The plug-in home solar system hits yet another problem, with the IET saying it is dangerous and electrical contractors are refusing to install it. The system has to be installed by qualified electrical contractors, leaving some customers who have already managed to purchase the kit complaining that they are unable to get anyone to actually install the system.

On 06/07/2026 at 20:29, Graham Butcher said:

The plug-in home solar system hits yet another problem, with the IET saying it is dangerous and electrical contractors are refusing to install it. The system has to be installed by qualified electrical contractors, leaving some customers who have already managed to purchase the kit complaining that they are unable to get anyone to actually install the system.

Plug in solar not directly linked to Electric vehicles thought it is possible to link solar, via battery, to charging electric cars as I and many others do this.

Perhaps we need a specific thread for plug in /balcony solar ? Feeding back in to the house ring main is an interesting practice and millions do it all over Europe and other continents.

Meanwhile, the VW Group, Skoda etc, has a big meeting today to decide jobs and production cuts which some would say is due to the weakness of its EV offerings over the last 5 years or so, compared to the Chinese, Koreans, Renault, TESLA etc.... Sad time for those of us who loved VAG cars. Particularly as the new ID2 /Polo platformed cars look much better than previous offerings......

11 minutes ago, lol-lol said:

Plug in solar not directly linked to Electric vehicles thought it is possible to link solar, via battery, to charging electric cars as I and many others do this.

Perhaps we need a specific thread for plug in /balcony solar ? Feeding back in to the house ring main is an interesting practice and millions do it all over Europe and other continents.

Meanwhile, the VW Group, Skoda etc, has a big meeting today to decide jobs and production cuts which some would say is due to the weakness of its EV offerings over the last 5 years or so, compared to the Chinese, Koreans, Renault, TESLA etc.... Sad time for those of us who loved VAG cars. Particularly as the new ID2 /Polo platformed cars look much better than previous offerings......

Sorry, but the fact millions, as you say, do it does not make it ethically right or safe. OK, so there is some sort of protection built in to cut the solar panels if they lose mains supply, so what if that fails to operate and someone were to extract the 13A plug top that is feeding the solar power to the house from the socket? That would leave the exposed pins of the solar installation still happily connected to 230V AC supply via the panels and inverter. What if one of your children or wife were then to touch that plug and get electrocuted? This is the reason why the industry is refusing to do the installs for their customers; they are the professionals and can see the real dangers the system poses to life.

It does not meet the criteria for public safety; it is what happens when things get rushed through development. and governments (who don't have any clue or experience) get involved chasing an idealistic dream. There are loads of things where the government gets it so wrong time and time again. You think they are your side? Think again; they aren't. They are simply attempting to implement what they are told to do by those where the real power resides, and all the time the UK is being bled dry, and all money flows out of the country into the banks of overseas companies and individuals, and it has been for decades.

As for the Chinese electric cars, they are not better at all, just better priced with corners being cut and overall poor quality. Have you ever looked at the MG electric car owners' forums, for example, and seen just how unhappy people are with their cars? The same goes for the others: Ommoda, Jeycoo, BYD, etc.

The other person's grass is always greener, except it really isn't.

On 09/07/2026 at 11:04, Graham Butcher said:

Sorry, but the fact millions, as you say, do it does not make it ethically right or safe. OK, so there is some sort of protection built in to cut the solar panels if they lose mains supply, so what if that fails to operate and someone were to extract the 13A plug top that is feeding the solar power to the house from the socket? That would leave the exposed pins of the solar installation still happily connected to 230V AC supply via the panels and inverter. What if one of your children or wife were then to touch that plug and get electrocuted? This is the reason why the industry is refusing to do the installs for their customers; they are the professionals and can see the real dangers the system poses to life.

It does not meet the criteria for public safety; it is what happens when things get rushed through development. and governments (who don't have any clue or experience) get involved chasing an idealistic dream. There are loads of things where the government gets it so wrong time and time again. You think they are your side? Think again; they aren't. They are simply attempting to implement what they are told to do by those where the real power resides, and all the time the UK is being bled dry, and all money flows out of the country into the banks of overseas companies and individuals, and it has been for decades.

As for the Chinese electric cars, they are not better at all, just better priced with corners being cut and overall poor quality. Have you ever looked at the MG electric car owners' forums, for example, and seen just how unhappy people are with their cars? The same goes for the others: Ommoda, Jeycoo, BYD, etc.

The other person's grass is always greener, except it really isn't.

More countries and US states joining in on plug in solar revolution. California to join Texas abd several other states, and Germany of course, to provide free supply of electricity to consumers.

As mentioned on can easily bypass the plug in route by getting a shoe box sized battery, Lithium Iron Phophate preferable, to taje the solar input and then use it to supply the power hungry fridge freezer.

One can do this as well as join the Time Of Use tariffs which can mean access to negative and very cheap electricity, like we are getting tomorrow for 5.5 hours, and we gave half such sessions each week for the last weeks to charge the EVs, doing the washing, heat the water for baths etc.

With Greg Jackson being part of government, for 3 years, and his no 1 UK company partnership with CATL, falling battery prices it is looking good for cheaper electricity to those willing to adopt these systems.

@lol-lol don't forget that there is a major difference between the USA and UK, voltage. Our 230V is far more likely to cause electrocution than the 110V of the USA is.

There is is another angle on this, insurance. It would not surprise me to see any claim be refused if it is clear that plug-in solar had been fitted, or any solar/storage system had not been installed by a qualified electrical engineer.

23 minutes ago, Graham Butcher said:

@lol-lol don't forget that there is a major difference between the USA and UK, voltage. Our 230V is far more likely to cause electrocution than the 110V of the USA is.

