I said 'unconfirmed' because as of this minute I'm unable to quote reliable sources of this being the case. However, I have heard about it from many sources, and so I have adopted the stance that there's no smoke without fire. There is so many other bad events happening right now that are grabbing the mainstream media's attention. Also, to quote it right now might still be against the official narrative.

Like the PPM and the LEZ's, it was mentioned first of all by the unofficial media, which we all now know to be true, and yet at the time, many dismissed them as conspiracy theories.

4 hours ago, Graham Butcher said:

If this is correct, I suspect that the real reason behind it is that climate change and the tailpipe emissions have been proven not to be linked after all.

I see you’re still not accepting of the reality of climate change… you need to read and accept the cookies from a few more sources so your algorithms stop pipelining your viewing recommendations. ( just a friendly suggestion)

IF the EU policy is changed, then it won’t be because of your reason. It will be because of the reality that no country has the grid capacity or generation capacity in place or possibly in place to supply the electricity needed for majority EV private vehicles to be on the road by 2030, and continuing with the push to that deadline wasn’t feasible.

For it to become possible, we all need to accept that nuclear power is clean and safe. And there are modular designs that use much less fuel and produce a lot less waste than the stuff everyone thinks of from the 50’s/60’s (which were only pushed as the main design because it produced byproducts suitable for weapons…)

Renewable does need investment too, but it can’t cover everything unfortunately.

Fusion in my lifetime would be the ultimate game changer…

38 minutes ago, mac11irl said:

I see you’re still not accepting of the reality of climate change… you need to read and accept the cookies from a few more sources so your algorithms stop pipelining your viewing recommendations. ( just a friendly suggestion)

Erm. Just where did I say or suggest that I don't accept that climate change is real? I said that maybe the linkage to tailpipe emissions might not be correct after all.

Is everybody else in denial that there has been ongoing climate change throughout Earth's 4.5 billion years of history?

I blame the dinosaurs

19 hours ago, Graham Butcher said:

rm. Just where did I say or suggest that I don't accept that climate change is real? I said that maybe the linkage to tailpipe emissions might not be correct after all.

You have made several repeated comments that have led me to the belief you don’t accept climate change as being real, nor that the consequences are real. And facts are facts - vehicle emissions are a major part of the global co2 issue, so you comment about tailpipe emissions very much ties to that same view 🤷🏻‍♂️

22 hours ago, Graham Butcher said:

I said that maybe the linkage to tailpipe emissions might not be correct after all.

According to this road transport accounts for 15% of global CO2 emissions, so while it's significant it's not the major source.

@mac11irl the planet has a long history of climate changes; there is no denying that fact, but at the same time, if man goes round destroying all the natural CO2 sinks, such as rainforests, etc, which consume vast quantities of C02 and in return give us clean oxygen, then climate change will be accelerated. The recent COP conference decimated loads of forest real estate and for what? Nothing came out from the meeting and vast amounts of CO2 was dumped into the atmosphere needlessly.

58 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

According to this road transport accounts for 15% of global CO2 emissions, so while it's significant it's not the major source.

Reading the report, it does rather look like the amount that road transport contributes has been significantly increased by the deregulation of buses, for instance. Since then, car ownership has increased massively, and anyone living in the rural areas now rely massively on their cars to survive.

The very important to VAG ID Polo (not being called ID2).

Smaller option battery car only get 37 kwh battery. Bigger one gets same as R5 52 kwh.

Slightly bigger than R5, bigger battery version has some quite pokey versions.

Conservative styling, no bad thing probably, but what will be the prices and will it get the £3,750 UK grant ?

Taken them long enough. Looking forward to their amazing low purchase price small BEV,s they have trailed for quite a few years now. PS. Thomas nice as he is needs to walk back from the car a bit and see the 'Barely visible indicators' at the rear of the car. Quite common on vehicles now.

Edited 16 December, 202516 Dec by Evolution13

10 minutes ago, Evolution13 said:

Thomas nice as he is needs to walk back from the car a bit and see the 'Barely visible indicators' at the rear of the car. Quite common on vehicles now.

OT slightly but: Some of the worst examples of barely visible rear indicators are where the indicator is a iny amber dot surrounded by the brake and side lights, and yesterday I saw a car where the front indicator is in the same lens as the halogen DRL so all you see is a slight increase in the amber/orange light.

12 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

OT slightly but: Some of the worst examples of barely visible rear indicators are where the indicator is a iny amber dot surrounded by the brake and side lights, and yesterday I saw a car where the front indicator is in the same lens as the halogen DRL so all you see is a slight increase in the amber/orange light.

The R5 reversing light and fog light are incredibly small, I mean a cm or two !

23 minutes ago, lol-lol said:

The R5 reversing light and fog light are incredibly small, I mean a cm or two !

I've always been puzzled why the Type Approval regulations specify brightness of the indicators, but say nothing about their proximity to other (brighter?) lamps which make them more difficult to see? They've allowed form (design & aesthetics) to override function (visibility) IMHO.

