Skoda Fabia 2010 SE TDI CR 90, Mileage ~122,000

 

Sorry for the dramatic title. But I just got back from a diagnostics done on my car - had some warning lights on and noticed loss of power (which one of my friends said is limp home mode). The diagnostics guy did the electronic test and said that the DPF is blocked and needs either removal or replacement, quoting me £600 and £1200+ (and with a quick Google it seems that the former option is dubious at best).

 

I can't pay that much, but obviously am worried about the idea of my engine catching fire, let alone the loss of power I'm currently experiencing. To say that I feel between a rock and a hard place is understatement of the year.

 

I am just very surprised because I do a lot of motorway driving, about 100 miles twice a week. I'm really worried about the bill, and I read about forced regeneration but I don't think the diagnostics guy mentioned it as a serious option. Perhaps because the DPF was too far gone, I don't know, I was a bit startled by the initial bad news.

 

If you could please give suggestions on what my options are, I really would be grateful. And whether it's reasonable for me to still drive my car. Thank you in advance.

Who was the car with, a Skoda Main Dealers workshop?

 

Is that 122,000 miles the car has done, ie averaging over 600 miles a week.?

Edited 14 January, 201511 yr by goneoffSKi

Oh I see. I bought it at 96K miles in August 2013, and up till there it had main dealer stamps in the service book. 

 

(I'm going to stop Googling now cos this is making me go mad, but I'm interested in alternatives such as forced regen or even cleaning if it works, anything that will bring the bill down and allow me to drive my car. I don't know if I have the time or strength to sell now, but I imagine I'll just get a rubbish price at this point anyway.)

Edited 14 January, 201511 yr by student91

I'm using my car morning and evening to get to my place of study. I can't tell if the loss of power is because of the clogged DPF or because of limp home mode. Diagnostics guy reckoned the former. I really hope it's safe until I figure out what to do.

I would have thought you would have got the flashing DPF light before the limp mode kicked in.  When the DPF light comes on you need to drive above 2.5k RPM until the light goes off.  Did you do this?

 

If you didn't, I would find someone that can kick off a forced regen on the dpf through the diagnostics port and go from there.  There are plenty of cleaning products and companies out there for them too.

On my 11plate monte I used to get a yellow light first for dpf

Only goes onto red light if you don't clear dpf then it's too late and it's limp mode

When my yellow light came on I used to drive up and down the local bypass in lower gears withe revs up past 3000.

10 minutes of that used to clear the light off

Dpf = worst idea ever imho

The dpf could well be at the end of it's life at 122,000 miles. However, it depends to a large extent as to how the vehicle has been treated during it's lifetime as to whether this is the case. Some taxi guys who run various Skoda estate cars including the 105ps Cr engined Fabia have covered over that mileage by quite some way and not had a dpf issue. That's mainly because the engines run hot all the time and get a good blast about to mitigate any town running they do. I take it the dpf pressure sensor was checked by the technician who attended. That's another source of this type of trouble causing limp mode to engage. If it goes faulty it sends a false 'dpf full' signal to the ecu. Hope you can get it fixed cheaply.

Edited 15 January, 201511 yr by Estate Man

I don't know if this is relevant / possible for the DPF on the VAG CR engines but when a work colleage had a potential full DPF issue on a Ford with around 120k miles recorded the dealer give the option of trying washing the DPF out for the cost of an hours labour before replacing it. Apparently this is routine with commercial vehicles.

He took this option and it resolved his problems for the few months before he sold the car.

The dpf could well be at the end of it's life at 122,000 miles. However, it depends to a large extent as to how the vehicle has been treated during it's lifetime as to whether this is the case. Some taxi guys who run various Skoda estate cars including the 105ps Cr engined Fabia have covered over that mileage by quite some way and not had a dpf issue. That's mainly because the engines run hot all the time and get a good blast about to mitigate any town running they do. I take it the dpf pressure sensor was checked by the technician who attended. That's another source of this type of trouble causing limp mode to engage. If it goes faulty it sends a false 'dpf full' signal to the ecu. Hope you can get it fixed cheaply.

 

Thank you. Interesting - could it possibly be a sensor fault? The technician plugged in the diagnostics wire under the steering wheel where the fuses are and opened the software on his laptop. Would this pick up if the sensor was not working correctly?

 

The car has been used mostly for motorway driving. But the technician said the DPF stopped regenerating itself, hence why the driving wasn't clearing it out (??).

I want to get it checked elsewhere, holding out hope on that, and on getting a forced regen which I've read about. Spoke to someone who said he'll put it in the correct mode and take it for a drive.

How much is a new DPF available for from an Online Vendor, not a Skoda Dealership?

