cheaper than a single headlight so I never considered not installing them. My retrofit is covered here: https://www.briskoda.net/forums/topic/391916-fl-xenon-retrofit/

 

You need to be aware that the headlight range dial in the cabin will not work with xenon headlights, the only way to adjust the level will be using a screwdriver. You will cause glare to other drivers when under acceleration or if the rear of the car is loaded...

 

8 minutes ago, hpoct said:

In terms of parts:

LHS xenon with LED headlight

RHS xenon with LED headlight

2 x ballasts

2 x wiring looms

 

Is there anything else i need to consider or purchase?

 

Assuming you just want xenons, that's probably enough. You might find the LEDs also have a separate power module.

 

Personally, I would also add 2x control modules, AFS module and level sensors to make it road legal.

 

9 minutes ago, hpoct said:

Where did you purchase your wiring loom from and how is it wired up? via the fuse box or joined into existing headlight wiring?

 

I grabbed a wiring kit for a MK6 Golf from aliexpress as it was the cheapest way to get all the connectors. I did modify the adaptors to fit the Octavia wiring as the pinout was different to the MK6 Golf. You'll need to check the wiring diagrams for the MK3 with and without xenons to be sure of what changes are needed.

 

Assuming you skip the levelling, the adaptors can probably be fitted between the existing headlight connectors and the headlights although you'll need to double check if the LED modules need any extra connections.

 

In my case, I added the following extra wiring:

- adaptor between existing headlight wiring to new headlights as the connectors were different

- each headlight to the AFS module (CAN high and CAN low)

- each headlight to the fusebox (power for xenon control module)

- front level sensor to the AFS module (power, ground, signal)

- rear level sensor to the AFS module (power, ground, signal)

- AFS module to CAN gateway (CAN high and CAN low)

- AFS module to fusebox (power/ground)

 

It might be worth reading this thread about a MK7 Golf xenon retrofit (should be electronically similar to the MK3 Octavia), the pinout might be slightly different for the Octavia headlights:  http://www.golfmk7.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29237

 

You can also get the wiring diagrams for your car from https://erwin.skoda-auto.cz/erwin/showHome.do

[hpoct]

On 01/09/2017 at 11:48, langers2k said:

 

Correct, my car had headlight washers as standard.

 

When I added the xenons, I also added the AFS module and level sensors so it works exactly the same as any factory installed xenon headlights. The self levelling components worked out cheaper than a single headlight so I never considered not installing them. My retrofit is covered here: https://www.briskoda.net/forums/topic/391916-fl-xenon-retrofit/

 

You need to be aware that the headlight range dial in the cabin will not work with xenon headlights, the only way to adjust the level will be using a screwdriver. You will cause glare to other drivers when under acceleration or if the rear of the car is loaded...

 

 

Assuming you just want xenons, that's probably enough. You might find the LEDs also have a separate power module.

 

Personally, I would also add 2x control modules, AFS module and level sensors to make it road legal.

 

 

I grabbed a wiring kit for a MK6 Golf from aliexpress as it was the cheapest way to get all the connectors. I did modify the adaptors to fit the Octavia wiring as the pinout was different to the MK6 Golf. You'll need to check the wiring diagrams for the MK3 with and without xenons to be sure of what changes are needed.

 

Assuming you skip the levelling, the adaptors can probably be fitted between the existing headlight connectors and the headlights although you'll need to double check if the LED modules need any extra connections.

 

In my case, I added the following extra wiring:

- adaptor between existing headlight wiring to new headlights as the connectors were different

- each headlight to the AFS module (CAN high and CAN low)

- each headlight to the fusebox (power for xenon control module)

- front level sensor to the AFS module (power, ground, signal)

- rear level sensor to the AFS module (power, ground, signal)

- AFS module to CAN gateway (CAN high and CAN low)

- AFS module to fusebox (power/ground)

 

It might be worth reading this thread about a MK7 Golf xenon retrofit (should be electronically similar to the MK3 Octavia), the pinout might be slightly different for the Octavia headlights:  http://www.golfmk7.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29237

 

You can also get the wiring diagrams for your car from https://erwin.skoda-auto.cz/erwin/showHome.do

That's great.  Very helpful. I will indeed want to get the setup legal, and will ask a local garage to fine tune the right levels once is all setup. 

 

- with the dazzling other motorists you mentioned, was that because the auto levelling on the horizontal plane doesn't work? 

 

- do the drl function still work with the led in the new headlights? Similar to vrs models that have led built into the xenon headlights

 

- I don't know what CAN means but I'm sure I will once the wiring is getting done

 

Thanks

[langers2k]

1 minute ago, hpoct said:

- with the dazzling other motorists you mentioned, was that because the auto levelling on the horizontal plane doesn't work? 

