My caravan took my 2litre ford  diesel down from 60mpg to 34mpg but it had a 75litre tank so lancashire to Devon even just into Cornwall was possible.

I had  a diesel Seat leon that required fuel at Exeter

 

So it's the size of the Tank that matters. Evs will turn out the same. Smaller but bigger capacity batteries? Maybe!  But the  ability to charge in 30 minutes with caravan attached will be more useful if the range can be got to 150 miles towing. 2 and a half hours towing normally needs  a break anyway.

11 minutes ago, Stonekeeper said:

My caravan took my 2litre ford  diesel down from 60mpg to 34mpg but it had a 75litre tank so lancashire to Devon even just into Cornwall was possible.

I had  a diesel Seat leon that required fuel at Exeter

 

So it's the size of the Tank that matters. Evs will turn out the same. Smaller but bigger capacity batteries? Maybe!  But the  ability to charge in 30 minutes with caravan attached will be more useful if the range can be got to 150 miles towing. 2 and a half hours towing normally needs  a break anyway.

I used to be able to drive for longer than that without needing a break when towing. Are you a nervous driver in which case towing a caravan is not something I would recommend. A HGV driver of an articulated lorry can drive for 4 and a half hours before they must stop and take a 45 minute break, their rig is way bigger than a car and caravan unit.

 

They are not going to cover much ground if they need to take a break every 2 and a half hours are they?

 

My Rover had a 45litre fuel tank and drank like a fish, those 1960s cars were not very efficient, whereas my 2 litre Superb diesel (66 litre tank)  is and with just normal local trips with a couple of 30 mile runs a week will return around 550 to 600 miles and 800+ on decent long motorway trips. I no longer have the caravan and have never towed with the Superb.

6 hours ago, Graham Butcher said:

I used to be able to drive for longer than that without needing a break when towing. Are you a nervous driver in which case towing a caravan is not something I would recommend. A HGV driver of an articulated lorry can drive for 4 and a half hours before they must stop and take a 45 minute break, their rig is way bigger than a car and caravan unit.

 

 

Not understanding the HGV  context.

 

I know which pattern i would pick for safety.

 

I have been towing Caravans for over forty years.

 

I am on Holiday not at work.

 

I have a Dog (up to earlier this year it was two)

 

Someone in the car usually needs to Pee.

 

 

30 minutes ago, Stonekeeper said:

 

Not understanding the HGV  context.

 

I know which pattern i would pick for safety.

 

I have been towing Caravans for over forty years.

 

I am on Holiday not at work.

 

I have a Dog (up to earlier this year it was two)

 

Someone in the car usually needs to Pee.

 

 

True, but I was speaking as the driver, and I found comfort breaks were not needed for me personally and I was therefore able and willing to drive for longer times. I found that nervous drivers were concentrating so hard on their length that they needed regular relaxation breaks. I as a regular driver of 12 metre long coaches at slightly over 8ft wide found the extra length and width no problem. 

  

11 hours ago, Graham Butcher said:

Why does a diesel mean that you have to make extra stops for fuel

Because even when services built together with petrol station, you still have to spend 5+ minutes move the car to the petrol station and fuel up manually. 

 

You don't have to wait around for those 10-30 minutes rapid charging, just plug in. This is why number of plugs at service car park is more important than each rapid charger delivering maximum possible speed all the time. 

 

 

Last weekend, I was chatting to a family friend (wife's friend's husband) who drives all over Europe as sales manager in a Model 3 LR, away most weekdays. He picked up the car same time as my MY. At 2 years old he got 255 Wh/mi (or 3.9 mi/kWh) mostly on European motorway. It's at over 50k on the odometer now. He's very happy with the car and EV overall, wouldn't have anything else. I'm sure as someone doing so much miles for work, time is important for him....... 

 

My neighbour regularly drives to France to meet with supplier in a GV60, again, driving for work, I wonder if saving time is important for him and how can he make EV work for him....... 

