skoda fabia rough start

[Evil Miyagi]

I've found this with mine and have found a fix... personally I park facing down hill and when I start the engine normally sounds rough (and shakes a little).  All I do is put the car into reverse and then back into park and it stops.

 

I'm presuming its just a symptom of where I park.  Other than that, the car runs fine.

 

edit - I'm in work so can't view your video.

 

EM

[Ootohere]

Sounds perfect to me on the start up.  

(but then i maybe am mutton geoff.)

 

Listening again, the starter does seem a bit noisy, but thats maybe just the good recording.

 

best see what others think.

[PaddyVRS]

Just did my first recording - I do not know if I was getting crazy yesterday evening or if it was like this. Will keep recording more cold starts and share them later, here is the first (after approx 12 hours sitting outside).

 

 

Sounds just like mine, which is 3 years old and I don't have any other problems with. Mine also starts immediately once warmed up. Possibly takes a full crank to get the fuel through? Never had anything longer than in your video. 

 

Mine also occasionally is a bit rough when cold starting but it settles once it gets to 800 RPM. Will be doing a spark plug change soon and will see how that affects things (if at all!)

[fabiamk2SE]

zard, exactly as you described.

I did a cold start there, 2.5*oC outside, car starts on the turn of the key, and goes to 1,100 rpm, but i had to wait 1 minute and it slowly and smoothly dropped to 800 rpm.

so, Stopped the engine, restarted, straight to 1,100 rpm and 1 minute it was down to 800 rpm.

Isnt that just the automatic choke mate? Very normal isnt it.

[fabiamk2SE]

Have you at all blipped the throttle just after start up by any chance?

Iv done this on the polo once (not alot just a little) and it confused it abit. It started surging the revs. Like it was turning the choke on/off. Soon settled down though

[zard]

Hi, another upload:

 

 

This time the starting took slightly longer - is it still within "normal" limits? I've also kept recording until revs came down to 800.

Edited 16 January, 2014 by zard

[Ootohere]

Certainly not a quick starter.

Not something that would cause me worry, but i would be having the battery checked again, just to see if it is 100%.

 

But there are several other things that might effect it.

 Over and above how it had been driven before stopping the car, but lets assume normally driven.

 

?

Has it had a ECU Upgrade/update from the Skoda Database, or as Skoda call it, Software enhancement?

What fuel is it running on, is it 98 ron or higher octane?

Has the air filter been checked for condition or changed in its life time?

 

The engine is just the same Base Engine as all other 1.4tsi (1390cc) then it has some extra bits and pieces,

then more sensors due to having super charger and turbo charger.

 

It should just start and sound like any other 1.4 tsi, regardless of the power, 105, 122, 140 ps etc.

 

If any doubt maybe go to a Dealership and ask to start a new one, ask to start a used one,

if they are different from yours, then ask a Technician why yours runs differently or starts differently.

 

george

[zard]

Certainly not a quick starter.

Not something that would cause me worry, but i would be having the battery checked again, just to see if it is 100%.

 

But there are several other things that might effect it.

 Over and above how it had been driven before stopping the car, but lets assume normally driven.

 

?

Has it had a ECU Upgrade/update from the Skoda Database, or as Skoda call it, Software enhancement?

What fuel is it running on, is it 98 ron or higher octane?

Has the air filter been checked for condition or changed in its life time?

 

george

 

Thanks for looking! Here are some more details:

- air filter has only around 2000km on it

- the car was started from cold - not driven for around 15 hours since last start

- spark plugs have only around 1000km on it

- oil changed during last service (2000km) and does not seem to be an "oil burner"

- battery is 3.5 years old, as far as I know has not been changed

- it has gone through the regular skoda service and I got the tech guy pull the record but apparently they do not record if the software was updated or not

- running on 98RON

 

So far I never had to turn the key more than once but it does seem to take a bit long (like the last video)

 

 

Is there any way to check if the software is updated? I should be able to get a log of last VAGCOM scan, will see if I can see any version numbers,

Edited 16 January, 2014 by zard

[Ootohere]

Best see if the ECU requires an Update.

If he does not know, and can not check, or be sure what has been done, then who is going to?

 

If he was checking the Diagnostic, then the Technician can just be sure he applies the latest 'Software Enhancement' from the Skoda Database.

 

Do you know it has a new Air filter because you fitted it your self, or have looked and checked,

or are you going by what you have been told.?

 

http://skoda.co.uk/owners/service-and-maintenance/national-pricing/servicing

[zard]

The new filter was fitted as part of the last service (and is marked in the service book/report). It was serviced in an official dealership. (and I can see it as a part on the service log).