 

You'll be dazzling other motorists as you'll have no way to adjust the headlights whilst driving.

 

Without the AFS module and level sensors installed you won't get:

- automatic up/down adjustment - this is to meet ECE regs therefore making it road legal

- manual up/down adjustment -  as the headlight range adjustment on the dashboard will not work

- automatic left/right adjustment - also known as 'bend' lighting or dynamic cornering lights

- AFS driving modes

 

If you adjust the headlights to the correct MOT height while stationary, you will still dazzle any oncoming motorists when you accelerate or have any weight in the boot.

 

3 minutes ago, hpoct said:

- do the drl function still work with the led in the new headlights? Similar to vrs models that have led built into the xenon headlights

 

I can't know for sure, but if you duplicate the factory wiring and coding with the right modules, there is no obvious reason it shouldn't.

 

4 minutes ago, hpoct said:

- I don't know what CAN means but I'm sure I will once the wiring is getting done

 

CAN bus is a communication method used between different control modules in the car. From a wiring side, it's basically a twisted pair of wires...

[hpoct]

2 hours ago, langers2k said:

You'll be dazzling other motorists as you'll have no way to adjust the headlights whilst driving.

 

Without the AFS module and level sensors installed you won't get:

- automatic up/down adjustment - this is to meet ECE regs therefore making it road legal

- manual up/down adjustment -  as the headlight range adjustment on the dashboard will not work

- automatic left/right adjustment - also known as 'bend' lighting or dynamic cornering lights

- AFS driving modes

 

If you adjust the headlights to the correct MOT height while stationary, you will still dazzle any oncoming motorists when you accelerate or have any weight in the boot.

 

Do Skoda's (and other vehicles) with xenon installed as standard from the factory, also dazzle drivers when accelerating or with weight in the boot? Or is it just with aftermarket xenon installs (albeit with genuine components)? I want the totally standard fitting. I thought the AFS would balance out the lights when accelerating etc. I would most definitely have AFS installed too, based on the above anyway.

 

Did you need to get to the fuse box behind the glovebox (i think there is one), or just wired up to the one in the the engine bay?

 

2 hours ago, langers2k said:

I can't know for sure, but if you duplicate the factory wiring and coding with the right modules, there is no obvious reason it shouldn't.

 

 

Does your vehicle have LED lights? Any chance you're able to share a photo of your headlights switched on and off? 

2 hours ago, langers2k said:

CAN bus is a communication method used between different control modules in the car. From a wiring side, it's basically a twisted pair of wires...

 

Do you recall where you purchased your wiring loom from?

[langers2k]

1 minute ago, hpoct said:

Do Skoda's (and other vehicles) with xenon installed as standard from the factory, also dazzle drivers when accelerating or with weight in the boot? Or is it just with aftermarket xenon installs (albeit with genuine components)? I want the totally standard fitting. I thought the AFS would balance out the lights when accelerating etc. I would most definitely have AFS installed too, based on the above anyway.

 

 

I think we've misunderstood each other at some point.

 

If you fit the headlight controllers,  AFS module and level sensors, then it will work exactly like a factory install and will not dazzle other road uses when correctly set up. The car will correctly adjust the headlight aim for acceleration and loading the boot.

 

I was making the point that if you fit the headlights without the headlight controllers, AFS module and level senors, it will cause glare as neither you or the car can adjust the headlight aim.

 

 

1 minute ago, hpoct said:

Did you need to get to the fuse box behind the glovebox (i think there is one), or just wired up to the one in the the engine bay?

 

You'd need to check the wiring diagram from your car.

 

1 minute ago, hpoct said:

Does your vehicle have LED lights? Any chance you're able to share a photo of your headlights switched on and off? 

 

No stock LED lighting on a non-vRS MK2 FL Octavia I'm afraid :(

 

1 minute ago, hpoct said:

Do you recall where you purchased your wiring loom from?

 

Aliexpress, it would have been something like this: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Headlight-Cornering-AFS-Xenon-Headlight-Auto-Leveling-Range-Wire-cable-Harness-For-VW-Volkswagen-Golf/32369054021.html?spm=2114.search0104.8.13.FnVX8e&transAbTest=ae803_2

 

Please note that is for a MK6 Golf which is similar to my MK2 FL Octavia. Your MK3 will be more similar to a MK7 Golf so I don't know if the loom is any use to you.

 

If you really want to go ahead with this, you'll need to spend time researching the wiring changes between xenon and non-xenon MK3 Octavias. You'll also need to find out which connectors are needed and either find a suitable loom or make your own.