WTF with EV drivers. All the gear and expecting Auto Lights to put their Side & Headlights on in Freezing fog. Or they are just that stupid as to not know what is on. I know the same applies to many ICE vehicle drivers, but i do wonder if EV drivers are worrying about losing some range by just turning the lights on. I do not mind the Red Tail Light the full rear of the car, but the ones full length front certainly let you know they are there, sometimes right up your jacksy.

Some people really should not be allowed in the driving seat of a car, AUTO lights are only really designed to prevent the numpties from driving at night with no lights on. That said, of course, the manufacturers then go and give them the option of switching them off completely which negates the point of giving them the AUTO function in the first place??

1 hour ago, Evolution13 said:

WTF with EV drivers. All the gear and expecting Auto Lights to put their Side & Headlights on in Freezing fog. Or they are just that stupid as to not know what is on. I know the same applies to many ICE vehicle drivers, but i do wonder if EV drivers are worrying about losing some range by just turning the lights on. I do not mind the Red Tail Light the full rear of the car, but the ones full length front certainly let you know they are there, sometimes right up your jacksy.

In Renaults, not sure about the Mini as only drive it occasionally, but it is almost impossible to not have headlights light on. I will try putting it is to sidelights only in night driving and report but generally I find the whole car very safety set and as they are using LEDs the power for lights, as with heated seats is absolutely tiny ie even the Evolution R5 has a battery around 150 MJ so drawing 10s of watts/ Joules/s is absolutely tiny. My Scenic has a 227 MJ battery, the big battery Scenic about 324 MJ battery.

Using the full cabin heating is energy intensive especially if you are toasting yourself at 22 C or more, even if you have a heat pump. I am quite happy to have the cabin temp set at the lowest temp possible and just to clear the glass, 16C absolutely fine but have the heated seat on. Fitted on the Scenic but an after market jobbie on my Evolution R5 takes about 20W, J/sec, when first switched on and then I back off to lowest setting where it is taking 10W and then switch off after 5 or 10 minutes.

My far the biggest issue in the cold is getting the battery up to temp and this is where Renault annoys me as I would like to be able to not only pre-condition the cabin but pre-condition the battery up to 15, 20 ,25C as I would get a lot more miles if I could do that. Think some cars can but cannot understand with cars like the Scenic, which will pre-condition the battery if one uses the inbuilt Google maps, set an in journey charging stop and it will prepare the battery, presumably to about 25C to take the quickest charge etc. Must be a reason but cannot fully fathom that.

Well I have joined the Road Tax paying fraternity again and the Free Ride us EV drivers have had has finally come to an end. The Vehicle Tax reminder fell on the front door mat with the customary other bad news bills. £195 demanded to use the car on British roads for the next 12 months.

Done my avoidance bit, re-taxed the car for nothing in early 2025 so extended this fateful day by a few months but could escape it no longer and its a fair cop. I can now raise my head high and complain about the dreadful state of the roads, the pot holes etc knowing I have the right to do so as I am paying my bit. The little R5 has to pay the £10 a year for the first year and my laddo's Mini the same but in Q3 and Q4 of next year they will also get whacked for the full normal cheapish sub Expensive car supplement £195 per annum. Good to see DVLA taking Am Ex and today was the first day of a new credit car period so will not get with the £195 after Jan pay day. Thought there would be a credit card handling fee added ie £2.50 or something but Am Ex amount just showing the £195 pending. Result.

Feels good to pay road taxes again and not to hang my head in shame as a free loader. As is written..

---

7. Therefore, render to all whatever is owed. Taxes, to whom taxes is due; revenue, to whom revenue is due; fear, to whom fear is due; honor, to whom honor is due.

8. You should owe nothing to anyone, except so as to love one another. For whoever loves his neighbor has fulfilled the law.

9. For example: You shall not commit adultery. You shall not kill. You shall not steal. You shall not speak false testimony. You shall not covet. And if there is any other commandment, it is summed up in this word: You shall love your neighbor as yourself.

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Romans Chapter - 13 - Catholic Public Domain Version - Ca...

Read Catholic Public Domain Version (CPDV) Bible - Romans Chapter - 13. CPDV is a new translation of the Latin Vulgate, made using the Challoner Douay Rheims version (DRB) as a guide. It is intended t

5 hours ago, lol-lol said:

Well I have joined the Road Tax paying fraternity again and the Free Ride us EV drivers have had has finally come to an end. The Vehicle Tax reminder fell on the front door mat with the customary other bad news bills. £195 demanded to use the car on British roads for the next 12 months.

Done my avoidance bit, re-taxed the car for nothing in early 2025 so extended this fateful day by a few months but could escape it no longer and its a fair cop. I can now raise my head high and complain about the dreadful state of the roads, the pot holes etc knowing I have the right to do so as I am paying my bit. The little R5 has to pay the £10 a year for the first year and my laddo's Mini the same but in Q3 and Q4 of next year they will also get whacked for the full normal cheapish sub Expensive car supplement £195 per annum. Good to see DVLA taking Am Ex and today was the first day of a new credit car period so will not get with the £195 after Jan pay day. Thought there would be a credit card handling fee added ie £2.50 or something but Am Ex amount just showing the £195 pending. Result.

