I have the 220TSI DSG box and have to say at the moment I prefer driving in manual mode as it does not seem keen to change up and when it does it will change down for the slightest reason.  On my commute to work, 50MPH, there is a climb that the car is forever changing from 6th into 5th and sending the revs over 2000.  Driving in manual and forcing it to stay in 6th the car drives up with no problems - slight increase on the throttle and the engine cruises up..  Attached is a screen capture from Google showing this climb.

 

Is this the norm for the DSG, or will it improve in time.

Someone posted a really good link in the DSG thread- essentially they don't learn, but are programmed with a wide range of responses to a wide range of situations. Constantly changing between gears on hills is something I read about in a few reviews, so it could be a characteristic of the programming I guess.   

I have the 220TSI DSG box and have to say at the moment I prefer driving in manual mode as it does not seem keen to change up and when it does it will change down for the slightest reason.  On my commute to work, 50MPH, there is a climb that the car is forever changing from 6th into 5th and sending the revs over 2000.  Driving in manual and forcing it to stay in 6th the car drives up with no problems - slight increase on the throttle and the engine cruises up..  Attached is a screen capture from Google showing this climb.

 

Is this the norm for the DSG, or will it improve in time.

 

Is the drive actually affected, or just the number on the maxidot? Don't forget, forced induction not withstanding it's still a petrol engine. For any kind of incline my 2.0 NA engine with manual box would be straight down into 2nd or 3rd and whizzing up the thing at 4,000 to 6,000rpm. Weeeeee!

 

It's not a diesel after all! The occasional beans will help keep the engine responsive and blow out any accumulated carbon, and in Sport Mode the thing doesn't like to be below about 2,500 to 3,000rpm at any given time. I actually find the DSG fairly intelligent in this regard, especially in detecting downhill gradients and holding a lower gear. Don't forget 5th and 6th are on opposing gear shafts so the transition will be practically non-existent, which is why I asked if it's affecting the drive rather than just the display on the dash. If there's no impact on the actual drive I'd say leave the DSG to do its thing and remain in the best power:economy ratio.

 

Next time you're on the hill try leaving it in D and switch the maxidot to instantaneous MPG. It could be that the box is flipping between gears to keep economy up. For example, exiting the Mersey Tunnel recently (a fairly steep, long climb) I noticed the box was in 6th. The revs were unnervingly low considering (especially coming, as I said, from an NA engine), so I flipped it down to 5th. The instantaneous readout dropped to 20mpg (from 30-something) so I just put it back in D and left it to it.

Hi Derv

 

No it is dropping the gear and raising the revs.  Have had the maxidot on the average MPG and it drops like a stone as does any form of acceleration I notice.

Hi Derv

 

No it is dropping the gear and raising the revs.  Have had the maxidot on the average MPG and it drops like a stone as does any form of acceleration I notice.

 

Sorry mate I think I explained myself badly. I did realise it was dropping a cog and raising rpms, I was just wondering whether it was saving fuel overall (i.e. less throttle required, and the engine being considered as labouring in 6th, hence the switch). You're probably just on the border of shift points in the box's map. Try adding a couple of MPH (or dropping a couple off, if you'd prefer) and seeing if the box behaves more consistently (i.e. staying in 5th or 6th instead of switching back and forth).

I know what you mean, the speed limit on the road is 50MPH which on this engine as you know is barely 2000RPM so I guess you could be right that I am on the border.  When in D I do find myself using the paddles and changing up as the car seems to take forever to do it (circa 1700RPM)

The DSG on my 190TDI seems to do a good job of knowing when I'm going up and down hills. The coast function goes off and the box shifts down a cog or two when going downhill, irrespective of what i'm doing with the accelerator pedal. It also drops a cog or two when going up hill as well.

 

I will agree that the box seems to hunt around the gears a little more than i'd like. It's taken me 4000 miles to accept it and just let the box get on with its job. 

I know what you mean, the speed limit on the road is 50MPH which on this engine as you know is barely 2000RPM so I guess you could be right that I am on the border.  When in D I do find myself using the paddles and changing up as the car seems to take forever to do it (circa 1700RPM)

Maybe you don't realize that you have the wide-ratio version of the 6-speed DSG, & 6th gear is really at it's best for cruising at 60 mph plus.

I'd strongly suggest that you leave it in D & let the transmission shift up / down by itself.

The transmission engineers & programmers do know what they are doing......

 

The 220 is a nice engine, with lots of torque all through the rev range, but treating like a diesel isn't the way to drive it.

If you are really concerned about economy then you've bought the wrong car buy if you just don't like taking the car above

2k rpm, try winding it out in 2nd & 3rd on a quiet road & you'll probably discover the Jekyll & Hyde character of the 2.0 TSi.

Don't try reach 6k rpm in 5th though, that's probably 150 mph+ & not really sensible on UK roads!

 

FWIW the 280's have the same basic DSG, but the gear ratios are different, closer & lower geared, so the two cars need different engine speed to produce the same

road-speed

 

From memory, (I've driven both versions) 3K rpm in 6th in yours = app. 95 mph, but "only" 80 mph in the 280.

 

The 220 is geared for theoretical (official !) economy & the 280 for performance. 

My current cars are similar, my Superb 2 makes 77 mph at 3K rpm in 6th & the EOS makes 95 mph at 3K rpm in 6th.

 

But.......the Superb, even though it's the bigger car is more economical, (2-3 mpg) with the same driver, same trips, same speeds.

Probably different if I could cruise at 100 mph, but I live in Essex, not Germany! 

 

 

DC

Thanks everyone, I guess I will just have to live with it then.  Left it in D this morning and sure enough changed down for all of 5/10 seconds and then back up again.  I guess I am just used too a manual and this is a totally different way of driving for me. 

Even in a manual, climbing a hill with a 2.0tsi would probably warrent keeping the RPM around 2000 minimum to keep the engine on boost and producing plenty of torque? Engine load has just as much effect on fuel economy as rpm (within reason)

I'm looking at a DSG for my next car so I'm sure it will take some getting used to though

Edited 27 April, 201610 yr by V6Jules

Even in a manual, climbing a hill with a 2.0tsi would probably warrent keeping the RPM around 2000 minimum to keep the engine on boost and producing plenty of torque? Engine load has just as much effect on fuel economy as rpm (within reason)

I'm looking at a DSG for my next car so I'm sure it will take some getting used to though

From our experiences, the DSG learning curve was quite steep.

I've lived with quite a few conventional slush-boxes over the years whereas SWMBO has only owned manuals & we both find DSG's to be easy to drive, + at least as much fun as a manual.

 

Shifting with the paddles is so quick & natural, as is letting the box do all the work for you, especially in heavy traffic.

 

In our opinion, DSG & the other twin-clutch transmissions are well worth the expense, hopefully you will agree when you own one! 

 

DC

It's also worth considering the potentially damaging pulse effect that diesels throw down the drivetrain when under high load, high torque and low revs. This pulsing is the reason dual mass flywheels are fitted to manual dervs.

 

It's entirely reasonable to assume the DSG software has been designed to keep these pulses to a minimum, to prolong the life of the DSG box, as well as provide optimum comfort for the car's occupants. One easy way to do this is to prevent the engine from labouring up hills in a high gear, as this scenario is where the pulses from the engine are the most damaging. 

The DSG also has a DMF just that it's a bit kinder to it changing down when necessary to avoid labouring the engine and putting excess strain on the drive train.

Someone posted a really good link in the DSG thread- essentially they don't learn, but are programmed with a wide range of responses to a wide range of situations. Constantly changing between gears on hills is something I read about in a few reviews, so it could be a characteristic of the programming I guess.

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