All Weather Tyres

[croquemonsieur]

Goodyear Vector 4 Seasons seem to be one of the popular choices in this category.  There is now a review of the recently announced latest version - Gen3 in a comparative review of 9 all weather tyres from Tyre Reviews.  It's their 1st choice having the overall most rounded performance

 

https://www.briskoda.net/forums/forum/364-skoda-karoq/?do=add

 

The Michelin X Climate, also often highly regarded here, is still best of the bunch in the dry, but is noted as one of the noisiest and least comfortable, the latter aspect echoing my experience and that of a friend. It is of course an XL tyre.

 

The review also included a reference summer tyre that they say is well regarded for comfort, but interestingly it was joint worst here with the X Climate and also tended to be noisy.  Did well in the wet though and best for rolling resistance (but Goodyear Gen3 a close 2nd here).

 

There was a new category I haven't seen before - as well as noise they looked at rough noise, but I would have liked to see further explanation of this.

 

I recall reading stuff on the Goodyear Site earlier this year, that the Gen3 has been designed to maintain it's winter performance over a longer period of the tyre life.  I believe this is the achilees heel of winter and all weather tyres, as the winter preformance tends to deteriorate once the tread groove depth wears lower than 5mm, but I don't know the details of what Goodyear have done.  Wear testing was excluded from this review, but they intend to look into it.

 

https://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/2020-Auto-Bild-All-Season-Tyre-Test.htm

 

The Goodyear Gen3 came top here too but the X climate did marginally better for noise.

[croquemonsieur]

Oops that first link should have been

 

https://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/2020-Tyre-Reviews-All-Season-Tyre-Test.htm

[croquemonsieur]

It's worth looking at the 25min video in the 1st Tyrereviews link.  For one thing, all the testing seems to have been done at Goodyear facilities, so maybe Goodyear tyres should do well, having been developed there.

 

The video does suggest at the end that if living say in SE England, where snow is rare these days, the Bridgestone Weather Control tyre could be the best option, not as good as the Goodyear in snow, but by far the best riding tyre (but Goodyear still good) and as quiet as the Goodyear + also similarly good rolling resistance.  On the other hand, it should be pointed out that the Autobuild review indicates that whereas the Goodyear Gen3 wears very well, the Bridgestone is one of the poorest.

 

Back to what is said on the Tyrereviews video, for me the rough surface noise levels are a more important consideration than the smooth road noise levels, as the former are typically 9-10dB greater.  My Karoq, on what seem to be regarded as rather average 17" Turenzas is very quiet on smooth tarmac, with just a gentle but not unpleasant woosh at 70mph, but noticeably noisier on course gravel and over rough ridges - and though not particularly bad here compared with other cars I've been in, any reduction is to be welcome.

 

The Tyrereviews sound level measurements were taken inside the car, whereas the Autobild noise comparisons were measured outside, which actually is of little value, so scrub that comment at the end of my opening message.

 

I think these tyre reviews could go one better still and also look at handling on rough roads - 5 years ago I tried a BMW sports version of an Active Tourer on low profile tyres and the steering on rough roads was dreadful - although presumably fine on a high speed test track.  I suspect good ride and handling in the rough go hand in hand.

 

Tyrereviews did note that a new version of the X Climate is due next year - so maybe that's worth waiting for.  My inclination at the moment though, following these reviews & when I get to reshoe the Karoq, is to forget about good summer tyres & go for the Goodyear Gen3, as these will be noticeably comfier and quieter than any summer tyre - even the notable Goodyear Efficient Grip, as used for the contol comparison.  I'll likely change to 16" wheels too, to further enhance these qualities.  But that just reflects my priorities, comfort being rather more important than ultimate handling - which I never really test and I don't mind losing a little bit of steering sharpness.

[Carlston]

One problem with tyrereviews is that they take price into account. They falsely claimed that the Vredestein Quatrac was expensive so marked it down in the tests. It came 2nd after the Goodyear G3 in the September 205/55R16 all-season tyre test, with Continental coming 3rd, and Michelin coming 4th. Maybe Vredestein would have won if they hadn't taken price into account. Prices go up and down all the time, so value should be left to the consumer to decide. Vredestein all-season tyres are usually cheaper than Goodyear, Continental, and Michelin. I prefer the older Vredestein Quatrac 5 which wasn't a directional tyre. Spare wheels should be capable of being fitted in any position on the car, not just on the left or on the right.

 

Edited 21 October, 2020 by Carlston

[Ootohere]

My priority is safety for me and mine and everyone else and noise and comfort are very low in my priority when choosing tyres.

[croquemonsieur]

Yes e-root, difficult to argue with that, but I'll have a go.  If 'good handling'  is the overiding safety factor - taking that in isolation would guide you towards using a good summer tyre, but then you'd need to change over to winter in late Autumn.  Probably wise where you are, but not many would bother in the South East and probably then safer overall to use all-weathers.  Anyway a few arguable points :-

 

Looking just at all-weathers, safety depends on the situation.  Comparing the Michelin & Goodyear for instance, the Michelin is better in the dry, particularly regarding braking, but the Goodyear generally better in the wet, so which is safer?  Difficult to say overall and the Goodyear has the better, quieter ride.

