More . . . BT Broadband Data Accounting Bingo

[GentleGiant]

That offer is trying to stiff you for line rental as well, current line rental price for BT is £18.99

 

https://www.productsandservices.bt.com/products/lib/pdf/BT_PhoneTariff_Residential.pdf

[Clunkclick]

 

Just consulted my BT on-line account to see what the Broadband usage has been over the last 2 days.

 

Apparently, I've used 10.53 GB yesterday.

 

(My screen shot of the BT record up to close of play on 30/12/2016 showed monthly usuage to that date as 31.57 GB.And this morning its shot up to 42.1 GB for December).

 

Can anybody tell me how much data 30 minutes of 360p streaming video would consume ? 

 

Needless to say Bit Meter is showing usage for the week 25/12 to 31/12/2016 as 1.59 GB and Glasswire is showing 2.1 GB usage for the same week. 

 

Bit Meter is showing total usage for the month as 13.54 GB. i.e. less than one third of the BT figure.

 

Can anybody tell me how much data 30 minutes of 360p streaming video would consume ?  

 

 

Nick

Edited 1 January, 2017 by Clunkclick

[gadgetman]

1 HOUR" of VIDEO -

240p ~ 150 MB

360p ~ 250 MB

480p ~ 400 MB

720p ~ 800-900 MB

1080p ~ 1.2 -1.4 GB

[Clunkclick]

1 HOUR" of VIDEO -

240p ~ 150 MB

360p ~ 250 MB

480p ~ 400 MB

720p ~ 800-900 MB

1080p ~ 1.2 -1.4 GB

Those were the sort of data rates I was thinking of.

 

Does that vary, significantly, I wonder as between streams of pre-recorded material e.g. You Tube and live streams e.g. web cams ? Does using Adobe Flash increase the data "Pull".

 

I'm trying my best to reconcile what I think I've used (My own estimates + Bit-meter recordings) with what BT are claiming I used  over the last two days and there's no way my total usage (Up + Down) comes anywhere near the 10.5 GB that BT are claiming.

 

Basically, over these two days I viewed 4 x 30 minutes of streamed pre-recorded 360p video on You Tube,  30 minutes of streamed live web-cam material (Probably @ 480p, French coastal web cams), downloaded and read 25 E-mails and deleted another 15-20 and viewed no more than 40 pages on about 10 web sites. The last Windows updates were on 25/12/2016 and Glasswire tells me that windows system resources e.g. various implementations of SVC host, only consumed 800 MB over the whole week 25th December to 31st December.

 

There's no way that little lot comes to  the 10.5GB, BT are claiming.

 

The only devices connected to the network over that period were the BB Playbook, this Chinese cheapo tablet (Which does 98% of my work now), BB Curve phone and Roberts Stream radio. Now, the stream radio and the mobile phone have been switched off most of the two days, the chinese tablet is on for about 12 hours a day and Playbook is on the most, but little is done on it, and it looses connection when the router is switched-off between 00:00 tp 08:00 daily..

 

Further more I don't run a Netflix or streaming media account

 

So i am at a loss were this data usage is coming from.

 

I've stated to BT that I'm not paying the excess charge of £120 until I'm convinced that the usage is genuine. From what i've seen so far, it looks like BT are over stating the daily usage by 2 - 3 times. Whether this is equipment malfunction or an accounting error or fraud and where it is occuring are not as yet clear. So that's why I've requested a data logger be fitted to my master socket to confirm (Or discount) the usage. BT are not keen to do this and just want to ram me into a new package.Obviously,  I'm not prepared to take up any new package until this data usage issue is resolved.

 

I think this one will be finding its way to the Ombudsman.

 

Nick

Edited 1 January, 2017 by Clunkclick

[GentleGiant]

Of course they arent keen to fit a logger; this will prove what we've known for years, their metering system is a joke. I can remember one argument where their tech support was adamant he could "see" my router connected and transferring data, when it was switched off and I had the phone cable unplugged and in my hand.

 

That one was chalked up to "faulty equipment at the exchange", but they didnt replace it, just rebooted it; I used to get exactly the same issue (and run-around) every 6-8 months from then until I gave up in disgust and moved ISP.

 

The new ISP couldnt get BT to replace the equipment either, but they were a lot faster at getting an engineer to go reboot it (2-3 days v 2 weeks).

[Clunkclick]

   All the below received in the order listed :-

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/narobs/31207424284/in/dateposted-friend/

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/narobs/31930571631/in/dateposted-friend/

 

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/narobs/31673464690/in/dateposted-friend/

 

 

BT are claiming 10.5 GB usage in 4 days. Bloody frausters.

 

 

No much help if the advisory E-mail is sent three days after the event ? Rubbing-in the ****-take ?

 

 

N.

