Hi all - I'm in search of some diagnosis and advice.  I've recently bought my first car (a late learner!  I've introduced myself to the forum...)  So please bear in mind throughout this post that I'm a bit wet behind the ears - and I'll probably come across as incredibly naive as well!  I'm learning all the time, but my technical knowledge is a bit thin.

 

It's a used Skoda Fabia MkII Monte Carlo 2011, and while I'm mostly enjoying it, recently has been giving me a bit of trouble.  There's a bit of a backstory - I'll try to keep this as brief as possible...!

 

I bought the car from a small local dealer for a decent price, knowing that there were some aftermarket extras - the wheels are not the originals, but I as I understand they are authentic Skoda wheels (in perfect condition) - in appearance, they seem to be the same as the ones pictured on this Fabia Scout or this 2015 Fabia, if that's any help.

 

When I was driving along the motorway a few weeks ago, for the first time it began to feel a little unstable - the steering wheel will judder a lot from around 60mph+ (at lower speeds, it feels like the steering wheel can be influenced a lot by any blemishes on the road).  And at higher speeds the car seems to want to pull in both directions - the only way I can describe the sensation of driving it is like riding a bike on a windy day - ie. it'll happen inconsistently and when it does it feels like I'm having to apply a bit of pressure to the steering wheel one way or another to stay in the centre of the road.  I am assuming these things are all linked, as they all seem to have begun at the same time.  It is driveable, especially short distances to work etc, but I've only reluctantly used the motorway since then.

 

I was told advised that it could be wheel balancing, and I took it to a local Halfords Auto Centre, who got the wheels balanced for me.  (Turns out that didn't sort it.)  And that's when I found out that the front wheels had 10mm spacers - they told me if it wheel balancing didn't sort it that they could either take the spacers off or I should get hubcentric ones fitted instead.  When refitting the wheels, the chap said he wasn't able to fully torque down the bolts (it was all Greek to me at the time, before I began doing my research... but is this caused by the bolts being too long?  Sounds like the bolts were also replaced by a previous owner when fitting the new wheels - they were happy enough to flag that on the wheel balancing invoice and let me drive out of there...)

 

And so I took it to a local Merityre yesterday with the hope of just getting the spacers removed (I don't have the gear to do it myself!) - but when the mechanic had a look, he said he couldn't do it without the standard-size bolts, as extended ones had been used to fit the spacers.  They didn't have any in stock, and I was about to head over to collect a bunch from Euro Car Parts, when he discovered that he wouldn't be able to remove the spacers after all... seemingly my car has also had coilover suspension fitted, and he suggested that the spacers were fitted to prevent the tyres getting shredded!

 

Of course, I'm now regretting not getting a car that has had little modifications made!  But that's the situation, and therefore my ambitions are now a) to get my car running safely and without any wobbles, B) not to downgrade any upgrades that have been made, if avoidable and c) not to spend an arm and a leg getting it sorted.

 

So - after that lengthy explanation - my questions are:

• Could it be as something as simple as the wrong length wheel bolts that is causing the issue?  If they don't quite torque down to 120Nm as recommended?  If so, what kind of bolts would I need to use for my wheels with 10mm universal spacers?
• Is it likely that hubcentric spacers will solve any of the problems I've come across?
• If, as the chap at Merityre mentioned, the tyres will be too close to the coilover suspension, is it a possibility to use narrower tyres to overcome this?  My current tyres are 205/40R17 - unfortunately I don't know the wheel width.

Any advice you're able to give, all really appreciated.  Everyone I've spoken to seems to have a different explanation or recommendation - and, as I think I've mentioned once or twice (!) I'm pretty much a novice when it comes to anything more complicated than filling the petrol tank!  And so I'd rather get some advice before committing to trying one thing or another.

 

Do let me know if there's some important info that I might have omitted, which might be useful to know...

Hi.

I'm not an expert and definitely not a mechanic so please only take what I say as my own experience.

I've had a few modded cars and provided the mods have been done correctly then there are no issues in terms of handling. In effect such mods should make the car more stable as opposed to less.

You mentioned the car pulls in both directions and has had the suspension modded. I would get the set up checked out by a decent garage. One that can do tracking will be able to sort out the toe and camber angles as necessary and tracking is what I've usually had done when my cars have pulled one way or the other. Admittedly I've never had one that has pulled in both directions.

I would assume that the tyres are not set correctly and this is the reason for pulling and any judders.

Hope this helps.

Kam

First the wheel you show are not as on a Monte Carlo, they are as standard Trinity, & some later had Gigaro as fitted to MK2 vRS.

The tyres as standard were 205/40 R 17

(If Skoda built a Mk3 Fabia Scout like the image and with those wheels it might sell rather well.)

 

?

What brand of tyres are fitted, and are all 4 the same Brand?

