2 hours ago, Rooted said:

@Graham ButcherI have over 65,000 miles of EV charging.  I know pretty much where there will be problems.

I could often just pay a FULL PRICE TARIFF and get a charge,  But then that is crazy prices.    I am not a Business User with Tax Benefits and claiming back VAT.

 

Edinburgh City & the Airport is ridiculous as a Capital City for Visitors / Tourists and anyone really needing rapid charging. 

Charge Place Scotland is ridiculous, hopeless, not fit for purpose.

 

Public Charging can be very expensive, or reasonable or Free.    Free causes issues with the greedy and ignorant.   The Scottish Government / Transport Scotland have Millions spent on the Infrastructure and are TOMMY.     Deaf, Dumb & Blind and probably the only Pin Ball they play is with their Salaries & Expenses.  

 

Too expensive.

 

 

When I watched this video, YouTube suggested this one as well 🤣

 

 

Problem is more to do with charging networks and their shoulder shrugging than actual EV reliability.

 

In my Electroverse map filter, BP Pulse and Geniepoint are permanently disabled because their chargers are well known for being unreliable. My preferred are Tesla, and as backup: Ionity, Instavolt, Osprey and MFG. Admittedly I don't use public charging as often, but whenever I do, at Tesla superchargers, I've never had to queue, never had problem with charging starting the on first try. Though I do take heed of Tesla's busy-times graph and try to go to them when historical demand is low.

 

Completely different experience in the Nissan Leaf, of course. Mainly due to smaller search radius and thus more likely need to use unreliable chargers.

 

But Taycan man should have similar search radius as my MY. I would have also expected Porsche branded chargers to have delivered rated speeds (Taycan are able to charge back to 80% in 23 min). He stayed at Porsche chargers for over 40min on both occasions.... why?

When correctly configured, Taycan do pre-heat the battery for ideal charging speeds.

https://www.taycanforum.com/forum/threads/pre-heat-battery.14655/post-221188

 

https://media.porsche.com/mediakit/taycan/en/porsche-taycan/das-laden

Quote

The charging time for five to 80 per cent SoC (state of charge) is 22.5 minutes in ideal conditions at an 800-volt charging station, with a maximum charging capacity (peak) of up to 270 kW.

 

So today checking out my charging options when i get to Edinburgh and for a few days travel & then charging for return.

To the Airport first to see if the Chargers are back on. Rapids 55 pence a kWh.

If not Hermiston Park & Ride.  5 Rapids same price.  CPS / Edinburgh City.

 

Called BP Pulse about my Subscription & the pathetic performance of BP Pulse using card or phone, if my card does not work at the new charger at a BP Station outside the Airport, road to New Bridge call them.  69 pence a kWh.

 

MGF @ BP filling station next to McD,s at Newbridge , 5 rapids, 79 pence a kWh.

Out to Broxburn Lidl, 65 pence a kWh.

Norton Hotel BP Pulse, 1 Rapid, 69 pence.

Straiton Park & Ride, 1 Rapid. CPS. 55 pence.

Ikea / Gridserve.  1 Rapid, 69 pence.

Retail Park Evyve, 1 Rapid, 75 pence.

Lidl Craigmiller, PodPoint 65 pence.        There are others around if i am away from where i usually go but Edinburgh makes taking a ICE vehicle more sensible, 

especially if you have a Blue Badge.  (Access & Parking, EV,s are no advantage.)

There is no suitable 7 kW chargers i want to use and wait but i will use a 11 kW charger while waiting on a Rapid if needs must.

 

The Mini Electric when showing 15% battery and 14 miles range takes in 28 kWh.

When showing 95% battery (90 miles) yesterday and topping up to 100% (98 miles) it was 4 kWh of a charge it took.

When i unplug and switch it on it will show 104 miles range. 

Heating down, Screen / AC off, 1 setting heated seat & away.  It will do 3.5 - 3.7 mile a kWh for 35 miles,

and get 3.1-3.3 miles a kWh once on the Motorway.

Edited 7 November, 20232 yr by Rooted

@Rootedwhat a performance, so much price variation, how far away are all these locations from each other, and far are they off your route to where you're going? 

Apart from Broxburn which takes me 10 minutes to get to and 10 minutes back they are all just a few hundred yards / 5 minutes off the routes i am on and places i am going to. 

I only need the choices because i have a small range car but i knew that when i went for it.

It means that i am going to have to pay more sometimes to get charged and on my way.    But i am not going travelling in what can be gridlock traffic like you get in Edinburgh searching out chargers, i would rather get on one and on my way.

 

The Airport Park & Ride chargers down for more than a week is a disgrace. 

