Only £20. Expect you have wasted more time, money and internet traffic complaining about this rather than actively determining your real usage stats.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/152360863725?lpid=122&chn=ps&adgroupid=39159866351&rlsatarget=pla-268911529098&adtype=pla&poi=&googleloc=1006548&device=m&campaignid=698622927&crdt=0&ul_ref=http%253A%252F%252Frover.ebay.com%252Frover%252F1%252F710-134428-41853-0%252F2%253Fmtid%253D1673%2526kwid%253D1%2526crlp%253D159563794253_563391%2526itemid%253D152360863725%2526targetid%253D268911529098%2526device%253Dm%2526mpre%253Dhttp%25253a%25252f%25252fwww.ebay.co.uk%25252fitm%25252flike%25252f152360863725%25253flpid%25253d122%252526chn%25253Dps%2526adtype%253Dpla%2526googleloc%253D1006548%2526poi%253D%2526campaignid%253D698622927%2526adgroupid%253D39159866351%2526rlsatarget%253Dpla-268911529098%2526gclid%253DCN3it5SKwNECFYU_Gwods_8OEA%2526srcrot%253D710-134428-41853-0%2526rvr_id%253D1153123058407

Only one digit place (In the hundreds) out -  the excess use charge is £120 - don't wait, put in the CV to BT data accounting and mis information department  now !

 

If you can spell usage, you're in !

 

BT supply the Home hardware, the software that runs on it, the McAfee anti-virus software that "Protects" each customer account - if something gets past that, hardly the customer's fault. Unless the default legal  position is that all new BT customers are at fault as soon as they open a BT account, then, if that isn't the case, you must conclude, that the onus for proving intrusion onto a customer's system, which leads to a data cap being exceeded,  in which the customer was at fault, in a knowing or unknowing way, is on BT.

 

Same, surely, for any of these ISP providers.

 

Nick

Edited 13 January, 20179 yr by Clunkclick

Second hand they start at £20. It seems to me that you just like to argue and have no interest actually doing anything productive (as it might show your internet enabled devices are consuming more data that you believe).

Most ISPs provide a device to facilitate use of their service, anything else is lip service to customer who may then decide to believe it.

The elephant in the room has to be, what if you get your data logger wish and it shows that the usage is in line swith BT claims? Then what?

Your data usage stats seem very very low against what you're saying you've been doing.

Anyway, wake us up once OFCOM have given their final verdict

As long as they do it with one hand supported  on a stack the appropriate religious texts, it will be OK.

 

According to BT they only regard usage info that originates from BT equipment as valid. Anything else, whether its Vigor Firewall routers or Bit-Meter, Glasswire etc is invalid. And yet, if you read the BT Community fora, there are some individuals who have reported that their excess charges have been cancelled, after the case was taken up by one or other of the BT employee stooges who inhabit the site, no doubt for damage limitation purposes. From memory, I recall that at least one of these individuals was able to prove that his particular rural data line didn't have the speed to download the 99 GBs in a day that BT claimed - URL usage. 

 

What's also worrying is that, if BT have ownership of a "Dark Zone" on each Home Hub (As I postulated above), then intrusion is possible there without the user seeing anything. And  historically, when it comes to corporate stock losses who are the most frequent suspects - the corporate employees, of course.

 

They've already stated to me they are unable to produce the original reference data usage data for July- September, which statement I am extremely dubious of, so data loggers is really the only option left. And, quite, the scale of the difference between what Bit-meter recorded during the reference period which the customer service person chose retrospectively and the figures which that person presented in list were factors of 2 - 4 different.. And what's more, the set of figure's this person presented were AT ODDS with the data usage recorded on BT's own data usage record contained in my on-line BT account - any wonder someone disabled the data usage breakdown page in my BT  account once I'd informed them that the matter had been referred to Ombudsman - how very FSB.

 

That's stirred the pot enough for Friday evening.

 

N.

Edited 13 January, 20179 yr by Clunkclick

Second hand they start at £20. It seems to me that you just like to argue and have no interest actually doing anything productive (as it might show your internet enabled devices are consuming more data that you believe).

Most ISPs provide a device to facilitate use of their service, anything else is lip service to customer who may then decide to believe it.

Is it a good idea to buy second hand kit in a situation where security maybe one of the key issues. Can you be assured that the machine is clean,and that some hacker hasn't squeezed code onto an EPROM, post production-line checks.

 

N

What an untrusting world you live in. Buy a new one, or repurpose a dual NIC machine and install pfSense (if you are prepared to trust that).

Good luck with your battle.

What on earth is the point of this thread when you aren't listening to anything that people are saying to help you?

