Got the car going to a mate of a mate for a Hunter's alignment this weekend. The tracking is currently well out, particular at the rear. I'm due new tyres anyway, but the droning noise from the rear is driving me mad.

Is there anything I need to look out for or should it just be a case of handing the car over and it coming back perfect?

Obviously the operator not only needs to be competent in the use of the equipment to check alignment but have the ability to then make the adjustment on the vehicle.

Not all are competent in the use of the equipment or making adjustments on all vehicles.

Obviously the operator not only needs to be competent in the use of the equipment to check alignment but have the ability to then make the adjustment on the vehicle.

Not all are competent in the use of the equipment or making adjustments on all vehicles.

Understood. I'll ask for before and after printouts.

A bit less negative camber on the rears than spec helps tyre wear if they're wearing inner edges out. Edit: at the expense of a incy bit of "at the limit" grip....

Edited 1 December, 20169 yr by TheClient

A bit less negative camber on the rears than spec helps tyre wear if they're wearing inner edges out. Edit: at the expense of a incy bit of "at the limit" grip....

I can't remember where they're worn the most, but all tyres are between 3 and 5mm. The rears are bad because they were initially on the front, and are now suffering from poor alignment.

Understood. I'll ask for before and after printouts.

I think the 'before' printouts could be falsified by setting the equipment up incorrectly, but that is only my opinion. Others may agree or disagree.

 

If you trust your mates judgement (and he uses the garage himself and not just his mate from the pub) then you have to trust his mate.

 

The after printouts are the ones to check. Good luck.

 

Is he charging you a set price???????????? or price per adjustment???????????

 

F1 charged per adjustment when I had mine done. Didn't like doing it that way personally.

Edited 1 December, 20169 yr by Tilt

I think the 'before' printouts could be falsified by setting the equipment up incorrectly, but that is only my opinion. Others may agree or disagree.

 

If you trust your mates judgement (and he uses the garage himself and not just his mate from the pub) then you have to trust his mate.

 

The after printouts are the ones to check. Good luck.

 

Is he charging you a set price???????????? or price per adjustment???????????

 

F1 charged per adjustment when I had mine done. Didn't like doing it that way personally.

He's a senior engineer for VW and is charging me mate's rates.

The local tuning place near(ish) to me does a per adjustment charge, and the going rate is about £120 from what I gather. Very expensive for even a fancy, accurate alignment IMO.

Edited 1 December, 20169 yr by planehazza

He's a senior engineer for VW and is charging me mate's rates.

The local tuning place near(ish) to me does a per adjustment charge, and the going rate is about £120 from what I gather. Very expensive for even a fancy, accurate alignment IMO.

Agreed.

Are you having new tyres fitted before the alignment?

I've said it before - the tech is more important than the machine.

 

Ask your mate to get the rears as upright as possible (-0.75 to -1.0 degrees & minimum toe-in (0-1mm max).

 

It's easier to do an alignment on new tyres but I always used to try and get a look at the old tyres as you are aligning the vehicle rather than just trying to meet a specification.

Are you having new tyres fitted before the alignment?

Nope, as they've still got a little life left. I wanted the alignment done ready to fit new rubber.

Why don't you wait until you get the new tyres THEN do the alignment?

It'd be more miles more beneficial to have the new tyres fitted THEN have the alignment done, in fact it can be counterproductive to geo a vehicle with the uneven tyres still fitted.

It surprises me that the person doing it hasn't pointed that out to you beforehand, i'd personally turn the job away with stepped tyres until they were replaced.

Edited 2 December, 20169 yr by James@RRGRochdale

Hmm. I was always under the impression it was better to do it whilst on older tyres so it's all nice and tracked when the new ones are on? I'll see about cancelling tomorrow then.

It'd be more miles more beneficial to have the new tyres fitted THEN have the alignment done, in fact it can be counterproductive to geo a vehicle with the uneven tyres still fitted.

It surprises me that the person doing it hasn't pointed that out to you beforehand, i'd personally turn the job away with stepped tyres until they were replaced.

Can you explain why please? If the alignment equipment is resting on the metal of the wheel then it should make no difference. A tiny bit of wear is hardly like to move the rims on the hubs is it.

Tyres worn in a certain way can affect the measurement and adjustment process. once the alignment is finished, then the new tyres fitted it may well result in the alignment being slightly out thereafter.

With many measurements and adjustments producing such minute results it leaves little margin for error and seems a pointless exercise to perform the process in the aforementioned order.