 

It might also be worth contacting hazzydayz, they offer to retrofit AFS/auto-levelling on a MK7 Golf which should be similar: https://www.hazzydayz.com/genuine-vw-audi-afs-with-auto-levelling---supply--fit-6205-p.asp

[hpoct]

On 05/09/2017 at 20:33, langers2k said:

If you fit the headlight controllers,  AFS module and level sensors, then it will work exactly like a factory install and will not dazzle other road uses when correctly set up. The car will correctly adjust the headlight aim for acceleration and loading the boot.

 

Is the AFS sensor connected to the levelling arms you had installed onto the suspension arms, that level out the car during acceleration/deceleration/heavy boot? I thought the xenon headlamps (bi-xenon on mk3?) had the functionality for the light to adjusted on x and y axis to counteract this?

 

Are the suspension arms required for a legal fit too?

 

Were the suspension arms difficult to install? as you have to go under the car!

[langers2k]

32 minutes ago, hpoct said:

Is the AFS sensor connected to the levelling arms you had installed onto the suspension arms, that level out the car during acceleration/deceleration/heavy boot? I thought the xenon headlamps (bi-xenon on mk3?) had the functionality for the light to adjusted on x and y axis to counteract this?

 

Inside the headlight there are two motors to move the xenon projector, one for each axis, these are connected to an AFS slave on the headlight body.

 

The two AFS slaves (one for each headlight) are connected to the AFS master which is normally in the cabin somewhere.

 

The AFS master is connected to the suspension level sensor(s) and also to the appropriate CAN network to communicate with other modules, for example the steering assist module.

 

The AFS master takes the data such as speed, steering angle and suspension level to calculate where each headlight should aim. It will send messages to each AFS slave which in turn will move the headlight motors.

 

32 minutes ago, hpoct said:

Are the suspension arms required for a legal fit too?

 

Yes, you need the suspension level sensors for a legal retrofit. Without them, the AFS master won't know if the car is pitching and therefore if it needs to adjust the headlights up/down.

 

32 minutes ago, hpoct said:

Were the suspension arms difficult to install? as you have to go under the car!

 

For the MK2 FL Octativa they were trivial to install, you'd need to double check the MK3 case but I'd be surprised if it were massively different.

 

Jacked up the front passenger side, took the wheel off, added the level sensor with two bolts in existing holes and ran wiring to behind the glovebox.

Jacked up the rear passenger side, added 5 rivnuts to existing holes in the suspension arms, added the level sensor with five bolts and ran wiring inside the cabin.

 

In both cases, the wiring followed the existing path used by the ABS sensors.

[hpoct]

16 minutes ago, langers2k said:

Yes, you need the suspension level sensors for a legal retrofit. Without them, the AFS master won't know if the car is pitching and therefore if it needs to adjust the headlights up/down.

 

aah, i think i get this now, the suspension arms looked like they adjusted the height of the car, however they are just sensors, connected to AFS master, which connects to each headlight and into the CAN network (brains of the car).

 

17 minutes ago, langers2k said:

Jacked up the front passenger side, took the wheel off, added the level sensor with two bolts in existing holes and ran wiring to behind the glovebox.

Jacked up the rear passenger side, added 5 rivnuts to existing holes in the suspension arms, added the level sensor with five bolts and ran wiring inside the cabin.

Was it advised for your model that only 2 sensors were needed, and for them both to fitted on the passenger side? Wiring into the cabin won't be fun...

 

Would the level sensors only fit in a certain way, so you couldn't get it wrong?

 

So my shopping list looks something on the lines of:

- 2 x bi-xenon headlights with 2 x ballasts

- 2 x adaptors between existing headlight wiring to new headlights

- AFS master module and connect to CAN gateway (CAN high and CAN low) and to fusebox (power/ground)

- Wiring to connect each headlight to the fusebox for power
- 1 x AFS master module, connects to headlights, level sensors and CAN gateway
- Front level sensor to the AFS module (power, ground, signal)

- Rear level sensor to the AFS module (power, ground, signal)

- 2 x AFS slave control modules connecting to each headlight and AFS master module

 

Did you need slave AFS modules too between the headlights and AFS master?

 

I've started a schematic (very basic) of how i expect the wiring to look like.

[langers2k]

6 minutes ago, hpoct said:

Was it advised for your model that only 2 sensors were needed, and for them both to fitted on the passenger side? Wiring into the cabin won't be fun...

 

Would the level sensors only fit in a certain way, so you couldn't get it wrong?

 

All MK2 FL Octavia's with factory xenons got two level sensors. On a MK6 Golf, some only had the rear sensor and others had both.