What an untrusting world you live in. Buy a new one, or repurpose a dual NIC machine and install pfSense (if you are prepared to trust that).

Good luck with your battle.

I am prepared to try anything, but why should I even need to do this if the BT kit at my address and their servers are fit for purpose i.e.  prevent intrusion and accurately account for data usuage ?

 

In any well run operation, the information I requested on daily data usage for July - September would have been made available by now. from a much lower level. And what's more, the regulator would have been on the case to ensure that all ISPs are in a position to follow suit. And the situation would have been resolved months ago, one way or the other. 

 

Instead, here we are five months after the complaint was initiated, with the High Level Complaints Team (Which I am told is attached to the Sir Michael Rake's Office (Chairman of BT)), with BT  still maintaining that they don't keep such info. Personally, I don't believe it. I suspect that  the release of such info will defeat their case. Ludicrous.

 

IMHO, the whole complaints referral system is just one giant delaying tactic, so  designed in the hope that the average customer will give up half way through in frustration. Staffed by idiots, who at the lower levels have trouble with the English Language, both verbal and written, and who are constrained in the information they can issue by the corporate script - if the STASI were alive and kicking today, they'd probably be using it as a model in training courses on how to suppress urban populations.

 

 

 

Nick

Edited 14 January, 20179 yr by Clunkclick

If this isn't symptomatic of where the problem lies, I'll start eating tulip bulbs

 

From the Broadband Data Usage Monitor shown in my on-line BT account:-

 

The top-sheet  record shows usage to 14/01/2017 and its monthly total thus far for January is 5 GB (Has been for days despite moderate use !):- 

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/narobs/31456940934/in/dateposted-friend/

 

 

The underlying detail sheet (Called breakdown) shows usage to 23:59 on 12/01/2017 and its monthly total thus far for January is 6.56 GB:-

https://www.flickr.com/photos/narobs/32179141151/in/dateposted-friend/

 

Call me ol' fashioned, but I always thought that the totals on the breakdown sheets and the summary top sheet should agree, let alone the accounting periods being co-terminus.

 

See the Parliamentary bubble-livers yesterday were rabbiting on in one of the chambers how cyber security is going to be so important in future defence of this country- what chance of that when the providers can't even get elementary sums right ?

 

N

Edited 14 January, 20179 yr by Clunkclick

"Move to the uncapped service,  take out a 24 month contract (They've admitted that I am currently not on a contract)  and we will reduce your monthly charge. However, you will still have to pay the excess charge of £120 for the disputed data "Over-usuage" from July - September 2016 " and it just so happens  the excess charge equates exactly to any savings you would make by taking out a contract for a 24 month term. 

 

What is in it for me to change the existing set- up, even if I wanted to. Nought. 

Well, for one, this palaver wouldn't happen again...

Well, for one, this palaver wouldn't happen again...

Well, I don't know about these things, as I've only just had the screw-thread on my neck re-oiled, but the proposition you quote is tantamount to corporate Blackmail.

 

In simple terms,  the "Offer" is framed in terms and in the context similar to that used by the criminal protection rackets used in the 1950s, . . . "If you pay my boy Frankie a monthly endowment on demand he won't come round and "Clean" your windows ",usually followed by a "You know what I mean ?" I'd like to see a lawyer make the argument to distinguish between this and what BT's esteemed minnions are doing.

 

My ancient copy of Smith and Hogan on Criminal Law refers to s.21 of the Theft Act 1968 (Probably updated by now):-

 

" (1) A person is guilty of Blackmail if, with intent to gain for himself or another or with intent to cause loss of another, he makes any unwarranted demnd with menaces, and for this purpose a demand with menaces is unwarranted unless the person making it does so in the belief:-

 

    (a) That he has reasonable grounds of making the demand.

 

If they are unable or unwilling to provide the detail data usage necessary  for me to reconcile my usage figures with their's on a sessional basis (Who uses their computer solidly 24 x 7 for a month ?)  someone might argue that the demand for payment of an excess use charge is unwarranted an that the context in which the "Offer"  is made constitutes menaces

 

Nick

Edited 14 January, 20179 yr by Clunkclick

What on earth is the point of this thread when you aren't listening to anything that people are saying to help you?

Vent his spleen I suppose, before it becomes all too self consuming..

I am thinking of going BT optical, the thread won't put me or millions of others off, bottom line you cant please all of the people all of the time, that's why they have dedicated customer don't care depts.. morale of the story get the contract right in the first place.

Edited 14 January, 20179 yr by B33fy

Vent his spleen I suppose, before it becomes all too self consuming..

I am thinking of going BT optical, the thread won't put me or millions of others off, bottom line you cant please all of the people all of the time, that's why they have dedicated customer don't care depts.. morale of the story get the contract right in the first place.