 

Aberdeen is as bad if not worse & this is why MGF and others are having customers for expensive chargers.

They are on the routes, at filling stations, in and out and away.   Just splash the cash.   Double the cost of an ICE vehicle really.

 

PS

Between Edinburgh & Glasgow when cold weather i can now use Tesla non Tesla with the most recent opened up to us Supercharger.

Stuff BP Pulse and the Services East or West.

You do get half price Wild-Bean drinks with your card (Supposedly when charging.)  But i am not paying £2.00 a drink even if that is 1/2 price.

Edited 7 November, 20232 yr by Rooted

The Dundee supercharger is open to all cars:

https://www.tesla.com/en_gb/findus?v=2&bounds=57.453956473970266%2C-1.2804302617187457%2C55.45253173088413%2C-4.845493738281245&zoom=9&filters=supercharger%2Cparty%2Cself serve demo drive%2Cdestination charger&location=dundeesupercharger

 

As you know, also the one between Glasgow and Edinburgh:

https://www.tesla.com/en_gb/findus?v=2&bounds=56.83986656827093%2C-2.201845261718749%2C54.8053366407226%2C-5.7669087382812485&zoom=9&filters=supercharger%2Cparty%2Cself serve demo drive%2Cdestination charger&location=Eurocentralsupercharger

 

Doing your miles, if you frequent those locations, worth consider a membership and it'll bring the down cost to 36-38p/kWh. It's also rolling monthly membership, no contract.

i used that, & the Aviemore one, and i will use Euro Central next.

I only need them to get enough energy in to Free or cheaper chargers.  Over 50 pence a kWh is really not worth using to charge more than necessary.

Edited 7 November, 20232 yr by Rooted

News just coming in about Tesla being fined by Korean regulators about its false claims of range and also Reuters have discovered that a secret team was employed to deny customer complaints and service appointments over claims of underperformance on the projected range figures, and now it seems the US Dept of Justice is investigating this as well.

 

https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/tesla-batteries-range/

 

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2023/08/angry-tesla-customers-sue-firm-over-grossly-exaggerated-ev-range/

 

https://www.techtimes.com/articles/297874/20231023/tesla-now-under-investigation-doj-misleading-range-claims-evs.htm

 

 

 

What percentage of cars, in history of car economy/range claims can achieve its stated economy/range?

 

By law, car manufactures have to use WLTP range in Europe, EPA range in US.

 

 

This is more juicy read, UK customer successfully claimed against Tesla's FSD:

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/my-experience-taking-tesla-to-court-about-fsd.315086/

Is this the possible answer for long haul drivers in their EV cars?

 

How do Nio's battery swapping stations work? | Autocar

Edited 7 November, 20232 yr by Graham Butcher

1 hour ago, Rooted said:

i used that, & the Aviemore one, and i will use Euro Central next.

I only need them to get enough energy in to Free or cheaper chargers.  Over 50 pence a kWh is really not worth using to charge more than necessary.

@Rooted With your high miles, would a Tesla subscription be worth it to you? £12 a month but around 20p/kWh reduction in price. Interesting conundrum that affects those dependant on public charging, so wondered what your position would be.

Lovely day.  Got to airport with 25 miles range.  All rapids still down. 1 gent trying to phone CPS.  There are cones on chargers and no lights.  So directed him to Lidl.   Came out to try new BP Pulse at 

BP and M&S food.  Decided which way to use charger port. My bad.   Other bay was too close to a parked car. Card would not work.  Phone App would not work.  Paying full price started on credit card.   Got in car as can't hear my self think for traffic.  Got through to BP Pulse.  They will investigate card.  Had to go out to check charger ID.  But as it is he already did security on me and had ID number.   So he offered to remote start if I stopped the charger.  As on the phone I would have been messing about outside and not hearing him and stepping over cable.    So likely first and last BP Pulse use unless desperate.   Rest of charging will be at the other park and rides or at PodPoint.  Lovely day though before tomorrows torrential coming.  Smile be happy..     PS.  Resisting going into M&S Food.    Near fully charged.     PPS, re TESLA.  Only need it occasionally at Aviemore or will need Euro Central, but there are CPS chargers there when working or not hogged.  

Edited 7 November, 20232 yr by Rooted

20 kW £14.09 pence.   3.5 miles a kWh, 70 miles.    Nonesense.  But just discovered a free charger for tomorrow.  So that will bring it to ICE price.  

Much better today.  Free charge early today of 20 kWh, then 55 pence a kWh at Straiton Park and Ride which is huge and has just 1 rapid charger and one fast and that is 45 pence a kWh.  I took pics this morning as nice background.  Charge to 98 % and 3 miles down hill and at 100%.   I need to go up again though.   I will post pics later when on a computer.   Lovely autumn 🍁 colours around.  Temperatures not too low.     Edinburgh park and ride and all no power since to the storms. 