 

So Coil overs, spacers and who knows what else, you need someone to help that knows what they are doing, ie the mods are done correctly.

then you need a 4 wheel alignment check.

 

?

Not important now,  but do you have good insurance on this car with 'All Modifications Declared'?

You need to as well as getting it safe to be on the road.

Edited 16 January, 20179 yr by Offski

You are driving a vehicle that is not safe. If you cannot torque the wheel bolts down properly the wheels could come off and this is apart from the fact that it does not steer properly. If you have a bump you could easily find yourself uninsured. I don't think that your insurance company is going to be very happy at all.

Thanks for some of the advice here.  My naivety is shining through like a beacon throughout, isn't it.

 

In reply:

 

Offski - tyres are Avon, all the same brand.  I declared what extras I knew of when I bought it (ie. wheels, privacy glass), and I asked the seller (a small trader) whether there were any other mods I'd need to declare, and he didn't mention any other than the wheels - that was a text exchange, so I have it down on record should that have to surface down the line somewhere.  Reasonably speaking, should I have been expected to make these inspections myself - spacers, suspension, etc?  Or is this something that gives me a leg to stand on?  (Edit: I don't mean a leg to stand on with the insurer - I intend to correct any omissions asap... I meant in terms of taking it up with the trader.)

 

Briskodian - noted and understood, and I'll get the wheel bolts replaced asap.  Can I please ask what length bolts I'd need in the short term, accounting for the current 10mm spacers that are fitted?

 

Any solid advice as to what next steps to take to resolve the issues, I'd be grateful.  I'm a fish out of water.  I've half a mind to ring my local Skoda dealer and ask them to retro-fit all the original parts at a gigantic expense in parts and labour...  :thumbdown:

Edited 18 January, 20179 yr by rckd

Standard bolts are 49mm total length, so you want 59mm, but a 10mm spacer, particularly non hubcentric ones are a big spacer, and, personally, I would be a lot happier going back to standard suspension and sorting things from there.

Thanks Peter - that's the route I'm leaning towards. Think it'll cost me an arm and a leg mind. Better to go via Skoda directly or just as good to go via a VAG specialist? There are a couple quite close to me.

Can you take a picture of the wheels you have and any casting markings?

Maybe the Coil Overs as well.

 

Someone might do a swap for you on the wheels / tyres, 

as for the suspension there might be a Briskoda member near you that is willing to help by looking at what is what with your car.

Right, to make a pretty major correction, it is the *locking nuts* on each of the wheels that won't fully torque, while the rest of them are fine - so there are four bolts which are secured properly on each of the wheels.  Which, while not at all perfect, is a lot better than none at all.

 

My apologies; as I mentioned, it was all over my head when I first visited the Halfords when the problem first arose, and I wrote the original post from memory (rather than checking over the documentation which I got from them).  So, I take it that the bolts are the correct length to compensate for the spacers at present.  It did seem odd to me that they would allow me to drive away with such a fundamental issue, and that the chap in the Merityre didn't seem too bothered when he refitted the wheels!

 

I'll edit the original post to correct that, in case any other forum members take a look at this thread and start panicking on my behalf.

 

Offski - I'll grab a few pics shortly... I've left my camera at work, and my phone battery is currently slowly charging... at the moment, it dies when it gets below about 25% (anyone know any good Samsung forums...?!?)

 

And, if there is any opportunity for a bit of help from Briskoda members based around Reading/Berkshire/Thames Valley, I'd be hugely grateful!

See the pics below...

 

 

Apologies for the quality of some of these snaps... taken in the black of night with a micro torch and a phone!

 

So - tyres are 205/40R17 and wheels are 7Jx17H2 ET46.

 

Can't get any deeper into the suspension... will there be some useful markings on there that would also help?

 

Also I can't seem to edit older posts now; wonder if that's because I'm still a new member?

After doing a little more research, the symptoms I'm having seem to marry up well with worn shock absorbers.

 

I tend to 'feel' the blemishes in the road a lot at low speeds (as well as getting the steering wheel rattle at higher speeds) - I didn't think too much of this before now as all of the diagnosis I'd been given related to wheel balance, tracking, spacers, etc.  But I think it is the suspension that is the issue.

 

In that respect, is a healthy suggestion to get a new standard suspension fitted, remove the wheel spacers, and see where that leaves me?  I'd be surprised if that doesn't sort it.  However my worry is how much it'll set me back - any estimations?

 

Thanks all for your help so far.

I'm having same issue with my 2011 Monte carlo. More so with right hand side vibration. Like a damper is shot. I might change the shocks to standard but don't know which standards will fit. I have also bought 16" wheels to replace my 17" so I have more tyre depth to absorb vibration. Every time I go over a speed bump it's like hitting a brick wall !!