Auxilliary belt failure on Octavia

[grez73]

Hi I'm looking for peoples thoughts on my current scenario. I've got a Skoda Octavia Elegance 2010 (recently valued at around £5k) and it's now currently in the garage when a few days ago I seemingly lost power and had to be recovered. The recovery guy noticed that the fuel filter was leaking so I was hoping that's all it would be. I got towed to what was my favorite garage (will remain nameless for now but not a Skoda dealer) and they had a look and noticed that the auxiliary belt although still on barely was severely shredded. I had plans that weekend so I had to leave the car with them. They subsequently contacted me to tell me that the belt had knocked the timing belt out by 180 degrees and damaged it, may have possibly caused engine damage. They said they won't be able to prove engine damage however until they've fitted a new timing belt and tested it.

 

My concern is that same garage a month ago did a *full* service on the car, looking at what should include it should have included a check on the auxiliary belt as part of it. No comments had been noted on the service however and to me if the belt was fine a month ago why would it shred and cause potential engine damage (to be confirmed tomorrow)?

 

I do recognise that my first mistake was not getting the car serviced at a main dealer, but if the full service was done properly surely an auxiliary belt a month from failing would have been noticed? I don't do much distance driving on the car and the mileage just ticked over 50,000m a few days ago so it's not really done much.

 

Do you think the garage that did the service and potentially did not spot what must have been an auxiliary belt about to fail liable and worth pursuing for costs?

 

I'd very much value your thoughts on this, I'm concerned that if engine damage is proved then this could effectively write-off the car (based on it's recent £5k valuation)

[meta55b]

Aux belts can go at any time, so proving they missed a faulty part and not damaged by some kind if debris from the road, is a no go. It's also a common issue that the aux belt can take out the timing belt. It's also common for the fuel filter to start leaking and contaminating the aux belt causing it prematurely to fail. You have made no mention if you have lifted the bonnet to do any routine checks in the last month since the car was serviced. maybe if you did, you would have noticed the fuel filter leaking and contaminating the aux belt causing  it to shred. 

[grez73]

Thanks for the info meta,  I can confirm that I didn't pop the bonnet in between the service and then failure a month later, and an interesting possible link regarding the fuel filter leak as that was definitely changed as part of the service. Worst big of this sorry tale is that I agreed purchase of a new skoda octavia literally the day before with this car part x as the deposit - unsure how that will work now.

[erindad]

7 hours ago, grez73 said:

They subsequently contacted me to tell me that the belt had knocked the timing belt out by 180 degrees and damaged it, may have possibly caused engine damage

  ?  I wonder what they mean , if it had knocked the timing out 180 degrees there would definitely be engine damage, it would have stopped with a bang but the timing belt knocked out 180 ?

 

Debris from the broken auxiliary belt can get caught up in the timing belt area and destroy it

 

 The fuel filters can leak if the top has been removed by levering off (and twisting it) with a screwdriver when changing the filter element , or the sealing O ring has been damaged and not replaced.

[Ju1ian1001]

The thing with a TDI is, if the the timing/cam belt fails you would know straight away; as the engine would make a nice loud noise and stop, when you try to restart and would just turn over much quicker due to lack of compression.

 

The timing would not be 180 degrees out, there would be no timing at all as the cams won't be turning, and the valves will certainly be bent after making contact with the piston's.

 

I can't see the fuel filter leaking would cause the aux belt to fray as it's pretty far away in the o/s/f corner to contaminate the belt to be honest, a frayed or damaged aux belt should of been spotted on the service as it's checkable item be any garage or mechanic, i always give these belts a quick an MOT when i switch the engine off.

 

The dealer you are doing the part x with may not go ahead now or might reduce the value of your trade in, as they will do is sent it to auction.

Edited 3 April, 2017 by Ju1ian1001

[mikey vrs]

When the garage carried out your service did they replace the fuel filter? there has been a few posts on here where people have had their car serviced & a few weeks later the timing belt has failed due to aux belt failing due to diesel leaking over it from the fuel filter housing which has been leaking due to the garage damaging the housing & causing the leak onto the aux belt which then fails & gets into the timing belt area..its becoming quite a regular issue nowadays. 

[octyal]

You say that "...noticed that the auxiliary belt although still on barely was severely shredded" was there debris wrapped around the crank pulley, or any sign of damage to the timing belt covers? If there is no damage on the outer covers, then it is highly unlikely that the aux belt has caused a timing failure - the covers are there to prevent foreign body damage to the timing components.

It is possible that one of the pulleys may be damaged or out of line, which can cause the belt to fail. It may be worth checking what the service schedule is for the aux belt as well, possibly past it's best and needed changing. Plenty of possibilities to be looked at on this one, photo's would help

[Phil-E]

There's no recommendation for age/mileage on the aux belt.

 

Just one of those "inspect and replace as necessary" items.

 

It sounds exactly like described above. They have replaced the fuel filter and levered the lid off and bent it. This then makes it almost impossible to get a tight seal again on it without replacing the housing. This has then leaked diesel on the belt causing it to fail.

 

I have always replaced aux belts regularly. Usually at the same time as a cambelt change as they're only a few ££.

[grez73]

Thanks all for your help,  I've just had it formally confirmed by the garage now they've got the aux and timing belt on that it no longer works. I'm guessing a fix or a new engine for a car valued at £5k probably isn't worth it. So looks like I'll have to go down a formal complaint route. Garage confirmed that they could only see s small bit of the belt when doing the previous service a month ago - I wonder if that sort of inspection is normal but it probably cost me my car. Anyone think the garage may have a case to answer possibly?

[grez73]

Just a quick update on this. The garage paid for a formal inspection a week ago, I attended the inspection and asked a lot of questions. The inspector agreed with what a few others had said about fluid causing damage to the belt and must have reflected this in the report. The garage after receiving the report have accepted responsibility and will therefore be replacing the engine with a replacement one, not a new one but one that's done less mileage. A great result, and without too much pushing have also agreed to arrange a hire car until the replacement engine has been put in. I think that's one heck of a result and I'm happy with this especially after assuming I'd have to battle to get responsibility accepted. Fingers crossed all this will bring it to a conclusion and I'll get my car back in working order in time to complete the part exchange agreement for the new one.

 

As an aside the garage blamed the fuel filter being faulty rather than the fitting being done wrong - but given they are covering the cost I don't mind either way, it was an interesting viewpoint to hear though :-)

Edited 20 April, 2017 by grez73

[Sarge]

Fair play to the garage. Hopefully it'll all get sorted to your satisfaction.