Hi All,

 

I have recently had my car remapped and and some other work done. I have a 2018 Vrs with 18k on the clock, owned it from new. 

 

I fitted an induction kit around 12 months ago and have just had a custom exhaust fitted, Hi flow cat and a stage 2 remap. The cars putting out about 320-330bhp (will validate on a rolling road soon). I've never had the clutch slip once and the car is basically not driveable. The clutch slip is so bad I can't get the power down. 

 

I'm massively shocked as the car has only done 18k and I never had clutch slip at all before the remap. I am unsure at this stage where the clutch just can't handle the torque or if something suspect happened when they garage had my car. They took it out for a test drive and advised me they had to detune it because of the excessive clutch slip. I am unsure as to whether the clutch got damaged during the test drive or if I'm just unlucky and the clutch has worn out. I will look to get an uprated clutch, but just want to understand if this is normal and whether I have a leg to stand on. Believe it or not, I don't push the car that hard and never had issues with the clutch prior to this. 

 

Any advice is much appreciated. 

 

P.s. any recommendations for clutches is appreciated. 

 

The standard clutches are not good. I had a new clutch on my 30k Octavia VRS TSI 230 back in November. Its not usual. The engines are great, the clutches are weak.

 

There are plenty of aftermarket clutch kits out there. Lets hope you haven't damaged the Dual Mass Flywheel in the process. 

 

 

2 minutes ago, varaderoguy said:

The standard clutches are not good. I had a new clutch on my 30k Octavia VRS TSI 230 back in November. Its not usual. The engines are great, the clutches are weak.

 

There are plenty of aftermarket clutch kits out there. Lets hope you haven't damaged the Dual Mass Flywheel in the process. 

 

 

Thanks for the quick response. Well that's interesting to know, It might be normal. Out of interest, is it the exact same clutch at the Mk7 GTI? 

A quick google shows that SACHS race clutch would be what you are looking for.

https://www.sachsperformance.com/en/clutch-kit/performance-clutch-sachs/performance-clutch-kit-001422-999505b

2 minutes ago, varaderoguy said:

A quick google shows that SACHS race clutch would be what you are looking for.

https://www.sachsperformance.com/en/clutch-kit/performance-clutch-sachs/performance-clutch-kit-001422-999505b

What's the symptoms of a damaged mass fly wheel? Im pretty sure it's ok. But I haven't drive the car much at all since the work was only done yesterday and I've avoided driving it since the clutch slip is dreadful. It feels smooth at low rpm, but do you recommend avoiding driving it until a new clutch is fitted?

I would recognise a failing DMF as metal clanking from the gearbox area. There is a nice article here.

https://www.phoenixfriction.com/t-symptoms-of-dual-mass-flywheel-failure.aspx

If your car is your daily driver, then you should be okay. Drive really gently. Nurse it through. If this was my car, personally I would put in a new DMF and Clutch at the same time. I would budget about 1200ukp or 1400euros for this work. A performance clutch and flywheel will at least get you the ability to get the power down. If I was also being super cautious then a gearbox oil change would be beneficial. I am assuming a manual gearbox here.

 

https://www.sachsperformance.com/en/clutch-kit/performance-clutch-sachs/clutch-with-flywheel-883089000126

 

As an aside, what is the feel of the clutch pedal. If its soft, you also need a new slave cylinder for the clutch. They can fail.... another weak area. A clutch replacement with Skoda would also include a slave cylinder.

Edited 6 March, 20215 yr by varaderoguy
updated

1 minute ago, varaderoguy said:

As an aside, what is the feel of the clutch pedal. If its soft, you also need a new slave cylinder for the clutch. They can fail.... another weak area.

 

It feels ok, doesn't feel much different then before in all fairness. But, I guess I'm going to have to get it all checked out at that point in time. I didn't expect to have to sort a new clutch at this point, so budget won't stretch to £1200, but have enough to get an uprated clutch + fitting, but I am just hoping it doesn't need a total overhaul. 

Good luck. I hope you get it sorted. My genuine OEM clutch and replacement slave cylinder cost 950ukp from my dealer in Edinburgh. You can get it cheaper at an independent VW specialist. I would also speak with Darkside Developments who are awesome. They can advise on better clutches for tuned Octavias.

There is a nice thread ongoing for upgrading VRS Clutches....

 

 

I had a similar issue a while back (well, much milder by the sounds of it) in a then recently purchased RS230 that the previous owner had remapped. Clutch was experiencing slip in high gears when boost peaked. Coming from a 170HP atmo GTi6 I had no worthwhile point of reference so didn't know it was tuned until Skoda told me so. Rather than suffer slippage I had the clutch upgraded to the Sachs 550Nm 'street' performance unit, and later got in contact with the original owner and confirmed 'stage 1', 256HP & 400Nm+ ATW.