 

I guess the best would be to take it to the service again and have all of those questions answered. According to the link you sent, I had the "major service" done approx. 2000km ago. 

 

Thank you for the link to the known issues - I am not experiencing any issues apart from the slower start - if the car is warm, it starts up quickly, it's just the cold start that takes a moment. Also, I cannot see any engine judder or anything like this to suggest misfiring.

 

 

Also, apparently occasional long starts were the reason the previous owner had the high pressure fuel pump initially changed (and that apparently fixed the issue according to the service log). They then fit the pump that only lasted 2000km, so I am on a third one.

Edited 16 January, 2014 by zard

[Ootohere]

Just to be sure i would have a look in the air box and see if it is a new Filter, but probably it is fine.

 

From what you say it might well be the Fuel Pump or a sensor related to the Fuel pump if the previous owner also had issues.

 

You would expect that the Technicians would have been sure the ECU was on the latest updates,

but it does seem they were just learning as they go along.

(by the time the discontinue these engines they might of got the hang of them and maintaining them!)

 

The Technical link i put up before shows the complexity of the sensors.

Lets hope all is well now and you have a good fuel pump.

 

http://volkspage.net/technik/ssp/ssp/SSP_359.pdf

this is for the engine up to 125 kW, not the 132-136 kW, but the same basically.

page 26, 52, 54, among others.

[zard]

It really is all puzzling. I wonder if they just changed the fuel pump initially without actually fixing the underlying issue (and that caused wrong part fitting etc.). 

 

I suppose I will keep recording the starts and scanning the car and have a big check done before the warranty expires. Not sure how to do it though, as the problem is quite hard to replicate. I guess I will go to the service with a bunch of videos on my phone to show all the symptoms.

 

Lastly, on unrelated note that keeps coming back to me (and my insufficient knowledge of the engines) - is there any other fault that could cause a fuel pump to fail in mere 2000km? A fault that would not manifest itself in during the emissions check, nor the "major service" or would not produce any error codes?

[stratosg]

Hi Zard. Mine does the same as yours, especially in your second video. My car is a Roomster 1.2Tsi bought brand new at end of June 2010. It is about two months that has that startup delay only when cold after many hours of parking. If the engine is hot then it fires up instantly. No other problem occurs when engine runs idle or when speeding, no weird fuel consumption.

 

One last thing is that I noticed that when the ignition switch is on and the engine is off, my wipers or / and my electric windows are working a bit slower / heavier that used to be in the past. Then if the engine is fired up they work fine. I tend to believe that it is from the battery as the ambient temperature is low and the car is 3 1/2 old.

 

Time will tell, I am not going to give it any more attention than that. If it is battery it will die and then will be replaced, if it is high pressure fuel pump it will also be replaced after her death. There is nothing more to do than wait. I am not especially concerned as I have a road assistance, so a phone call and they will arrive.

Edited 16 January, 2014 by stratosg

[zard]

Hi Zard. Mine does the same as yours, especially in your second video. My car is a Roomster 1.2Tsi bought brand new at end of June 2010. It is about two months that has that startup delay only when cold after many hours of parking. If the engine is hot then it fires up instantly. No other problem occurs when engine runs idle or when speeding, no weird fuel consumption.

 

One last thing is that I noticed that when the ignition switch is on and the engine is off, my wipers or / and my electric windows are working a bit slower / heavier that used to be in the past. Then if the engine is fired up they work fine. I tend to believe that it is from the battery as the ambient temperature is low and the car is 3 1/2 old.

 

Time will tell, I am not going to give it any more attention than that. If it is battery it will die and then will be replaced, if it is high pressure fuel pump it will also be replaced after her death. There is nothing more to do than wait. I am not especially concerned as I have a road assistance, so a phone call and they will arrive.

 

Thank you very much for sharing! Just make sure it does not happen somewhere abroad (especially France) - they tend to take a long time before getting the car to a proper service :think:   .

[stratosg]

Oh! And forgot to mention that the car during service was plugged to Skoda VCDS in order to see if there were any errors kept in the ECU or if any update was available to download to the car but no errors or new versions of software was there.

 

Service took place at 30 of December. It was the three year or 60.000Km (52.500Km actually) service where oil, oil filter, fuel filter and spark plugs were replaced. The air filter was not replaced since I bought the car because dealer always found it "extremely clean" so no need to be changed. Indeed it is as clean as a brand new one. On the other hand black "marmelade" came off from the fuel filter.