12 hours ago, domhnall said:

This idea that you take 5 minutes is for the birds

I timed myself last week from the moment the wheels stopped moving to when they were turning again and it was 3 minutes 45 seconds for just over 60 litres.

I generally work it in so I fill up when I'm actually passing a station but when I don't it's never more than 2-3 minutes diversion at worst.

And using a fuel card I can fill up at any motorway services when out and about and pay a sensible price instead of the rip off standard prices meaning it's not necessary to divert far off route when on a longer journey either.

On my regular trips to Germany I never stop more than once on the way (or way back) and it's always less than 10 minutes to fill up and go to the toilet which is all that's needed - around 350 miles from Calais. It generally takes us between 4 and 4 1/2 hours depending on traffic and how hard I feel like pushing it.

A friend of mine in his Tesla did the exact same journey and took 8 hours. Anecdotally quite frequently when I've been with him at public chargers he often seems to have issues with getting anywhere near the advertised charging speed from the charger (30kw, 60kw from a 150kw seems to be fairly commonplace).

43 minutes ago, wyx087 said:

  

Because even when services built together with petrol station, you still have to spend 5+ minutes move the car to the petrol station and fuel up manually. 

 

You don't have to wait around for those 10-30 minutes rapid charging, just plug in. This is why number of plugs at service car park is more important than each rapid charger delivering maximum possible speed all the time. 

 

 

Last weekend, I was chatting to a family friend (wife's friend's husband) who drives all over Europe as sales manager in a Model 3 LR, away most weekdays. He picked up the car same time as my MY. At 2 years old he got 255 Wh/mi (or 3.9 mi/kWh) mostly on European motorway. It's at over 50k on the odometer now. He's very happy with the car and EV overall, wouldn't have anything else. I'm sure as someone doing so much miles for work, time is important for him....... 

 

My neighbour regularly drives to France to meet with supplier in a GV60, again, driving for work, I wonder if saving time is important for him and how can he make EV work for him....... 

It can sometimes take a few minutes plugging the car in and then doing the authorising of the payments in order to activate the charger, and maybe having to either queue for a charger, or even discover the one you have plugged onto is faulty and then you have do it all again at another charger. Also, not everyone feels the need for a comfort break every 2 hours, and once tank is full, it should be good for many miles than a full battery so does NOT need filling every time you take a comfort break, come on get real. 

25 minutes ago, Graham Butcher said:

Also, not everyone feels the need for a comfort break every 2 hours, and once tank is full, it should be good for many miles than a full battery

Exactly; based on my old Xantia TDi, I could do (pure range) Weymouth to Uig (Skye) without refuelling, and taking one "comfort/food break" at Tebay North.

Today in the last 120 miles mostly BMW EV,s into and out of Glasgow.    Lots of Merc,s.   2nd time getting 25 kW of a charge free.  There was a site yesterday that offered the same with Osprey but you can only have one promotion running at a time. So I will sign up later. 

Edited 1 October, 20241 yr by Ootohere

12 hours ago, Stonekeeper said:

My caravan took my 2litre ford  diesel down from 60mpg to 34mpg but it had a 75litre tank so lancashire to Devon even just into Cornwall was possible.

I had  a diesel Seat leon that required fuel at Exeter

 

So it's the size of the Tank that matters. Evs will turn out the same. Smaller but bigger capacity batteries? Maybe!  But the  ability to charge in 30 minutes with caravan attached will be more useful if the range can be got to 150 miles towing. 2 and a half hours towing normally needs  a break anyway.

stick a generator in the caravan and charge whilst driving ;o)

Today in the last 120 miles mostly BMW EV,s into and out of Glasgow.    2nd time getting 25 kW of a charge free.  There was a site yesterday that offered the same with Osprey but you can only have one promotion running at a time. So I will sign up later.     Plenty Enyaq about and from Motability, as with MG,s, and other EV,s.  Low or nil advance payments.   PS I do like a Polestar. 