Edited 2 January, 2017 by Clunkclick

[Clunkclick]

Of course they arent keen to fit a logger; this will prove what we've known for years, their metering system is a joke. I can remember one argument where their tech support was adamant he could "see" my router connected and transferring data, when it was switched off and I had the phone cable unplugged and in my hand.

 

That one was chalked up to "faulty equipment at the exchange", but they didnt replace it, just rebooted it; I used to get exactly the same issue (and run-around) every 6-8 months from then until I gave up in disgust and moved ISP.

 

The new ISP couldnt get BT to replace the equipment either, but they were a lot faster at getting an engineer to go reboot it (2-3 days v 2 weeks).

Reading their community forums, you find its widespread with BT and has been going on since 2010/11.

 

And the Regulator does nothing about it. 

 

Meanwhile, BT cement their near monopoly position  with an intensive advertising campaign the likes of which haven't been seen before in this country. On the TV, every channel at virtually every commercial break.

 

Meanwhile, again, the Foreign Secretary, writing in the Telegraph today, out of the all of the World issues to chose from, decides he is going to tell his avid readers that he is the proud owner of a quad bike - tells you all you need to know -  a country run by yobs who couldn't give a XXXX about ruining the countryside or the country or the people, as long as they are indulging themselves with frivoloties !

 

N

Edited 2 January, 2017 by Clunkclick

[gadgetman]

Then contact BBC watchdog, the media and your MP about it

Or find a cheaper unlimited deal and leave BT well alone?

[camelspyyder]

 

 

Meanwhile, again, the Foreign Secretary, writing in the Telegraph today, out of the all of the World issues to chose from, decides he is going to tell his avid readers that he is the proud owner of a quad bike - tells you all you need to know -  a country run by yobs who couldn't give a XXXX about ruining the countryside or the country or the people, as long as they are indulging themselves with frivoloties !

 

N

 

Quad bikes are very dangerous.  With a bit of luck he'll be the next "celebrity" to be found underneath one. (Ozzy, Rik Mayall, Ronnie O'sullivan, Al Unser Jr etc etc)

 

 

Back on topic...Why don't you just cancel your BT contract - they are robbing dogs.

Edited 2 January, 2017 by camelspyyder

[GentleGiant]

If you dont use a lot of data, Three do an unadvertised 40GB for £20 per month, with free 4G router - I think on a 12 month contract.

 

So that is £1.01p more than BT charge for line rental only.

 

I'm trying to persuade some friends to switch to this, as they are currently paying BT an average of £70 per month for a 200kbps connection and phone calls.

[Clunkclick]

I've noticed in the past that BT's data accounting seems to go "Wronger " than usual whenever I download anything from Microsoft !

 

As said, over the Xmas week, BT claimed data usage was 10.5 GB and it just so happens that between the 27-31 December  I downloaded one 800MB Microsoft app (But that particular download is included in the Glasswire and Bit-meter weekly totals I quoted above which were less than a third of the BT figure).

 

From info displayed by the Glasswire app, its apparent that some third party organisation called Akamai Technologies operates the servers, both in States and Europe, from which all the Microsoft stuff streams. I wonder if the particular presentation of streamed data that they use is responsible for corrupting the data counting done by the BT equipment.

 

 

N.

Edited 3 January, 2017 by Clunkclick

[GentleGiant]

I've noticed in the past that BT's data accounting seems to go "Wronger " than usual whenever I download anything from Microsoft !

 

As said, over the Xmas week, BT claimed data usage was 10.5 GB and it just so happens that between the 27-31 December  I downloaded one 800MB Microsoft app (But that particular download is included in the Glasswire and Bit-meter weekly totals I quoted above which were less than a third of the BT figure).

 

From info displayed by the Glasswire app, its apparent that some third party organisation called Akamai Technologies operates the servers, both in States and Europe, from which all the Microsoft stuff streams. I wonder if the particular presentation of streamed data that they use is responsible for corrupting the data counting done by the BT equipment.

 

 

N.

 

 

That issue might be because MS now use a version of Torrent, so you would have been uploading to other customers, at the same time you were downloading, exactly how much extra, I dont know, as it will never be exactly the same for any 2 people, even at exactly the same time.

[Dr Zoidberg]

That issue might be because MS now use a version of Torrent, so you would have been uploading to other customers, at the same time you were downloading.

They do? Do you have a link to this, as it's news to me.

[Clunkclick]

That issue might be because MS now use a version of Torrent, so you would have been uploading to other customers, at the same time you were downloading, exactly how much extra, I dont know, as it will never be exactly the same for any 2 people, even at exactly the same time.

That's still set to the default on my tablet, so that it only updates machines on my network. 