 

The 550Nm Sachs unit will be the way to go. Is it daily driveable? Yes, and while the engagement is progressive it's still rather bitey (especially until it beds in a little). The pedal also becomes quite firm, particularly compared to the overly light stock system, so be prepared for that. In terms of stiffness it's quite similar to my old 306, so if you have the means you could try the clutch in one of those first (RHD models are known for a heavy clutch due to routing the cable past the exhaust manifold, which dries up the lubrication - French engineering at work).

Definitely need an upgraded clutch, the OEM one cannot handle the torque. I had a stage 1 done on mine and the supplier put a 'low-torque' version of the full 316bhp map on it. When I questioned this and asked for the full map they refused saying that even the full stage 1 will shred the clutch, and advised I fit an upgraded one. When I have the money that is what I'll do, and the rest of the map can be coded for just 30 mins labour from the supplier.

1 hour ago, TrinityJay said:

I had a similar issue a while back (well, much milder by the sounds of it) in a then recently purchased RS230 that the previous owner had remapped. Clutch was experiencing slip in high gears when boost peaked. Coming from a 170HP atmo GTi6 I had no worthwhile point of reference so didn't know it was tuned until Skoda told me so. Rather than suffer slippage I had the clutch upgraded to the Sachs 550Nm 'street' performance unit, and later got in contact with the original owner and confirmed 'stage 1', 256HP & 400Nm+ ATW.

 

The 550Nm Sachs unit will be the way to go. Is it daily driveable? Yes, and while the engagement is progressive it's still rather bitey (especially until it beds in a little). The pedal also becomes quite firm, particularly compared to the overly light stock system, so be prepared for that. In terms of stiffness it's quite similar to my old 306, so if you have the means you could try the clutch in one of those first (RHD models are known for a heavy clutch due to routing the cable past the exhaust manifold, which dries up the lubrication - French engineering at work).

Hi mate,

 

Thanks for this response, much appreciated. I will take a look at the clutch options. Do you recommend the full clutch kit or will the Sachs performance do the trick on its own? Or is it a full kit job regardless?

5 minutes ago, FluffyEyeball said:

Definitely need an upgraded clutch, the OEM one cannot handle the torque. I had a stage 1 done on mine and the supplier put a 'low-torque' version of the full 316bhp map on it. When I questioned this and asked for the full map they refused saying that even the full stage 1 will shred the clutch, and advised I fit an upgraded one. When I have the money that is what I'll do, and the rest of the map can be coded for just 30 mins labour from the supplier.

 

Well sounds like it's just the way it is. The car is putting out so much power with the hiflow cat as well that it doesn't surprise me that it can't cope. I was just shocked as I've heard that the clutches are meant to be good for up to 350bhp. 

2 minutes ago, NoGGy said:

 

Well sounds like it's just the way it is. The car is putting out so much power with the hiflow cat as well that it doesn't surprise me that it can't cope. I was just shocked as I've heard that the clutches are meant to be good for up to 350bhp. 

I know that's what I thought too, but alas no. I do have some slippage downshifting if I'm not careful, and I also have flywheel rattle on engaging the clutch, however its done 82000miles now ! My next one will be a DSG because its lovely and I don't have to worry about the clutch 

28 minutes ago, FluffyEyeball said:

My next one will be a DSG because its lovely and I don't have to worry about the clutch 

Sadly, not 100% true with the DSG wearing less. A DSG gearbox will still wear its clutch if abused although it will be a DQ381 box which is designed to go up to a 3litre TDI engine and about 280bhp, so it will be a lot more resilient.

18 hours ago, NoGGy said:

Hi All,

 

I have recently had my car remapped and and some other work done. I have a 2018 Vrs with 18k on the clock, owned it from new. 

 

I fitted an induction kit around 12 months ago and have just had a custom exhaust fitted, Hi flow cat and a stage 2 remap. The cars putting out about 320-330bhp (will validate on a rolling road soon). I've never had the clutch slip once and the car is basically not driveable. The clutch slip is so bad I can't get the power down. 

 

I'm massively shocked as the car has only done 18k and I never had clutch slip at all before the remap. I am unsure at this stage where the clutch just can't handle the torque or if something suspect happened when they garage had my car. They took it out for a test drive and advised me they had to detune it because of the excessive clutch slip. I am unsure as to whether the clutch got damaged during the test drive or if I'm just unlucky and the clutch has worn out. I will look to get an uprated clutch, but just want to understand if this is normal and whether I have a leg to stand on. Believe it or not, I don't push the car that hard and never had issues with the clutch prior to this. 

 

Any advice is much appreciated. 

 

P.s. any recommendations for clutches is appreciated. 