 

The front sensor was obvious, the rear need the arm pointing outwards. Ideally, you should have a look under a MK3 Octavia with factory xenons to check. I'm sure someone here would be able to take a picture.

 

6 minutes ago, hpoct said:

So my shopping list looks something on the lines of:
- 2 x bi-xenon headlights with 2 x ballasts
- 2 x adaptors between existing headlight wiring to new headlights
- AFS master module and connect to CAN gateway (CAN high and CAN low) and to fusebox (power/ground)
- Wiring to connect each headlight to the fusebox for power
- 1 x AFS master module, connects to headlights, level sensors and CAN gateway
- Front level sensor to the AFS module (power, ground, signal)
- Rear level sensor to the AFS module (power, ground, signal)
- 2 x AFS slave control modules connecting to each headlight and AFS master module

 

Did you need slave AFS modules too between the headlights and AFS master?

 

Yup, I added the AFS slave modules. Without them the headlights won't be able to adjust. They are normally attached to the headlight body somewhere.

 

6 minutes ago, hpoct said:

I've started a schematic (very basic) of how i expect the wiring to look like.

 

Looks about what I'd expect apart from the level sensors probably get power from the AFS master.

 

This is a great schematic for the additional wiring needed on for MK6 Golf with a single level sensor.

 

It will be different for your car but should give a good idea of what's needed.

[hpoct]

A few questions  @langers2k:

 

• Is the ballast for mk2 FL inside each of the headlights? Does the HID bulb usually match the wattage of the ballast? i.e. 55w.
• I don't think i understand wiring schematics very well . Where did you get the one for your vehicle? Erwin?
• Did you use an adaptor with the original headlight wiring to connect the xenon headlamps?
• Where did you install the AFS sensor, behind the car stereo?
• Where was the CAN gateway to hookup the AFS?

Thanks.

[langers2k]

A few answers for you @hpoct

 

- On the MK2 FL, the ballast is attached to the rear of the headlight

- Both the stock ballast and xenon capsule are 35W

- For wiring, I used erwin to compare the halogen and xenon based cars to see the difference

- Correct, there is an adaptor between the existing headlight connector and the xenon headlight

- The AFS master is fitted under the headunit (behind the AC panel) in the MK2 FL, you'd need to check for the MK3

- It's in the drivers footwell for the MK2 FL, I think it might be behind the glovebox in the MK3, worth double checking

 

At this point, it's probably worth buying an hours access to erwin to at confirm the wiring. I was €7 + tax for an hour when I last used it and make you you can print to pdf to keep a record of any diagrams you find.

 

I'd be tempted to go through and 'print' as many relevant diagrams as you can then review them when you're not using up access time.

[hpoct]

1 hour ago, langers2k said:

A few answers for you @hpoct

 

- On the MK2 FL, the ballast is attached to the rear of the headlight

- Both the stock ballast and xenon capsule are 35W

- For wiring, I used erwin to compare the halogen and xenon based cars to see the difference

- Correct, there is an adaptor between the existing headlight connector and the xenon headlight

- The AFS master is fitted under the headunit (behind the AC panel) in the MK2 FL, you'd need to check for the MK3

- It's in the drivers footwell for the MK2 FL, I think it might be behind the glovebox in the MK3, worth double checking

 

At this point, it's probably worth buying an hours access to erwin to at confirm the wiring. I was €7 + tax for an hour when I last used it and make you you can print to pdf to keep a record of any diagrams you find.

 

I'd be tempted to go through and 'print' as many relevant diagrams as you can then review them when you're not using up access time.

Great tips @langers2k. I'll try erwin and see where that gets me. 

 

I'm also evaluating the level of work needed, to help decide whether I will do it or not! As I can imagine deep pockets are needed if done by a car garage. 

[hpoct]

Does anyone know where the ballast is usually installed on a mk3 Octavia for OEM xenon headlights? i.e. under the headlights, elsewhere in the engine bay.

Edited 15 September, 2017 by hpoct

[langers2k]

1 hour ago, hpoct said:

Does anyone know where the ballast is usually installed on a mk3 Octavia for OEM xenon headlights? i.e. under the headlights, elsewhere in the engine bay.

 

You can see all three control modules on this used headlight: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/222421197738

- the sliver one on the side is the ballast

- the black one on the bottom is the AFS slave

- the silver one on the bottom is the LED driver

[hpoct]

On 15/09/2017 at 17:11, langers2k said:

 

You can see all three control modules on this used headlight: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/222421197738

- the sliver one on the side is the ballast

- the black one on the bottom is the AFS slave

- the silver one on the bottom is the LED driver

Well spotted, thanks!