 

I take it that  W10, in this mode, is designed to download just one copy  of an app/update from an MS server or series of internet peers  and then use the Robocopy command line function in background  (Or similar) when requested to by local network machines as and  when they came on-line ? I have noticed that approx 10 GBs of freespace on my tablet has disappeared recently, but surely the way peer-to-peer would work is that a machine only downloads what it needs according to its own update list. If one of the apps/updates it downloads for it own needs also meets the requirement for another local machine, then, all well and good, but the tablet surely won't download software that it has no requirement for, but which another machine does.

 

If this is going on, the very low level of  internal network traffic that's being recorded by Bit-Meter and Glasswire isn't reflecting it.

 

The significant figures  are the differences between BT's monthly usage figure (42Gb) and Bit-Meter (14.5GB) - there's no reconciling that difference without the use of a local data logger and since BT have declined my request to apply one of these to resolve the discrepancy and similarly have refused to undertake an audit review of the excess use from July to September, that's the reasons I gave today for rejecting their "Offer" and opting for referral to the Ombudsman .

 

Currently waiting BT to issue  deadlock letter (Must be done within 14 days).

 

Nick

Edited 3 January, 2017 by Clunkclick

[Clunkclick]

They do? Do you have a link to this, as it's news to me.

No,it is an option - look at Settings, Update & security, Advanced options, Choose how updates delivered.

 

I've also noticed it happening on my local network and previously commented on another thread here.

 

Nick

Edited 3 January, 2017 by Clunkclick

[Dr Zoidberg]

No,it is an option - look at Settings, Update & security, Advanced options, Choose how updates delivered.

 

Nick

Interesting, ta. Off by default and came with the Anniversary Update in August.

[GentleGiant]

No,it is an option - look at Settings, Update & security, Advanced options, Choose how updates delivered.

 

I've also noticed it happening on my local network and previously commented on another thread here.

 

Nick

 

Off by default?? When announced , it was going to be on by default, so perhaps they DO listen to customers now and then.

[Clunkclick]

Off by default?? When announced , it was going to be on by default, so perhaps they DO listen to customers now and then.

In this era of the  universal exercise of the  highest ethical standards in all aspects of life, what would stop them trouncing a users existing setup with alterations via an update - not that there's precedent for that  <Benylin> remember browser wars before the constraining EU decision ?

 

 

Nick

Edited 4 January, 2017 by Clunkclick

[Clunkclick]

Interesting . . if you do a traceroute  (Tracert) on virtually any address other than the local network (192.168.1.X), the result hops back through the standard 30 iterations and always show,  at hops 3 and 4, a BT address in the range 31.55.185.X, where X is in the range  190-220. All the other hops time out, including, strangely, hop 2 - hop 1 is 192.168.1.254 - the Home Hub.

 

And my local network is set up as private and the HH is set to reject enquiries to any ports other than the main gateway,

 

That might suggest that  there is a black region, comprising the majority of the address space on the HH, which is inaccessible to the user and where only  BT can access, perhaps a shell of addresses, through which user data has to pass to get to the internet, so that,  a remote BT engineer would be able to see what was happening on one's Home Hub via a backdoor- per GG's earlier comment.

 

If they've got that capability, why deny my assertions, when it can be seen from the comparative figures in my post # 18 that the Home hub's own usage figures, over a morning's reference period, weren't far removed from those output by both Bit-Meter and Glasswire.

 

Aside, even more interesting if you do a traceroute on any of the addresses in the range 192.168.0.X, (X being 0-255).

 

N

Edited 5 January, 2017 by Clunkclick

[GentleGiant]

I didnt have a HomeHub, it was a Netgear DGN2000, and the engineer was supposedly monitoring my connection at the exchange, as the DSLAMs can be monitored, and configured remotely.

 

(The DGN2000 later melted, but I dont think the problems were related :peek:  )

Edited 5 January, 2017 by GentleGiant

[Clunkclick]

BT High Level Customer Services issued a "Deadlock" Letter (Dated 4/1/2017, received 10/1/2017) making an un-revised final offer,  unchanged  from the earlier one i.e. their offer with penalties/duress:-

 

 "Move to the uncapped service,  take out a 24 month contract (They've admitted that I am currently not on a contract)  and we will reduce your monthly charge. However, you will still have to pay the excess charge of £120 for the disputed data "Over-usuage" from July - September 2016 " and it just so happens  the excess charge equates exactly to any savings you would make by taking out a contract for a 24 month term. 

 

What is in it for me to change the existing set- up, even if I wanted to. Nought. 

 

If one was cynical, one would say that the whole sequence of events from April/May 2016, including the alleged above data cap excess usuage charge, was implemented with pre-conceived mal-intent by the minnions in BT to force me to change to a service that I didn't need.