 

From what I have read on this site, bad clutch slip at low mileage after remap is not a common problem. I had my car mapped last year at around 18k miles, 329bhp with 499nm of torque, and at 23k miles now, no clutch slip so far.  Read quite a few posts where clutches were no problem, but then there were a small few where they were slipping afterwards. Maybe it's just a matter of luck.

3 hours ago, roaddetective said:

From what I have read on this site, bad clutch slip at low mileage after remap is not a common problem. I had my car mapped last year at around 18k miles, 329bhp with 499nm of torque, and at 23k miles now, no clutch slip so far.  Read quite a few posts where clutches were no problem, but then there were a small few where they were slipping afterwards. Maybe it's just a matter of luck.

Yeah appears to be, which is why I was surprised for the milage I have. I know the torque is crazy with the fact I have a hiflow CAT fitted as well. But when the boost comes in, it's just nuts. 

On 07/03/2021 at 20:55, NoGGy said:

Do you recommend the full clutch kit or will the Sachs performance do the trick on its own? Or is it a full kit job regardless?

 

Not sure what you mean sorry. You can get the 550Nm 'street' performance disc on its own, and the cover + pressure plate on its own, or buy them together as a kit. AFAIK Sachs also manufactured the factory clutch setup, so these components bolt in without any other changes required. Replacing the flywheel is optional, but I had a new DMF (also Sachs) fitted as the original was worn. Also had the slave cylinder replaced.

On 07/03/2021 at 16:14, roaddetective said:

From what I have read on this site, bad clutch slip at low mileage after remap is not a common problem. I had my car mapped last year at around 18k miles, 329bhp with 499nm of torque, and at 23k miles now, no clutch slip so far.  Read quite a few posts where clutches were no problem, but then there were a small few where they were slipping afterwards. Maybe it's just a matter of luck.

I agree. My VRS 220 Stage 1 Shark remap was very smooth and torque was 480Nm/354 lb. I had no clutch slip at all.  Even after burning the plates by accidentally not fully disengaging my foot from the pedal, whilst driving up a hill in 6th gear. I wondered why the rev counter needle was in the red but wasn't anywhere near max speed! It would easily spin the tyres on dry road even at reasonable speeds. Some of thus 'good luck'  may be due to driving style, as you'd never get all the power down off the line by dumping the clutch. I found the extra grunt  took me past moving traffic safely. The few times I really engaged '  traffic light mode'  it was much easier to get it rolling then floor it. It never failed me. 

2 minutes ago, Redboy said:

I agree. My VRS 220 Stage 1 Shark remap was very smooth and torque was 480Nm/354 lb. I had no clutch slip at all.  Even after burning the plates by accidentally not fully disengaging my foot from the pedal, whilst driving up a hill in 6th gear. I wondered why the rev counter needle was in the red but wasn't anywhere near max speed! It would easily spin the tyres on dry road even at reasonable speeds. Some of thus 'good luck'  may be due to driving style, as you'd never get all the power down off the line by dumping the clutch. I found the extra grunt  took me past moving traffic safely. The few times I really engaged '  traffic light mode'  it was much easier to get it rolling then floor it. It never failed me. 

I totally agree that some of the "good luck" is down to driving style. Myself being a qualified driving instructor who now trains full licence holders only in advanced/defensive driving, my style should allow clutches an easy long life. Not perfect though, as demonstrated last week off the lights on a dual carriageway. I just had to show up a fast Audi getting up to speed. Would have passed him too if he had not dangerously pulled out in my face into the right hand lane, when he noticed late, slower cars in front of him. Look further ahead Audi man and plan your drive better. Yes, I do still like the odd moments of fun, even at my age!  

Hi all,

 

Thanks for all the responses. A garage have quoted me two options, but I am not sure if the clutches are uprated but I believe they should be fine for the bhp/torque. 

 

They have suggested Luk Clutch kit and flywheel £1133.75 plus fitting and VAT or 

 

Sach Clutch and flywheel supplied and fitted and VAT for £1058. 

 

Both include 2 years parts and labour. 

 

Does anyone have a view on which is better. I understand Sach tend to be the most recommended. 

8 hours ago, NoGGy said:

but I am not sure if the clutches are uprated

 

Find out before agreeing to anything. As I mentioned before unless I'm mistaken the factory setup is Sachs, so when they say they'll fit a Sachs clutch it could easily be a stock like-for-like swap which your car will obviously mince in short order.

18 hours ago, NoGGy said:

Sach Clutch and flywheel supplied and fitted and VAT for £1058. 

 

Both include 2 years parts and labour. 

I would go for the Sach's kit; but you need to decide WHICH Sach's kit to go for.  Recommend that you need to probably go for the Performance Clutch Pack and lighten flywheel kit - which supports 530nM of powered effort against it (just shy of 300bhp at 4000rpm).

https://www.sachsperformance.com/en/clutch-kit/performance-clutch-sachs/clutch-with-flywheel-883089000126