 

Is sporty ultra-sharp handling the only form of good handling? and when I refer to a little softness in the steering, I don't mean going as far as soggy or unsafe handling.  I do reckon many of the tyres in the reviews here can be regarded as very safe.

 

When it comes to needing to brake quickly on a bumpy or broken road surface, particularly on a bend, I speculate a more compliant tyre or rubber may keep it in more consistent contact with the road surface and this would equal better braking in this situation or less sliding/bumping sideways, but never seen any tests on this.  Certainly the BMW I previously referred to, felt rather alarming on a rippled road section - the steering wheel was almost dancing around in my hands - couldn't believe that they would release a car like that for sale, probably more to do with suspension settings than tyres alone and less sporty versions of this car likely don't suffer.

 

I reckon that a more comfy ride with low road roar and bump thump is less wearing for many, if not all people - certainly me - and so keeps one more alert & content (& so safer?), if doing anything more than short journeys.

[Ootohere]

@croquemonsieur

As i said safety first for me what ever the season and i have tyres to select from for traction and handling.

Noise, comfort or economy just do not enter the equation with me.

[croquemonsieur]

Actually, I'm unsure if Autobild and Tyrereviews were testing the same tyre, in view of the wildy differing wet handling results. Autobild refers to their testing a Quatrac tyre that had just superceeded the Quatrac 5, whereas Tyrereviews tested a Quatrac Pro.  I'm not familiar with the Vredstein Range these days though, but did once fit a set of their summer tyres once to my BMW 523 16+ years ago as they were a good price and recall being quite impressed, including noting the ride was a bit quieter than before.

 

Tyrereviews claim they apply the following weightings in their overall ratings - 30% wet handling, 25% dry ditto, 25% snow ditto, 10% noise and comfort & 10% rolling resistance.  In the video, they say the testing was done blind - no, not the driver blind folded, but he never new what tyre he was testing at any one time, as the wheels were covered so the driver couldn' t see the tyres as he entered & exited the car.

 

I acknowledge e-roots preference, but for me, ride & noise are worth more than that 10% weighting, because as well as driving pleasure, I believe amongst other things, this aspect is important for reducing driver fatigue and thus driver error - so, significant for car safety overall.

[Carlston]

5 hours ago, croquemonsieur said:

...Tyrereviews tested a Quatrac Pro.  I'm not familiar with the Vredstein Range...

 

The Quatrac Pro is a more summer focused tyre than the Quatrac 5. The Quatrac Pro is aimed at high performance cars so is made in wide, low profile tyre sizes usually with a high speed rating. Some tyre sizes are covered by both the Quatrac 5 and the Quatrac Pro. With other tyre sizes there will only be one choice. The Euro Label usually shows that the Quatrac Pro is 1 or 2 decibels louder than the Quatrac 5. In general, I prefer the Quatrac 5 but the Quatrac Pro might still be safe in the winter whereas an ultra-high performance summer tyre would not be safe in the winter. Safety, is mainly down to the driver. Drivers really shouldn't be having accidents just because their tyres' performance is a few percentage points off the very best. If you are sliding off the road into a ditch and driving into the back of stationary traffic because a tyre only came in 6th place in a tyre review, I would suggest that it wasn't the tyre that caused the accident.

 

Edited 22 October, 2020 by Carlston

[Phil-E]

I've just had a set of the Hankook Kinergy 4S fitted.

 

For the price they did pretty well in the tests.

[croquemonsieur]

Actually E-root, this 2019 Autobild review of summer tyres (seems to be performance car orientated), might just illustrate your point.  The Bridgestone Turanza T005 (these aren't the earlier Turanzas as on my 2019 Karoq) had the lowest rolling resistance and was rather poor in the dry, but  mixed in the wet.  It was also the noisiest tyre, yet surprisingly ride comfort was pretty good.  I think this has been described as an ECO tyre & maybe shows that concentration on any one performance aspect, doesn't lead to a balanced overall product.  The Michelin Pilot Sport was the winner and good at most things with a particularly good ride for a performance tyre, but actually not that good for rolling resistance.

[Ootohere]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited 24 November, 2020 by e-Roottoot

[croquemonsieur]

But it's only available in Trumpland.  Probably not for you anyway, way up North, as Tyre Reviews, though very impressed in most aspects including comfort and noise, said it wasn't as good as the X-Climate in compacted snow and ice and that latter tyre maybe doesn't anyway do as well in this respect as the competition.  Interesting though and I wonder if the new Michelin Soft Touch Velvet Sidewall technology will appear in the new version of the X-Climate due next year.  I'll be reading the 'Tyre Reviews' 2021 AW review before I change my car to AW tyres.