 

If you look at BT's own "Community"  forums, there are pages and pages of reports of exactly the same modus operandi being implemented against customers going back as far as 2011. Judging by the way the staff go on, I'd say its hard-wired into their procedures i.e. a bit of the ol' EC1 Dcik Turpin action.

 

They have got to be the most crass,  criminally incompetent and maloevent bureaucracy on the face of the planet. 

 

You want to get people onto a new service that they don't really want, try incentivizing them instead of clubbing them to death with "Fake" usage and debts. Trump thinks he is dealing with Nazis in the CIA, . . . . . 

 

Anyway, I told them to RAM their "Offer" (That's twice now) and have referred the matter (last night)  to Ombudsman Services - Communications - the private ADR scheme run by OS-C and paid for in part by BT.

 

LET'S  HOPE THEY ARE NOT AS FAKE OR CRIMINALLY CORRUPT AS BT.

  

As a matter of daily routine,  since all this BS started, I always go to the broadband data usage record on my on-line BT account and take an image of it for my records. Go there today and the breakdown page (Page 2) is no longer available:-

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/narobs/31478107873/in/dateposted-friend/

 

and the top page seems to have stuck  for the last 3 days on 5GB:-

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/narobs/31446891504/in/dateposted-friend/

 

Russian athletes taking performance enhancing drugs looks innocent by comparison. 

 

Perhaps they could save all their customers a fortune in FAKE charges if they moderated the intensive psuedo celebrity drenched TV advertising.

 

BT need a public enquiry - they are out of control.

 

Nick

Edited 13 January, 2017 by Clunkclick

[mbames]

I have noticed that approx 10 GBs of freespace on my tablet has disappeared recently

 

Did that extra 10s of GB of space which was "lost" appear in your download loggers?

 

 

 

The significant figures  are the differences between BT's monthly usage figure (42Gb) and Bit-Meter (14.5GB)

 

 

Are you sure you are logging ingoing and outgoing traffic?  Maybe you need to borrow a decent router for a bit and let it actually log the flow of traffic through rather than using monitoring s/w on each of your devices.

 

Are you aren't on fibre, then why not pick up a cheap Draytek Vigor 2820 or such and use that.

 

 

Edited 13 January, 2017 by mbames

[gadgetman]

The elephant in the room has to be, what if you get your data logger wish and it shows that the usage is in line with BT claims? Then what?

Your data usage stats seem very very low against what you're saying you've been doing.

Anyway, wake us up once OFCOM have given their final verdict

[Clunkclick]

Good 'un.

 

When BT cancel the £120 charge I can use that as a down payment on one

.

 

Funny that none of the BT employees that stooge around on the BT "Community" Fora have suggested this as the ultimate in PR "Damage Limitation" on any of the pages and pages of threads complaining of these FAKE over- charging Ops.

 

Of course, if they did so,  that would suggest that BT management have no confidence in their own data accounting methods on their servers or in the limited procedures built in to Home Hubs issued to date. Be a brave man that did that hoist himself on that pitard - more than an infinite supply of man-hug moisturiser is worth.

 

The lovely High-Level lady in the complaints team based in Gods own County I was dealing with did add to her "Deadlock" letter that once the case is referred to the Ombudsman Service then  the brake would be off the debt collection procedures in respect of the outstanding excess  charge.

 

So, no doubt, one of BT's Red economic barrel bombs will slide through the letterbox demain, de bonne heure. On the occasion of which I will be taking a scanned -copy, writing "FAKE-OFF" in 3 inch magic marker script and sending it to the Gav, Special Delivery, before 10:30.

 

Watch this space.

 

N.

Edited 13 January, 2017 by Clunkclick

[mbames]

Only £20. Expect you have wasted more time, money and internet traffic complaining about this rather than actively determining your real usage stats.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/152360863725?lpid=122&chn=ps&adgroupid=39159866351&rlsatarget=pla-268911529098&adtype=pla&poi=&googleloc=1006548&device=m&campaignid=698622927&crdt=0&ul_ref=http%253A%252F%252Frover.ebay.com%252Frover%252F1%252F710-134428-41853-0%252F2%253Fmtid%253D1673%2526kwid%253D1%2526crlp%253D159563794253_563391%2526itemid%253D152360863725%2526targetid%253D268911529098%2526device%253Dm%2526mpre%253Dhttp%25253a%25252f%25252fwww.ebay.co.uk%25252fitm%25252flike%25252f152360863725%25253flpid%25253d122%252526chn%25253Dps%2526adtype%253Dpla%2526googleloc%253D1006548%2526poi%253D%2526campaignid%253D698622927%2526adgroupid%253D39159866351%2526rlsatarget%253Dpla-268911529098%2526gclid%253DCN3it5SKwNECFYU_Gwods_8OEA%2526srcrot%253D710-134428-41853-0%2526rvr_id%253D1153123058407