Feels good to pay road taxes again and not to hang my head in shame as a free loader. As is written..

---

7. Therefore, render to all whatever is owed. Taxes, to whom taxes is due; revenue, to whom revenue is due; fear, to whom fear is due; honor, to whom honor is due.

8. You should owe nothing to anyone, except so as to love one another. For whoever loves his neighbor has fulfilled the law.

9. For example: You shall not commit adultery. You shall not kill. You shall not steal. You shall not speak false testimony. You shall not covet. And if there is any other commandment, it is summed up in this word: You shall love your neighbor as yourself.

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Romans Chapter - 13 - Catholic Public Domain Version - Ca...

Read Catholic Public Domain Version (CPDV) Bible - Romans Chapter - 13. CPDV is a new translation of the Latin Vulgate, made using the Challoner Douay Rheims version (DRB) as a guide. It is intended t

You won't be paying 'road tax', that went years ago. You will be paying VED 'vehicle excise duty' and this 'tax' does not go directly to the upkeep of the roads.

There is an announcement now from the European Commission on the watered down plans over the ban on selling petrol and diesel cars. It is not to be 100% 'Zero emission' vehicles only available. It is to be 90% sold from 2035. That could obviously change again if German Car makers keep on moaning and getting their own way. After all Germany dictates what happens in the EU. Time will tell what happens in the UK once the government think on.

If that were the case Hungary wouldn't be buying Russian oil or cosying up to Putin.

1 hour ago, Evolution13 said:

There is an announcement now from the European Commission on the watered down plans over the ban on selling petrol and diesel cars. It is not to be 100% 'Zero emission' vehicles only available. It is to be 90% sold from 2035. That could obviously change again if German Car makers keep on moaning and getting their own way. After all Germany dictates what happens in the EU. Time will tell what happens in the UK once the government think on.

If you can call watering down making legislation that Yes you can have a combustion engine BUT it has to produce less than 50 g C02 / per Km for 2030 and 0% in 2035 but seems like some exemptions for poorer EU countries. Either and outright ban or an near impossible target for ICE cars, van etc to meet has similar effects. I believe EVs will be so cheap by these dates that it is difficult to imagine why anyone would opt for an ICE cars considering the improvements in range and the massively dropping prices of EVs.

https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/eu-relent-combustion-engines-ban-after-auto-industry-pressure-2025-12-16/#:~:text=Reuters%20Plus-,EU%20drops%202035%20combustion%20engine%20ban%20as%20global%20EV%20shift,sought%20easing%20of%20the%20rules.

Under Tuesday's proposal, EU targets would shift to a 90% cut in CO2 emissions from 2021 levels, instead of current rules that all new cars and vans from 2035 have zero emissions.

@Lee Hungary & Slovakia get away with what they do because Germany use them for breaking sanctions of all kinds. Imports & exports of many goods and products at various times broken by Germany. VW Group building vehicles and components there & Hungary & Slovakia having plenty energy.

12 hours ago, lol-lol said:

I believe EVs will be so cheap by these dates that it is difficult to imagine why anyone would opt for an ICE cars considering the improvements in range and the massively dropping prices of EVs.

It's nit just about purchase price it's also about running costs, which if an owner cannot charge at home or work means public charging - so something needs to be done to make public charging universal throughout the whole UK (allowing the costs of installation to be offset against business taxes would be helpful), and also to control or limit the cost per kWh of public charging (cutting the VAT rate to 5% or even zero rating would be a good start).

So there is going to be cars built using greener steel & materials, energy etc, and smaller cars / EV,s that will mean credits for the manufacturers. More manipulation of the figures as happens now with partnering and buying credits from EV only manufacturers. Smoke and mirrors and kidology as usual for the EU manufacturers. A proper version of the WLTP would be a good start as far as showing how much energy the BEV,s will use to do journeys in European weather / seasons would be 'simply clever'.

2 hours ago, PetrolDave said:

It's nit just about purchase price it's also about running costs, which if an owner cannot charge at home or work means public charging - so something needs to be done to make public charging universal throughout the whole UK (allowing the costs of installation to be offset against business taxes would be helpful), and also to control or limit the cost per kWh of public charging (cutting the VAT rate to 5% or even zero rating would be a good start).

You are spot on, this thing alone creates a multilayered society. Could you imagine the reaction of everybody if the situation was reversed and it was the ICE owners who were able to fill up at home on fuel at rock-bottom prices?

Yes, I know that would be ridiculous, but here is the rub, ICE drivers have to go to a filling station to refuel. Do you suppose that there would be so many BEV cars on the roads today if they also had to go to a public charger to charge their cars and pay a similar price to that of fossil fuels?