It's the way the Germans - who govern our brand and make the equipment we use want it. They're much more stringent with tyre use and wear, the uk seems very ignorant of just how important Decent tyres actually are.

A lot of the systems fitted to modern vehicles and the equipment used to calibrate them relies heavily on the user accepting that tyres should be in the same (good) condition per axle without too much deviation in tread depth between tyres or wear across the tread in order to achieve the best results.

So it's the way they convey it and its a logical thought process to create more precise results, and I'm their puppet so I do what they say.

Edited 2 December, 20169 yr by James@RRGRochdale

Got the car going to a mate of a mate for a Hunter's alignment this weekend. The tracking is currently well out, particular at the rear. I'm due new tyres anyway, but the droning noise from the rear is driving me mad.

Is there anything I need to look out for or should it just be a case of handing the car over and it coming back perfect?

If the rear eccentric nuts/bolts/bushes are siezed they wont be able to adjust the rears which happend to me, so i only had the fronts adjusted which were well out the rear was only slightly out so left it . 

If the rear eccentric nuts/bolts/bushes are siezed they wont be able to adjust the rears which happend to me, so i only had the fronts adjusted which were well out the rear was only slightly out so left it .

So basically the front of the car was incorrectly aligned to the rear of the car that was already out.

The rear of the vehicle should always be aligned first because the thrust axis angle depends on it.

If the bolts are seized and the rear cannot be adjusted then the front measurement will never be true or correct, it's just a bodge.

Can you explain why please? If the alignment equipment is resting on the metal of the wheel then it should make no difference. A tiny bit of wear is hardly like to move the rims on the hubs is it.

Because a good aligner will try and account for the vehicle drift that might be present with worn tyres.  Fit new tyres and the dynamics change, then you have to weave the magic all over again... for free (because you'll spend more time explaining than fixing).  It won't change enough to affect tyre wear but the feel and road behaviour will change.

Tyres worn in a certain way can affect the measurement and adjustment process. once the alignment is finished, then the new tyres fitted it may well result in the alignment being slightly out thereafter.

With many measurements and adjustments producing such minute results it leaves little margin for error and seems a pointless exercise to perform the process in the aforementioned order.

It's the way the Germans - who govern our brand and make the equipment we use want it. They're much more stringent with tyre use and wear, the uk seems very ignorant of just how important Decent tyres actually are.

A lot of the systems fitted to modern vehicles and the equipment used to calibrate them relies heavily on the user accepting that tyres should be in the same (good) condition per axle without too much deviation in tread depth between tyres or wear across the tread in order to achieve the best results.

So it's the way they convey it and its a logical thought process to create more precise results, and I'm their puppet so I do what they say.

 

OK, I accept this but the tyre wear would have to be pretty severe for it to affect results on the road that you can feel.

 

Does your machine use sensors that attach to the metal of the rim or those that rest on the sidewall of the tyres?

I've seen (and had) many alignments done where the devices are resting on the tyres. I've never noticed the tech check tyre pressures (though I know mine are correct because I'm obsessive) before measuring. Not even sure they check they are the same brand.(side to side/front to rear) Both of these variables and the fact you are resting a point of the device on a rubber surface that can be over 1mm out compared to the others then surely over the length of the car this deviation will be greater and result in meaningless data?

I'm having mine done on Friday at a place that uses the metal of the rims as a datum point, not the sidewalls.

 

What are your comments on these two techniques?

I've never seen a device that rests on the tyre, only ever on the wheel rim. I have seen these so called "tracking" systems that just hang on he wheel.

I see a lot places that don't carry out the basics such as tyre pressure adjustments or weighing the car correctly.

F1 certainly didn't check my tyre pressures and upon driving home it pulled to one side a little.

 

I thought going back was going to be necessary but after me checking and sorting the pressures it drove fine without pulling.

Had mine aligned at Wheels in Motion. Even when the alignment was spot on the car pulled left slightly. Tony swapped the two front wheels and it cured it. Tyres only had 500 miles on them. Even the slightest wear when amplified by x thousand revolutions can be noticed.

Bumping this thread.  I'm ordering new tyres today so would like to get the Hunter's done immediately after fitment.  Which garage in the North East would people recommend to get a good, trusted, accurate Hunter's performed? As said by others, I want to ensure it's done right.

 

I've seen people recommending Tyre-Ex in Durham, seems to cost about £60.  Any experience here?

Edited 14 February, 20179 yr by planehazza

S-cars Spennymoor, Durham, mine is there this week after bilstein shocks and Eibach springs are fitted.

 

Or Automotive solutions in Peterlee also have a hunter.