Although you may be doing the miles to create regen conditions there may be an issue like failing her thermostat that stops the regent happening. Need to find out why its stopped regenerating as new one won't last long.

Also don't be tempted to try and live with it or your turbo will be next for replacement

We need more information.

It is important to understand which lights came on and in which order.

There is the DPF light, EML (Engine Management Light) and glowplug light.

The DPF doesn't just die. The car (through the dash lights) warns you of an impending issue.

The few exceptions to this is when there is a faulty sensor, but but his would have been diagnosed through the EML and a fault code read when the car was on the diagnostics.

The first light you normally see is the DPF light. This is the car telling you that it needs your help to clear the soot from inside the DPF. Your driving style isn't allowing either a passive or active regen. The instructions are detailed in the hand book.

If this doesn't work or the light is ignored then the car puts itself into limp-home mode with the EML / glow plug lights also appearing.

At this point you have to take it in for a forced regen, however there is a maximum soot content that will make a forced regen dangerous (risk of fire). If you have ignored the warnings and/or driven too far/long in limp-home mode then this is likely.

Ask the garage for the fault codes.

And finally all is not lost, if the ash content is indeed too high (ash is always held inside the DPF as a result of burning off the soot) and the DPF has reached the end of its useful life then aftermarket ones are readily available for £300 plus a few hours labour to fit them.

Removing it is possible but the forum legal police will be quick to dissuade you from doing this as at some point in the future (long after we've all gone) it will be detectable during the MOT and the car won't pass until you get one refitted, and they'll complain you are killing their kids with the increased emissions.

Cleaning it (removing it from the car and jet washing it out) is the same price as a new one (around £250) and will last only a few months.

Personally I would insist on a forced regen.

Get the fault codes to rule out a failed sensor.

If that doesn't work have the DPF professionally gutted.

Keep in the back of your mind afterwards that you may in the future need a new one fitting but I'm guessing at 122,000 miles the rest of the car will die before then and a new DPF will be the least of your worries.

Good luck!

Edited 16 January, 201511 yr by silver1011

Why cant they design a dpf that can be easily cleaned? Maybe Dyson could put their mind to work on one

silverline, many cars don't return a fault code for a dpf pressure sensor problem. Does it really do that on the Fabia? (I've not professionally teched on Fabias, I'm Toyota/Nissan/Honda trained). Changing the sensor over is often the only way to be sure I've found, but of course it needs calibrating before fitting to make sure you get a regen or the new sensor will cause a repeat limp mode situation after a few miles. Problem is, if the dpf is actually full, then the new sensor will do that anyway. New sensor is around the £45 mark.

We need more information.

It is important to understand which lights came on and in which order.

There is the DPF light, EML (Engine Management Light) and glowplug light.

The DPF doesn't just die. The car (through the dash lights) warns you of an impending issue.

The few exceptions to this is when there is a faulty sensor, but but his would have been diagnosed through the EML and a fault code read when the car was on the diagnostics.

The first light you normally see is the DPF light. This is the car telling you that it needs your help to clear the soot from inside the DPF. Your driving style isn't allowing either a passive or active regen. The instructions are detailed in the hand book.

If this doesn't work or the light is ignored then the car puts itself into limp-home mode with the EML / glow plug lights also appearing.

At this point you have to take it in for a forced regen, however there is a maximum soot content that will make a forced regen dangerous (risk of fire). If you have ignored the warnings and/or driven too far/long in limp-home mode then this is likely.

Ask the garage for the fault codes.

And finally all is not lost, if the ash content is indeed too high (ash is always held inside the DPF as a result of burning off the soot) and the DPF has reached the end of its useful life then aftermarket ones are readily available for £300 plus a few hours labour to fit them.

Removing it is possible but the forum legal police will be quick to dissuade you from doing this as at some point in the future (long after we've all gone) it will be detectable during the MOT and the car won't pass until you get one refitted, and they'll complain you are killing their kids with the increased emissions.

Cleaning it (removing it from the car and jet washing it out) is the same price as a new one (around £250) and will last only a few months.

Personally I would insist on a forced regen.

Get the fault codes to rule out a failed sensor.

If that doesn't work have the DPF professionally gutted.

Keep in the back of your mind afterwards that you may in the future need a new one fitting but I'm guessing at 122,000 miles the rest of the car will die before then and a new DPF will be the least of your worries.

Good luck!

 

Good sir this is extremely helpful. Whenever I go to a professional I have no idea what I'm asking for so this is very useful, I'll be sure to ask the right questions when I go on Tuesday.

