..... at the side of the road with the basic car kit?

 

You might want to go and practice to ensure that when you get a flat on a dark wet night, you can actually do something that you’re pretty sure you know how to do.

 

Today started sub-zero but soon got up to around 3 degrees, so I thought I’d better fit the winter wheels I acquired recently.

 

Having done the wheel swap trick a few times I’m fully tooled up to do this in the comfort of my own yard.

 

Trolley jack. Super long undo wrench. Impact gun. Torque wrench.

The only Skoda tool was the locking key as I’d already had to buy my own Tweezers to pull the wheel bolt caps.

 

The car is just over a year old and has just over 8,000 miles and to be fair to my good lady, the wheels are spotless bar one very small stone chip on one spoke.

 

The first disappointing find was that all the factory fitted wheel bolts were nowhere near the120 nm mentioned in the manual.

When I tested a few with my torque wrench, I found that they came out with less than 50 nm. Oops.

 

I wasn’t really surprised to find that every wheel was stuck to the hub. And I mean Really Stuck.

 

The left side wheels came off with what I call a medium amount of kicking.

 

The front right needed an extra heavy bout of kicking.

 

While the right rear caused me to pause and catch my breath before reaching for a heavy hammer - after saying to myself  “don’t hit the wheel with a hammer” - and after a real kicking a few careful hammer blows (using a piece of wood on the tyre wall) resulted in the wheel finally popping off.

 

All this kicking can only be done safely with the car on a proper trolley jack, not the piece of bent tin supplied by Skoda for roadside repairs.

 

After a clean up the “new” winter wheel set popped on very easily of course.

 

Now to road test them.

 

The pics show the corrosion that sticks wheel to hub.

Oh and the icicles too.

 

BTW - was gutted to find my impact gun was missing the charger (must go have a word with someone) but delighted to find that my power drill happily spun a 17mm socket to spin all the wheel bolts in and out.

 

Be careful out there.

 

ps - I always leave the locking bolts a bit less tight than all the other bolts as I’d hate to find one of them stuck one day.

Very good story

I have always used the trick of loose wheel bolts, drop the car back on the floor and rock the whole car to free a wheel siezed on to the hub. Especially good if you break down at the side if the road with good clothes on and no hammers.

 

 

 

 

A pair of heavy duty gardening gloves are permanently in the back of my car for just such occasions.

I do it for the dirty brake dust laden wheels here but imagine that they would be a godsend in the cold.

You are lucky that your wheels were stuck on the hub as  having only 50nm tq on the wheels, you could have been driving on 3 wheels!

 

Can I suggest that you clean off that rust on the hub with a wire brush and use some copper anti-seize on the hub - this is from experience.  I had the stuck rim as well but some gentle rocking got mine off and don't expect any issues next time when I rotate them after having applied some anti seize.

 

My bolts were torqued something ridiculous by the tyre shop that I almost popped a bicep and a vein trying to remove half the wheel bolts when doing a rotation.

 

 

as the post above whats the consensus? copper slip on the mating surfaces, yes or no?

Edited 13 December, 20178 yr by JohnnyType2

One of the other benefits of swapping on to winters every year. You get to sort stuff like this out when it suits you and keep on top of it twice a year.

 

On the occasion I have let someone else fit a wheel to one of mine I tend to find them WAY over-torqued with the windy gun. No chance of getting the bolts off with the pathetic brace supplied with the cars these days. I have either a 18" breaker or spider in mine

 

If that doesn't do it there's a 3 foot snap-on in the workshop that sorts most things out. It also works well on the guy behind the windy-gun who caused the problem in the first place. 

 

I tend to use molybdenum disulfide (Moly) grease. Although I get the theory have never seen any problems with copper grease myself. I tend to have a pot of Moly handy and use it.

 

Edited 13 December, 20178 yr by flybynite

'Simply Clever'.

 

People need to be aware that 'FULL MAIN DEALER SERVICING' In the UK,  or buying a 'SKODA APPROVED USED CAR'.

can mean that the wheels have never ever been off since the car left the factory and the Manufacturers Warranty has Expired.