Edited 1 October, 20241 yr by Ootohere

Plenty with caravans were charging free or cheap once where they were going while it was free and then running the caravan electrics from the car.  PITA where the greedy barstewards hogged chargers to do this while out and about during the day.    Some charging of the car to then use in the caravan is cheaper than the kWh tariff at sites. 

16 minutes ago, Ootohere said:

So I will sign up later

Can you share or give a clue on how to find these promotions? I've never heard of Osprey giving 25kWh free!

Eon next gave me the first 2 25 kW.  I will check who offered last night.  EVfree I think.    Edit. ZoomEV. 

Edited 1 October, 20241 yr by Ootohere

Thanks! I've checked out ZoomEV and it might be worth the subscription if I used public chargers more. My Google shows that Eon give a year's free sub to ZoomEV, so one to remember if I change suppliers. 

3 hours ago, Paws4Thot said:

Exactly; based on my old Xantia TDi, I could do (pure range) Weymouth to Uig (Skye) without refuelling, and taking one "comfort/food break" at Tebay North.

Yup, and that is almost 700 miles and roughly about 13 hours driving.

 

When I was looking around for another superb last year I had a look at an MK3 estate version that Scotsman living in Basildon was selling because he worked in London and could not afford the ULEZ charge everyday, claimed that when he went home to see his parents in Aberdeen, he would fill up in Basildon, thats 560 miles on a tank and still some left over in 9.5 hours. Now I have a MK3 myself I can see why, because I can see by adding up the range and often seeing figures of 860 - 870miles on 66 litre tank.

Edited 1 October, 20241 yr by Graham Butcher

5 hours ago, Graham Butcher said:

It can sometimes take a few minutes plugging the car in and then doing the authorising of the payments in order to activate the charger, and maybe having to either queue for a charger, or even discover the one you have plugged onto is faulty and then you have do it all again at another charger. Also, not everyone feels the need for a comfort break every 2 hours, and once tank is full, it should be good for many miles than a full battery so does NOT need filling every time you take a comfort break, come on get real. 

Get Electroverse RFID card and authorisation takes seconds.

Get a Tesla and use superchargers, starts charging within 2 seconds. Usually no queues either, or the car re-routes to other less busy charger automatically during a long drive.

It is my real world experience from 2023 onwards that EV's really don't need to take minutes to plug in or doing payment authorisation.

 

Come on, get real and stop spreading second-hand charging experiences from people who've never driven EV or trying to paint a different light.

 

Find someone who have never visited petrol station and see how long they need to refuel. I remember fuelling up at Tesco and hearing cashier come on loud speaker telling someone to "press the yellow button" (or similar). Just because you are familiar with fuelling up but unfamiliar with charging doesn't mean it will always be like this.

 

33 minutes ago, wyx087 said:

Get Electroverse RFID card and authorisation takes seconds.

Get a Tesla and use superchargers, starts charging within 2 seconds. Usually no queues either, or the car re-routes to other less busy charger automatically during a long drive.

It is my real world experience from 2023 onwards that EV's really don't need to take minutes to plug in or doing payment authorisation.

 

Come on, get real and stop spreading second-hand charging experiences from people who've never driven EV or trying to paint a different light.

 

Find someone who have never visited petrol station and see how long they need to refuel. I remember fuelling up at Tesco and hearing cashier come on loud speaker telling someone to "press the yellow button" (or similar). Just because you are familiar with fuelling up but unfamiliar with charging doesn't mean it will always be like this.

 

It shouldn't require anyone to buy a certain type of car in order to what you claim is trouble free charging, and neither should you have to join a group or club and pay subscriptions to get a RFID card to improve your charging experience. It is not a requirement to get the best refuelling experience with an ICE car, simply pull up, select the grade of fuel, insert the nozzle in the filler cap and squeeze the trigger, the price difference is going to be a penny or two per litre different, not 20 to 30p a kW as some chargers are. 