But if you really pay attention... hes not on a contract as it apparently expired..

But if you really pay attention... hes not on a contract as it apparently expired..

lol...

But if you really pay attention... hes not on a contract as it apparently expired..

Age-wise, I'm past the point where the pyschology of being part of the main stream i.e. "On-Contract" (And the inferred increase in status that goes with that),  "Floats my boat" or "Pulls my string". So you're wasting your time there.

 

Judging by the recent contractual "Offer" made by BT to me, there's no advantage to an existing customer in being "On-Contract." But, I'm keen to learn. Please advise.

 

Even if that situation indicates that I'm "Out-of_fashion" or, perhaps  it even disadvantages me, so what ? That's not the main issue here.

 

More importantly,  what does it say about BT account management and general attention to detail in that organisation?

 

Says, random, hap-hazard action and perhaps staffing composed of disinterested, demotivated individuals who  run on idle most of the time and only "Do the right thing" when the cosh is out and the pressure on from a top-down campaign. 

 

Typical bureaucracy.

 

As regards "Being on Fibre", my understanding is that BT's next great technological leap will be G.Fast - which is just a deployment of improved signalling technology and which relies on existing FTTC and only promises rewards to customers who are within 200 feet of an existing roadside box with data rates above Infinity 2.- and the fall-off of performance against distance over 200 feet is reported to be even greater than the existing service.

 

N

Edited 15 January, 20179 yr by Clunkclick

I actually wasnt having a go there Nick, simply pointing out an oversight by @b33fy in his post.

Ive been caught up by an overuse charge on our data cap in the past, wasnt us, the wifi was being used by some other *@@&er around our estate.

followed by the ISP being reasonable about sorting it out. Split the overcharge and gave us an increased datacap in case it happened again.

Judging by the recent contractual "Offer" made by BT to me, there's no advantage to an existing customer in being "On-Contract." But, I'm keen to learn. Please advise.

Once again. Being 'on-contract' with unlimited data would stop this entire issue from ever happening. Would save you endless time installing and recording monitoring software to compare to BTs figures and would mean you have more time that isn't spend writing angry emails and challenging capitalist regimes.

That sounds like a good deal to me to be honest. But I'm not retired and I value my time.

Once again. Being 'on-contract' with unlimited data would stop this entire issue from ever happening. Would save you endless time installing and recording monitoring software to compare to BTs figures and would mean you have more time that isn't spend writing angry emails and challengiAreng capitalist regimes.

That sounds like a good deal to me to be honest. But I'm not retired and I value my time.

Good help British Industry if you think that's a good deal - one in which all the concessions are made on one side. Best advice - Don't go anywhere near gay Paris  or the RMT offices this weekend

 

Let's enumerate the relative advantages/disadvantages to see where the balance lies.

 

Disadvantages to me

 

1). I've got to move from non-contracted "Open-term"  position to  contracted fixed term - with all the admin hassle that involves when the contract term expires.

 

2). As a consequence of that, I will be probably compelled to move to paying by direct debit (I'm currently paying electronically at my instigation) - that implies a loss of future negotiating leverage to me.

 

3). I have to pay an Excess Usage charge of £120 (Non-negotiable) without any corresponding prospect of a future benefit.  A charge which I believe is "Trumped-up" in order to provide a stick to beat me with to get me onto an unlimited service, which I didn't require anyway not being interested BT TV, Netflix or Football - because my average usage was always been below the monthly data cap and has been since the "Excess Use period".

 

Advantages to me

 

1). Unlimited use at no extra charge - a service that I don't require because by monthly usage to date in a normal month is one half to two thirds of the monthly data cap.

 

Disadvantages to BT

 

1). None.

 

Advantages to BT

 

1). Huge savings in Admin costs and reputational loss due to the discard of associated monitoring data use and defending disputed usage figures.

 

2). Setting-up the broadband system in anticipation of G. Fast so that there is no impediment to further expansion of the "Streamed-economy" and the introduction of "Network of things"

 

If these points were placed on a balance scale, who wins do you think ? Its all in BT's favour.

 

I might consider taking the offer up if the phoney excess use charge was removed,  thus restoring the balance of advantage/disadvantage to a more evenly balanced position, otherwise go whistle.

 

N

Edited 15 January, 20179 yr by Clunkclick

one deal BT have on at the moment is on Infinity 1 Unlimited with a £125 reward card (a pre-loaded Master Card) so you get your £120 back. It's £39.99/ month for phone and BB so you get to keep your pointless BT security etc.