 

He said he'll put it in regen mode and take it for a 30 min drive (any ideas on how much I should be paying for this?). My fear is that I'll take it to him, he'll do the diagnostics and - like you said - tell me that the soot content is too high for a forced regen. Or the car will not allow it because of the fault codes / warning lights / limp home mode.

 

I will ask for the fault codes. Ask whether it's possibly a sensor thing. Maybe I'll look on the forum for someone with a VCDS...though to be honest I'm fearful to drive just in case I tip over the limit in just these few days!!

 

And worst case scenario... an aftermarket one at £300 + labour... That is still a HECK of a lot better than £1200+ new. This has seriously calmed me down. I really appreciate your time, it's really helped me and I'm sure anyone who comes across this problem in future (not many have probably done as many miles as me just quite yet!).

I did a forced regen.  His DPF was at 88% and 90%+ is usually new DPF time.  With a forced regen and a 10 minute drive with VCDS plugged in, it was back down to 1%.  It was a nice toasty 10 minutes though as the car was cooking the exhaust the whole time   I would firstly plug VCDS in and find the measuring block which measures the DPF blockage %% - I think it's in 01 engine section somewhere.

 

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/Diesel_Particle_Filter_Emergency_Regeneration

silverline, many cars don't return a fault code for a dpf pressure sensor problem. Does it really do that on the Fabia?

 

I can't be sure on the Fabia.

 

I know a faulty exhaust gas pressure sensor on the MkII Octavia does log a fault code.

 

As far as I am aware any time a dash warning light is illuminated a fault code is logged.

He said he'll put it in regen mode and take it for a 30 min drive (any ideas on how much I should be paying for this?). My fear is that I'll take it to him, he'll do the diagnostics and - like you said - tell me that the soot content is too high for a forced regen. Or the car will not allow it because of the fault codes / warning lights / limp home mode.

 

There are no parts or materials needed. A forced regen is simply time consuming i.e. a labour charge.

 

The cost to do this will depend on what the garage chargers per hour.

 

I'd imagine a garage would want a good hour at least to do the regen and then take the car out for a drive.

 

Don't worry about the warning lights or limp-home mode preventing a forced regen. These are designed to get you into a garage to do just that, force you to get the DPF regenerated.

 

As devonutopia mentions, a very full (almost completely clogged) DPF can be regenerated. The only reason Skoda won't do it is for safety reasons. I imagine a non-franchised dealer will be much more likey to perform a forced regen on an over-full DPF than a Skoda main dealer. The fact he's offered to do it is a good sign. Let him work his magic, hopefully this will sort it for you.

 

My experience would suggest that once a forced regen has been carried out then the DPF light becomes a much more common occurance, I'm not sure what long term effects a forced regen has on the DPF but you are limited to the amount you can do, at least according to Skoda.

Edited 16 January, 201511 yr by silver1011

See here for non-genuine DPF's. They fit them too.

 

There isn't currently a DPF listed for the 1.6 TDi but I do know a lot of DPF's that are available aren't listed.

 

Might be worth giving them a ring for a quote, at least for future reference...

 

http://www.cats2u.co.uk/Diesel-Particulate-Filter-FAQs

Yeah, get a forced regen, sell the car, buy a petrol one and don't worry about it anymore.

If you got it this far once, as silver says, the next one will come quicker.

OK so today was the big day. Best case scenario: they do the forced regen. Worst case scenario: they say sorry, we can't do a regen, it needs replacing. In the end it was very anti-climatic and not really a solution at all. They "reset and cleared codes", taking it out of limp mode, and suggested I do a long road test with the revs above 2000 for half an hour. I asked if there was anything preventing the regen happening in the first place, he said sometimes a sensor stops working but no codes for that showed up.

So on my way home, getting the revs up to 2-2.5 thousand, and...what do I see. The glow plugs light flashing. I have a strong suspicion that that means it's not regenerating the DPF, because it only came on when I was in the DPF regen zone. I'm concerned that limp mode is just going to come back and the DPF will continue getting blocked. I feel like the next step would be to get a VCDS check on this glow plugs flashing light, maybe someone on the forum, I'll check the map? Any other options?

I would say your EGR valve is the cause of your issues.

 

Where in the UK are you?

I would say your EGR valve is the cause of your issues.

 

Where in the UK are you?

 

Wow how can I check (or have checked  ) if that's the prob, would a fault code come up?

 

I'm usually on either side of the M40 - Berkshire/West London weekdays, Birmingham on weekends.

VcDS will tell you.

I'm in Hednesford if that's any good for you?

Yup, get someone with vcds to scan.

Garages are getting in on the DPF removal cash cow, so don't assume they're being 100% honest if they also happen to do DPF removals