Maybe not before a MOT at 3 years old, and still not after 4 years and a MAJOR SERVICE.

 

So unless you are taking wheels off, changing tyres or having Brakes Serviced and Maintained the Technicians might never remove the wheels.

Even pay for a Brake Fluid change and that does not guarantee the wheels are taken off.

 

Even at the PDI there is no guarantee the wheel bolt tightness is checked, or at any service after you collect the car.

No guarantee either with a SKODA APPROVED USED CAR, because the 'RIGOROUS CHECKS' do not mean any Servicing is carried out.

34 minutes ago, JohnnyType2 said:

as the post above whats the consensus? copper slip on the mating surfaces, yes or no?

 

I always clean and put  a fresh smear of copper slip on the spigot each time I change to winter/summer wheels on my Yeti.

never felt the need for copper slip personally - if they stick a bit it's only a mild kick needed to free them off in my experience

 

as above, swapping winters/summers means you always know they're torqued correctly as you've done it yourself.

 

i also carry my breaker bar in the boot just in case, plus a pair of gloves

11 hours ago, TechieAli said:

I have always used the trick of loose wheel bolts, drop the car back on the floor and rock the whole car to free a wheel siezed on to the hub. Especially good if you break down at the side if the road with good clothes on and no hammers.

 

 

 

 

 

Hanmers??

There was no “mild kicking” involved.

 

This was a full on assault wearing heavy boots. And hammer.

 

I noted the tip about loosening the bolts then lowering the car car, but with such a tight fit on the centre spigot - well done Skoda - I think it would take some wheel spin / braking to rock the wheel rotationally to free it. Not so easy on this one.

 

Indeed, I cleaned and greased the hubs. That’s a given.

 

I’m also not shy about cleaning and lubing wheel bolts with a wipe down before fitting.

And I do reduce the bolt torque a bit if I think there’s any lube left on the bolts.

Edited 13 December, 20178 yr by BoxerBoy

Rob_e,

Good stuff when you are a DIY'er.

 

Many notice the White Spider on the Centre Caps, then the White Spider on the Diamond Cut VW Group wheels.

& go to remove the wheel, then find the Hub and Alloy have mated nicely, and that Corrosion welding the Hub to the Alloy with no barrier of Grease is causing the wheels corrosion.

It is just how it is with 2 dissimilar metals.  Nothing new, so most with a clue know what to do to inhibit this corrosion.

(not much you can do with the Not Fit for purpose coatings on VW Group Diamond Cut face Alloys, but the same is happening to the painted ones, you just can notr see it...)

 

 

The OP's Hub & Centre bore are not as bad as they can get when no Copper Slip is applied between the mating surfaces.

Alloy of wheels rather different from the Hub Material.  ie Dissimilar Metals / Alloys.

 

Those with the likes of a Fabia or Citigo with Drum Brakes and Alloy wheels really need to go check if their wheels can be removed without a Road Side First Responder with big boots and a BFH.

Edited 13 December, 20178 yr by AwaoffSki

12 hours ago, TechieAli said:

I have always used the trick of loose wheel bolts, drop the car back on the floor and rock the whole car to free a wheel siezed on to the hub. Especially good if you break down at the side if the road with good clothes on and no hammers.

Always worth putting a small amount of copper grease between the hub and the wheel, as that makes it much less likely for the wheel to seize.

 

I didn't do that in the Spring (as we were moving house and it was packed away) and swapping Summer to Winter wheels was a real PITA.

Edited 13 December, 20178 yr by SWBoy

There is a move away from using copper with alloy wheels. Most manufacturers (car and component) are using either a molybdenum-disulphide or lithium grease.

 

THIS is a good read

 

Although Textar are trying to sell you CeraTec, Comma make both Copper-ease and Lith-Moly. Copaslip is made by Molyslip so they have no axe to grind

 

Like I said, not seen an issue personally, used thinly then cleaned and re-applied fairly regularly can't see much of a problem but things move on and what worked for years doesn't always get on with more modern materials.