Or if you're that hard up then BT Basic is available but there's a 12Gb download cap but seeing as you tend to download the whole internet per month it's pointless you getting that :D

Or just move to Vodafone and get unlimited fibre broadband for £26 including line rental.

https://www.vodafone.co.uk/broadband/deals?cid=ppc-mec-auto/lznty/lzvnylnty/qrnuo

No..No . . No.. No. . No.

 

They created this balls-up, they can clean up the mess.l

 

I am the purchaser, they are the provider - they are the ones who should be busting their lallies to provide me with a reasonable solution.

 

Isn't that what Customer Service, in its widest interpretation (Perhaps unfashionable nowadays) is supposed to do. The clues in the words Customer . . . and Service.

 

I don't need to do anything apart from comply with Ombudsman (Communications) process, which I note is now set-up on line with the entry of its first document from BT. No action on me yet.

 

Incidentally, I think I may have found out where all this extra data use is coming from:-

 

 

 

N

Edited 15 January, 20179 yr by Clunkclick

Once again. Being 'on-contract' with unlimited data would stop this entire issue from ever happening. Would save you endless time installing and recording monitoring software to compare to BTs figures and would mean you have more time that isn't spend writing angry emails and challenging capitalist regimes.

That sounds like a good deal to me to be honest. But I'm not retired and I value my time.

If you can't be arsed, you don't get - all its cost me is 1 x E-mail  week since end of September, about 5 minutes a week.

 

N

and you're as stubborn as a mule.

I am the purchaser, they are the provider - they are the ones who should be busting their lallies to provide me with a reasonable solution

No no no no, no.

You purchased a limited plan. You agreed to excess usage charges. You used excess. You've been charged.

As to why on earth you think you should be let off charges you yourself agreed to when you took out the service is beyond me.

Your ENTIRE argument rests on the fact you say BT have (deliberately?) falsified the usage logs to scam money out of you. In reality, Their systems have flagged you as overused and you have been charged accordingly. they have done nothing but be reasonable to you throughout this based on the information they have.

This transition from capped Broadband to unlimited is obviously a change which benefits BT and the wider internet long-term strategic way. 

 

Why handle it in such a cack-handed way. 

 

Surely,  the initial  E-mail offer  to existing customers  (Including me) starting in  December 2015  and repeated from January to February 2016 (And which I ignored because my existing data usage was below the monthly data cap) was couched in the wrong terms. Instead of "Move to an unlimited service for an extra £6 a month", it should have read "Move to an unlimited service at no extra charge for 12 months, thereafter £3 a month" - incentivising existing customers. After all that's what they are offering for newbies. Discrimination ?

 

Instead in April 2016, they unilaterally changed the specification of my Infinity 1 service to 45GB monthly data cap (from 40GB) and 52MBs (From 38MBs) download speed at an extra charge of £3 a month !

 

Then at the end of June the data monitor software in my on-line BT account went of f-line for 4 days (I've got screen shots to prove it) - this is an event is reported by loads of victims of this BT data usage inflation scam on BT's own Community forums.

 

Next thing I knew was reciving a BT E-mail in August reporting excess use in July. And then I got similar E-mails for August  and September.

 

Jaw-Jaw is better than war-war !

 

N

 

N

 

 

No no no no, no.

You purchased a limited plan. You agreed to excess usage charges. You used excess. You've been charged.

As to why on earth you think you should be let off charges you yourself agreed to when you took out the service is beyond me.

Your ENTIRE argument rests on the fact you say BT have (deliberately?) falsified the usage logs to scam money out of you. In reality, Their systems have flagged you as overused and you have been charged accordingly. they have done nothing but be reasonable to you throughout this based on the information they have.

Whenever has an institution that is beholden to the City of London ever demanded money for nothing ? - excluding Pay Day loans @ 3000% interest ?

 

BT's whole broadband business model seems to be based on attracting  new customers (Through saturation TV advertising) at a faster rate than disgusted existing customers are leaving and, as noted by the Public Accounts Committee, this is accompanied by the minimum of investment in infrasructure -  that's an income maximisation model. Now who would that suit, shareholders or customers ?

 

I'm sure it is a ruse, with the object of perhaps 50% money raising, 50% with the strategic aim of getting customers ready for the next wave of internet marketing i.e. streaming and web of things which are data intensive and they'll not want data caps interfering with the marketing of those services - that would be shooting yourself in the Berkeley Squares in marketing terms.

 

As said, its widely reported by other BT Broadband customers on the Community Fora, this exact Modus Operandi as I experienced last year. And, in fact, a different version of this was used to compel me to change from their earlier 2 MB ADSL service to infinity in 2010/ 2011 - service interruption.

 

They are a Marketing department with all the skill of the NKVD.

 

What is the Russian word for protection racket ?

 

N

Edited 15 January, 20179 yr by Clunkclick