 

Seeing your photos E-Root of Scottish Roads in other threads, reminds me we haven't been North of the border for maybe 25 years and we must go back again sometime, after the Pandemic.  I've climbed Ben Nevis 3 times so don't want to do that again, but have really fond recollections of a trip to the Whisky area - we stayed in Stirling and Brora and as part of this did the drive right round the top coast including John O'Groats naturally.  At Ullapool, people on the dock, including us, were being thrown fish from a Fishing Boat in port.  Also a memorable drive back South via Balmoral.  It's actually easier for us SE types to go over to France & I reckon we didn't do any more miles on a trip down to Core D'Azur some years ago.

[Ootohere]

@croquemonsieur I have Michelin Alpin 6 on my FWD EV now to hopefully keep moving when there is some snow and Crossclimates for the summer and Crossclimates SUV's on my Shogun van and my Suzuki car, hopefully finished buying tyres for a while.

 

I do like my rubber, but as to what the sidewall looks or feels like it is not something i actually bother about, so no idea on the 'Soft touch velvet sidewall'. 

Just as long as the toilet paper available is 'Soft Touch'  i am larry. 

 

Edited 25 November, 2020 by e-Roottoot

[Mark-Surrey]

Does anybody know whether any of the tyre manufacturers offer good All Season tyres in runflat version yet?

 

I put Vredestein Quatrac Pro all season tyres on my wife’s Karoq. But my BMW 2-Series Gran Tourer has runflat tyres, and I couldn’t find any All Season tyres in runflat version, so I ended up having to get separate winter tyres and a 2nd hand set of alloys. But ideally, I’d like to not have to faff around changing the tyres on my BMW twice per year, and I’d also like to get some space back in my garage.  Particularly as where I live in Surrey, we generally don’t get snow very often at all, so all season tyres are a good option here.  I know that a lot of people hate runflat tyres for various very valid reasons. But personally, I like the safety aspect of knowing that a blow-out at high speed on a motorway likely isn’t going to be as dangerous, and that I’ll be able to carry on driving for up to another 50 miles to somewhere safer before having to get it replaced.

[SurreyJohn]

11 hours ago, Mark-Surrey said:

Does anybody know whether any of the tyre manufacturers offer good All Season tyres in runflat version yet?

 

I put Vredestein Quatrac Pro all season tyres on my wife’s Karoq. But my BMW 2-Series Gran Tourer has runflat tyres, and I couldn’t find any All Season tyres in runflat version, so I ended up having to get separate winter tyres and a 2nd hand set of alloys. But ideally, I’d like to not have to faff around changing the tyres on my BMW twice per year, and I’d also like to get some space back in my garage.  Particularly as where I live in Surrey, we generally don’t get snow very often at all, so all season tyres are a good option here.  I know that a lot of people hate runflat tyres for various very valid reasons. But personally, I like the safety aspect of knowing that a blow-out at high speed on a motorway likely isn’t going to be as dangerous, and that I’ll be able to carry on driving for up to another 50 miles to somewhere safer before having to get it replaced.

 

I think some of the Bridgestone weather control A005 range is available in run flat, but might be the older style, not the more recent evo version

 

Also some Pirelli Cinturato All season tyres have the seal inside 

 

I used to live in Surrey and as snow is rare, either of these might be suitable (if correct size is available), we have A005s on our second car, and their ability to deal with cold rain is outstanding, however only snow has been more of a dusting (than serious snow) and they were good.   I'm not familiar with Pirelli all seasons so can't comment on how they perform.

 

 

[Ootohere]

A puncture on the motorway might allow you to carry on off the motorway if lucky with run flats, but i would not unless in the hard shoulder with hazards on and the cops do not like that.

A blowout is rather different from a puncture, you are not continuing when there is a blowout.

 

My young lad recently returned to his BMW in a long stay car park and had a slow leak from the valve (according to the call i got).  He called around and nobody had a BMW valve but one place said by the time he got to them they could get one delivered.  He took a while to crawl along on the run flat for 4-5 miles to try to save wrecking the run flat and got away with it.

He also hit it lucky in that the fitter was prepared to do a repair on the runflat as there was a nail in it as well.

 

If the boot does not have to have the space to be jam packed with stuff i would rather have a spare wheel with a matching tyre to the ones on the car and a jack and wheel brace strapped in.  (even just one or a pair of the Summer or Winter set you have.)

I usually have 2 matching wheels / tyres in the boot for travels in winter in parts of Scotland.

RAC / AA are not much cope in some locations where tyre centres might be closed and then if open they have not a suitable tyre, and the AA / RAC temp wheel is no use to continue a trip / holiday.

 

UK & USA divided by one language.  Then All Season / All Weather is something else that means different things to different people in different places.

Cars with Summer tyres arrive in the UK to be driven in all seasons and can be crap in more than one.

http://talkcarswell.com/best-tires/run-flat/

 

 

 

 

Edited 4 January, 2021 by e-Roottoot