13 hours ago, TechieAli said:

I have always used the trick of loose wheel bolts, drop the car back on the floor and rock the whole car to free a wheel siezed on to the hub. Especially good if you break down at the side if the road with good clothes on and no hammers.

 

 

 

 

Absolutely. Loose them off one full turn. Then drive about 1 wheel revolution. Does the trick everytime and doesn't damage anything. 

4 minutes ago, Bignij said:

Absolutely. Loose them off one full turn. Then drive about 1 wheel revolution. Does the trick everytime and doesn't damage anything. 

 

That sounds like the job. Do you do one at a time or all 4 at once and get a wobbly car? 

Works every time that it works, when like yours and not that bad.

Does not work 100% of the times out on the road in even the workshop where removing wheels still on a hub needs doing sometime.

 

Nothing is new with the issue of wheels almost impossible to get off, and requiring heat sometimes and lots of brute force, 

and on occasion wrecked wheels.

4 minutes ago, BoxerBoy said:

 

That sounds like the job. Do you do one at a time or all 4 at once and get a wobbly car? 

All 4. You only have to take them out 1 revolution. Which is 1.5 - 2mm depending on thread pitch. You don't notice any difference. If you planned on a motorway blast with them loose it might be a different proposition. 

I carry a piece of timber off-cut (probably from a floorboard) to put under the jack to spread the load and stop it sinking if you have to change a wheel on soft ground. 

On 13/12/2017 at 08:26, JohnnyType2 said:

as the post above whats the consensus? copper slip on the mating surfaces, yes or no?

 

Only on the spigot, do not put any on the face that sits flush to the brake disc:

 

My 2p's worth...

Copper slip is about the worst grease you could possibly use between a steel hub and an aluminium alloy wheel. Mega electrolytic corrosion will ensue and pit the alloy mating face.

Copper slip is only any good on steel to steel interfaces.

Clean up all corroded surface areas with steel wool or Emery paper, wash down with brake cleaner then use a thin smear of something like brake grease (ceratec) only on the mating spigot surfaces and the outer few mm edge of the hub. 

 

NEVER GREASE THE WHEEL BOLTS OR GET GREASE IN THE HUB BOLT THREADS, clean them with a wire brush and again wash off debris with brake cleaner

 

Oh and whacking the sidewalls of a tyre with a lump hammer is not a good idea. 

 

Edited 15 December, 20178 yr by xman

Yeah I was also told to never grease wheel bolts/nuts, can make them loosen off.

 

I also slacken the bolts a turn and then rock the car to break the corrosion, as others have said. Its much safer than hitting wheels/tyres, especially on a jack or even stands.

 

Blade Skoda Gloucester did have our front wheels off at the 2 yr major service to inspect the brakes, so some dealers do it. 

 

 

Edited 15 December, 20178 yr by glosrich

I've always made sure the spare wheel kit works and I have supervised my wife in changing the wheel using the same to ensure she is never stranded, showing her how to lever the wheel into place and line up the bolt holes. As you can imagine she wasn't too happy but when it comes in conversation she now proudly says that she has changed a wheel on her own. 

 

I have had a wheel stuck on a previous Mini R56. It was the first time I'd tried to remove them and 3 out 4 came off with a bit of effort. The 4th, front right, would not budge. I tried dropping and driving it on loosened bolts with no joy.  Lump hammer against wood to protect the wheel but it wouldn't budge.  Ended up kicking it so hard that it nearly toppled off the axle stands but the wheel came off complete with the heel mark from my boot that had to sprayed over. 

 

All our cars have copperslip on all the mating surfaces of the wheels, once done never a problem to remove.

On 13/12/2017 at 09:53, AwaoffSki said:

(not much you can do with the Not Fit for purpose coatings on VW Group Diamond Cut face Alloys, but the same is happening to the painted ones, you just can notr see it...)

 

Never seen any diamond cut alloys avoid corrosion yet regardless of manufacturer