Edited 8 November, 20232 yr by Rooted

Edinburgh is just a joke.   Hermiston park and ride.  5 new rapids and 1 old one.  None would start on credit cards, or CPS phone app. Tried them all, no answer on CPS call centre.   Finally tried a Debit card and accepted and charging.   I should have just gone back to a 75 pence a kWh one and I would have been going 40 minutes ago.   Needed to be full as temp low and away to head into freezing.  Might need to just slow right down to get to where I am heading, or do a quick charge at a reliable charger.  Fiasco as usual around Edinburgh.  

Edited 8 November, 20232 yr by Rooted

51 minutes ago, Rooted said:

Edinburgh is just a joke.   Hermiston park and ride.  5 new rapids and 1 old one.  None would start on credit cards, or CPS phone app. Tried them all, no answer on CPS call centre.   Finally tried a Debit card and accepted and charging.   I should have just gone back to a 75 pence a kWh one and I would have been going 40 minutes ago.   Needed to be full as temp low and away to head into freezing.  Might need to just slow right down to get to where I am heading, or do a quick charge at a reliable charger.  Fiasco as usual around Edinburgh.  

Isn't this pretty much what Taycan man has been reporting on and off that many chargers will not work using credit cards or even apps at some locations that he visits?

Well the motorway was closed with 5 miles notice and that was a diversion to a road I have not used for 10 years and it had road works and traffic lights and no traffic coming towards me.   Then Tay Bridge road works.  All in it was shorter, had plenty miles available and the temp went to minus 1.        No idea why the van would park up at  charger but there are loads of 7kW ones anyway.  That is not my MINI.  & It is not in a bay with a charger.  One of them decided to park close though.    I have an early start and car plugged in and charging and that will clear the ice in the morning. 

Edited 9 November, 20232 yr by Rooted

The transits electric isn't it? Seem to remember the range is really low on them. I've had a few DPD notifications saying that my delivery is on its way in an electric van..... The depots about 50 miles away if you don't go anywhere else on the way, strangely always shows up in a diesel. 

Yes they are electric. They are all over the place and sit charging or like that one not charging @ Fast chargers.  The other one there was charging.

They were even sitting an hour or 2 at Edinburgh Airport Park & ride on Rapid Chargers when there was a 30 minute max charging time and a £30 penalty for charging over 30 minutes. Doing it even when other chargers were faulty and drivers were unable to get their 30 minutes of a charge.

 

The same happened in Edinburgh with MITiE who got Council Contracts & were required to run Electric Vans.

To start with that happened because the drivers / trades people had no idea about the 30 minutes or pretended they did not, and they needed to charge anyway, 

from home coming into work and maybe during the day / lunch time or before being able to go home.

 

Loads of DPD vans charging around Dundee even where Public Chargers & in demand and really there is a divide for Council Tax or non Council Tax payers and Business / Company users getting VAT back and using Council Provided Chargers.

Not likely to change though, but some are taking the Pith as to hogging bays / chargers if not charging. 

 

Those sitting having their break and fully charged and not moving is a PITA, but often you can just ask nicely can you get a charge, always worked for me.

The vans left during a day or night and not charging and blocking getting to the charger or them locked in has nonody to stop them doing it so i just post them up on PlugShare / ZapMap.   After all i am there hanging about at times or having to check every now and again if u can get on the charger. 

 

When there are chargers for Disabled / Wheel chair users and they block them when they could choose any other fast chargers (Slow really) that is just ignorance.

 

https://heraldscotland.com/news/23906048.scotland-homes-perth-housing-transport-hub-approved

Perth is getting a Low Emissions Transport Hub so that should be for Commercial users and others, and what every Town / City will need and should already have.

 

 

 

Edited 9 November, 20232 yr by Rooted

The Transit electric van is said to have dependable range of 100 miles, rated range of 150+ miles.

https://www.parkers.co.uk/vans-pickups/ford/transit/2022-e-transit-review/

 

Might not be enough in rural area, but the range is more than enough in the city. All supermarket delivery, and most parcel delivery around here are now via electric vans.

 

 

 

 

 

Chargemaster HQ was in the same business park as my workplace, before being acquired by BP. Their 2 on-site rapid charger just cannot be relied upon, most of the time when I do lunchtime walk I see screen dead or EVs fully charged and hogging. They are more focused on getting grant money to expand than providing a reliable service. Perhaps it worked according to plan as it has been acquired by BP.