Edited 16 January, 2014 by stratosg

[mrgf]

You also mention the battery being 3.5 years old… That could be well past its best, if not well kept! Some batteries die young, some last ten or twelve years but when they do go, they GO! No charging will bring them back to their best! Often, the charger will tell you they are fully charged but that just means "For the remaining capacity"… This may be too little for a good, clean start. A weak start will take longer in warm weather but come severe cold, it will just fail with little warning. It will start one time, fail the next! This can happen even if you have warmed the engine as its the ambient temp that matters, not the engine's.

 

In the Fabia, Assuming its the three cylinder variant, you have three huge pistons that need quite a bit of power to throw up and down the barrels. With four pots, you have four, smaller, easier to move pistons… I used to own a two pot Kawasaki and although the battery was half decent, it would let me down all too easily, struggling to spin the engine strongly enough to start, despite it sounding like it was spinning ok (ish) and as soon as it was replaced with a fresh battery, it went fine from then on. This was after consultation with a great local motorcycle service/repair shop. Again, a four pot might have turned well enough to not need the new battery for some time to come.

[stratosg]

Spot on sir!!

 

It's just that comparison thing with the past. Octavia's (1.6 mpi) battery was eight years old and was working like brand new till the day I sold her. But even Fabia's (1.2 12v 64Hp) was working fine since the day I sold her too, four years since she was born.

[zard]

Hi!

 

I've got an update after couple of weeks... I've gone into the mountains and subjected the car to sub-zero temperatures. The "problem" is still the same, though not exacerbated by the cold weather. It does not matter if I start the car at 10C or -1C: the time to start is still the same, if the engine is cold, it just takes a few more spins. Still no other issues, no fault codes ad if the engine is warm, then the start is instant.

[zard]

Update No.2 - I've now received VAGCOM.

 

Is there any procedure that could shed more light on what is exactly going on? What variables are the ones to monitor during the starting process to see what exactly is going on?

[stratosg]

I think your car, just like my car are just fine. At the end of the day it is a combination of metal and a bit of plastic. Do not think that I am a rich one who does not care about money. On the contrary, I am in a very tight by the time and the white fridge is our only car. If something goes wrong (the simplest) I will have major monetary problem in order to fix it.

 

BUT, I had a couple of very difficult moments (child's near death) a few years ago and a few heart arrhythmia of mine caused by excessive stress. Then I decided that it is better for material stuff (such as car, or ...) to die than me. Since that decision, thinks goes better, I try to keep my stress below normal limits ( :think: ) arrhythmia gone away. There is still a concern about things might go wrong (e.g. chain rattle sound occasionally), but just that, nothing more.

 

Ok!! I am off topic again

Edited 4 February, 2014 by stratosg

[MartynVRS]

I had a higher idle at warm with mine but this was also the same time I had a boost leak. Picked the car up today and it drove home fine. Got them to take photos of my spark plugs now it's done 30k when it was in for the service and apart from looking dirty they are fine. I don't see a need to change them.

[Ootohere]

Any Info on what Boost Pipe you needed replacing?

[antbVRS88]

Hi Guys

I have noticed when starting my wifes fabia that the engine rattles a bit.

Sounds like an older type car or V8 after you turn the key.

The enigine seems to shake slightly but noticeable ( running unround).

The outside temperature is about 24 degrees celcius so not cold at all.

It turns to normal after a minute or two but I found it still strange being a brandnew car (6month).

Any of you guys experienced the same? Surely can't be normal, right?

2012 Fabia RS 135kw.

I was told it's the oil getting round the engine. I.e. You turn off the engine over night oil settles down into the sump when you start in the morning or after a few hours, the rattle is just before the oil gets round and before you have any real oil pressure.

[Ootohere]

Not on a vRS Twincharger.

Turn the ignition on, start the engine and the oil is right up into the Filter and around the head,

and no worries about oil pressure.

There should be no rattle.

It fires right away, or should, the rpm goes to 1,100 & drops to 800rpm in under a minute.

or should.

 

If you have a rattle, i would want to know why,

and not believe the oil story.

[MartynVRS]

Any Info on what Boost Pipe you needed replacing?

No idea. On the top of the engine somewhere under the cover. It was just a pinhole leak as I could hear it under load and was enough to throw the EML on. Oddly it happened the day I picked the car up after it's service. All fine now. Also as a precaution I asked if it was worth having any of the additional breather pipes installed as I had one last year. They said it would do no harm since I'm still using a little oil, probably a litre every 3-4k but I keep the level when warm bang in the middle between the two marks. There was also a software update that they've added too.