 

And also my original comments was to a person who is a YouTuber who is pro-EV and yet he claims to own and use a diesel car and as @Ootohere mentioned the other day that most people with an E, used to have an ICE car. So why did this particular person come out with the quite frankly nonsense comments about the time it takes to refuel an ICE car and also about the time it took to find a filling station on his journey. All we ever hear from you EV drivers is how you need to prepare your route in order find chargers when you need them, and also to charge before setting off, yet this person it seems did not apply the same logic before setting off on a long trip, and that logic is refuel before setting off. That refuelling session is more than likely enough to get you to your destination and back again without any further refuelling. This has been demonstrated by myself and also others such as @Paws4Thot, @Dieselgate have also indicated similar.

 

As to the silly comment about the cashier telling the person over the PA system to press the yellow button, is as far I'm concerned and dare say any other person with a conventional car, what that tells me, is that it was one of those pumps that give the option of paying at the pump or paying in the kiosk via the cashier and that was something new to the user. Quite possibly the user lives in a more rural area where they don't have that type of system, which is the precursor to going full on self serve in the fullness of time, the same as most if not all of Asda forecourts have already done so.

 

So yes, I have got real, it is you who is not being real.

Edited 1 October, 20241 yr by Graham Butcher

17 minutes ago, Graham Butcher said:

As to the silly comment about the cashier telling the person over the PA system to press the yellow button, is as far I'm concerned and dare say any other person with a conventional car, what that tells me, is that it was one of those pumps that give the option of paying at the pump or paying in the kiosk via the cashier and that was something new to the user.

I can't comment, except that I used to live on Benbecula, where both filling stations had pay "at pump" facilities,  which were well used and appreciated by the locals.

6 minutes ago, Paws4Thot said:

I can't comment, except that I used to live on Benbecula, where both filling stations had pay "at pump" facilities,  which were well used and appreciated by the locals.

I was not using your name to back up that statement, only the one about only needing to fill the car once for most journeys, the bit I wrote in bold in the sentence above that paragraph,

 

Those are now common place at supermarket forecourts, with I suspect the ultimate aim of removing the cashiers altogether, in the same fashion as they are removing checkout operators and installing more and more self-service tills. These tills I don't use on principle as it means that someone is losing their job and can probably not afford to be out of work. 

Edited 1 October, 20241 yr by Graham Butcher

Not really common but I have come across filling stations with no kiosk (i.e. pay at pump only).

I wouldn't be surprised if we end up with manned EV charging stations going forward to try and deter cable theft which appears to be quite an issue at the moment, particularly in the Midlands.

6 minutes ago, Dieselgate said:

Not really common but I have come across filling stations with no kiosk (i.e. pay at pump only).

I wouldn't be surprised if we end up with manned EV charging stations going forward to try and deter cable theft which appears to be quite an issue at the moment, particularly in the Midlands.

Cable theft I have mentioned before and so have the YouTubers but others have completely ignored or denied that, strange.

18 minutes ago, Graham Butcher said:

I was not using your name to back up that statement

Not an issue; I was making a statement that rural areas can and do adapt to pay at pump as support for you.

Who on this forum has denied the theft of cable?

 

Not responding to your comments (or anybodies) is not strange.

Things are changing.  Time takes time.  

 

Filling up vehicles was not as simple as being made out just 30 years ago in many areas / countries of the UK.

There used to be garages / filling stations with OPENING HOURS.  There were places without SUPERMARKET FILLING STATIONS.

Supermarket Filling stations without Out of Hours pay at pumps, there still are.

 

There were the Likes of Green Shield Stamps back decades ago.

I used Tesco Rewards, i used ASDA CRedit Card to get 2 pence a litre off, and used ASDA,s with LPG where i bought twice as many litres of LPG compared to if running petrol and ther LPG was 1/2 the price, 50 pence a litre compared to £1 for unleaded & then the 2 pence a litre off.

 

LPG was widely available in Scotland and cheaper than south of the border in England. 

 

My dad used to pay a Monthly amount and he ran his Diesels which he had for going caravanning using Bunkered Fuel. 

 

The UK is not all about Cities, or England and what is common there, but there is rural mainland England as Scotland, Wales or Northern Ireland and also Islands.