 

So might be worth striking BP off your list of chargers if you are in a hurry. I know you get free charging through them, but they just cannot be relied upon. Worth having a nearby Plan B, when BP are your plan A.

 

Speaking of my workplace, there is a 16 stall Tesla supercharger v4, open to all, recently completed construction up the road. Reliable chargers everywhere down south

Edited 9 November, 20232 yr by wyx087

I have just seen how many MFG Charge Hubs there are at filling stations or are under construction, waiting to go online or planned around Edinburgh. 

@ £0.79/kWh  though.  

 

50 kWh = £39.50,   50 x 3.5 miles 175 miles.

 

A diesel getting 30 mpg,  5.2 Gallons / 24 litres, @ 160 pence a litre = £38.40

Edited 9 November, 20232 yr by Rooted

4 minutes ago, Rooted said:

I have just seen how many MFG Charge Hubs there are at filling stations or are under construction, waiting to go online or planned around Edinburgh. 

@ £0.79/kWh  though.  

To make it really a viable option at those kind of prices you do need to be able to do most charging at home. 

I was pointing out for these Trades People & Couriers / Delivery drivers that have to drive EV,s because that is what they get / Rent from their employers and do not have HOME CHARGERS, 

or take a Van home.    Gig economy.  

 

What makes it viable is Grants & Loans & Tax Breaks for those running / leasing / buying fleets, and it is great for the Manufacturers who really do need 

to be building Hubs for the Commercials that their Franchises / Dealerships sell / lease.

They have the Dealerships / Land in the areas where people actually go for deliveries, depots etc.  

Commercial / Industrial Land, not for Residential Development in many instances.    Not all obviously.

 

Dealerships and their local are not using Electricity much when closed, or Off Peak and can easily have Solar or a Turbine and Battery Storage and a number of Places set aside for Public or their Leased vehicles with customers.

Many do have 7 / 11 kW chargers, but locked up out of hours or behind barriers for the businesses security obviously.

Now more have RAPID chargers for their own use.  Unused much of the time. 

Edited 9 November, 20232 yr by Rooted

1 hour ago, wyx087 said:

Speaking of my workplace, there is a 16 stall Tesla supercharger v4, open to all, recently completed construction up the road. Reliable chargers everywhere down south

I think this shows how the Chargeplace Scotland scheme has backfired a bit. Any CPO's map of chargers generally stops at Gretna, as there was no point trying to compete with free chargers in Scotland. Since most of these now charge, there is a business case to be made (see MFG's expansion) for privately provided charging in Scotland - but this has effectively put the commercial roll-out in Scotland a couple of years behind. Add in that many chargers Rooted uses are unreliable* and it makes an electric car less attractive in Scotland.

 

* I have to say my experience of CPS chargers has always been good, but I use them quite rarely and in different areas to  @Rooted

There is a case for the disbanding of Charge Place Scotland and the love in with Transport Scotland & the SNP and the Transport Ministers.

They are incompetent, SWARCO have a monopoly with the CPS Contract, owning e-Volt and having Maintenance Contracts.

 

@LuckypantsThere are plenty good chargers in many areas. Plenty roll up and use if not being abused by the greedy or ignorant because free or cheap.

But in Dundee that is a SWARCO love in with the HQ there and hubs they are involved with.

@ Stirling park and ride it is FES maintaining. Much better, just not enough Rapids. 

 

Edinburgh is ridiculous, as is Aberdeen & Aberdeenshire.  Perth sat on millions of EU money for years but now Broxden EV Hub is near ready next to the Tesla Supercharger.

 

Local Authority / Council employees, drivers of Local Authority EV,s are some of the worst offenders, even where that council have their chargers for their use there are employees taking out vehicles and a CPS card and have not a clue or care about others.

NHS, Social Work as well,  but locally plonkers with ROADS department vehicles hogging a Rapid for hours when the AC charger will do fine.

(Because they are local to me i know how or what they are or do.) 

 

Signage to EV Public Hubs (Public funded) is pathetic, usually it is follow the Park & Ride signs, then guess where to go if you have the right ones.

Non Park & Ride, maybe public car parks just crap, & the Apps accuracy as well even if you keep telling them & ask them to update.

 

..................

The Scottish Greens are useless but form part of the Scottish Government.   (Latest story on Lorna Slater MSP / Co Leader S.Greens and trees and the investors is a beaut. Oil & Gas money, banking and funding) http://theferret.scot/partner-government-climate-scheme-shares-big-oil

 

They help nothing with EV,s and charging, and at least could do something about Transport Scotland and those running that.

Not fit for purpose as are those they oversee. 

Edited 9 November, 20232 yr by Rooted