There is is another angle on this, insurance. It would not surprise me to see any claim be refused if it is clear that plug-in solar had been fitted, or any solar/storage system had not been installed by a qualified electrical engineer.

Possibly fewer electrocutions with 110V - but from memory, many more electrical fires due to significantly higher current in circuits.

49 minutes ago, Warrior193 said:

Possibly fewer electrocutions with 110V - but from memory, many more electrical fires due to significantly higher current in circuits.

US has 120v throughout the house usually and 240v in the basement and garage for heavier duty appliances.

Maybe Musk, as was Mr Tesla, DC Is more efficient than AC and as more and more generation is becoming DC then passing into AC and then back to DC is a huge waste of power.

31 minutes ago, lol-lol said:

US has 120v throughout the house usually and 240v in the basement and garage for heavier duty appliances.

Maybe Musk, as was Mr Tesla, DC Is more efficient than AC and as more and more generation is becoming DC then passing into AC and then back to DC is a huge waste of power.

DC is deadly; it is far worse than AC, which passes through the zero point each cycle/hertz, which does make it easier to disconnect yourself from the live power. DC does not and will make you grip the connection so that you cannot break it. This is part of the issue with electric vehicles, and you can see the high degree of danger with DC traction batteries with voltages sitting around 400V and most of the newer and performance models somewhere around 800V by watching the YT channel OGS & Mechanics and observing the PPE that they wear while working on them.

DC is also extremely difficult to control, requiring special equipment to switch circuits on and off, as breaking the connection can draw a pretty hefty arc and so the switchgear costs considerably more.

2 hours ago, Warrior193 said:

Possibly fewer electrocutions with 110V - but from memory, many more electrical fires due to significantly higher current in circuits.

I think it is not the result of the higher currents as much it's caused by bad connections giving rise to heating of the connections and subsequent fires. Maybe also due to incorrect sizing of the cables in some cases?

8 hours ago, Graham Butcher said:

I think it is not the result of the higher currents as much it's caused by bad connections giving rise to heating of the connections and subsequent fires. Maybe also due to incorrect sizing of the cables in some cases?

Ignoring the higher (60hz) frequency, achieving the same wattage at effectively 50% lower voltage requires a substantial increase in amperage - poor connections, understandable when you consider the type of connectors they use, significantly raises the risk.

Now, back to the main thrust of this topic, electric cars. I see people commenting on how good the Chinese electric cars are, knowing personally just how poor some Chinese products can be after spending most of my working life in the electrical industry (I had a few years lorry driving across the UK). I see no reason to change my suspicions that things are not quite what they seem to be.

I have seen content from independent motoring journalists and vloggers alike who refuse to attend Chinese car launches and other such events because they are not free to say what they want, regardless of if it is positive or negative; they are controlled events.

I like Johny Smith and the Late Brake Show, but he did one of these, and the video of it is here.

It has since been mentioned on both the JayEmm on Cars channel and also the Geoff Buys Cars channel; here Jay addresses the problem head-on and fully explains just why he flatly refuses to get involved in such events unless he is free to give his honest opinion about the cars. Geoff also refuses to take part in any such staged events as he wants to present his honest opinions.

Edited 12 July12 Jul by Graham Butcher

A while ago there was a discussion about how far your electric car could go beyond an indicated 0 mile range left, in order to get back home and take advantage of your low EV home tariff rather than top up at an expensive public charger. I didn't think that it was ever really worthwhile taking the risk because you can never be sure that something else is not going to happen and force a longer route on you. Well today EssexLive has posted up a planned diversion for drivers on the M11 travelling south between the A129 and the A414 when that 9.5-mile section of the M11 will be closed from 9pm to 5am on July 20 and 21st for resurfacing and a diversion will be put in place as follows:

Full diversion route:

• Drivers will leave the M11 at junction 8 via Birchanger Green Roundabout;

• At the roundabout, take the first exit onto Thremhall Avenue;

• At Priory Wood Roundabout, take the third exit and join the A120 eastbound;

• Continue on the A120 to Great Notley;

• At the interchange, follow the A131 over the A120;

• Continue southbound on the A131 towards Chelmsford;

• At junction 19 of the A12, join the A12 southbound;

• Continue to junction 15;

• At junction 15, follow the A414 Three Mile Hill towards Hastingwood Interchange;

• Rejoin the M11 at junction 7.

  This diversion is 50 miles long; this is why I seriously don't believe that it's worth penny-pinching in order to try and limp home and save a couple of quid on charge costs.
  
  Ok on this occasion there has been a heads-up posted, but this kind of event does indeed happen pretty frequently when there has been a bad vehicle fire and the Highways Agency deems the roads to be resurfaced urgently, so there would be no advanced warning.
  

How many EV chargers or hubs are near these routes / diversions? Get an unexpected 100 mile or more diversion in Scotland or maybe other parts of the UK because of road closures be it in adverse weather or just accidents and you really can be stuck, and be in areas without Radio / Mobile phone reception and poor GPS / Sat Nav or car screens / apps that are hopeless. People used to these types of regions may know what to expect, visitors / tourists can be really in a panic.

Edited 12 July12 Jul by Evolution13

1 hour ago, Evolution13 said:

How many EV chargers or hubs are near these routes / diversions? Get an unexpected 100 mile or more diversion in Scotland or maybe other parts of the UK because of road closures be it in adverse weather or just accidents and you really can be stuck, and be in areas without Radio / Mobile phone reception and poor GPS / Sat Nav or car screens / apps that are hopeless. People used to these types of regions may know what to expect, visitors / tourists can be really in a panic.

I honestly don't know how many or where they are, but then again, even knowing where they are could be cold comfort because, as we have already seen, you can never be 100% certain if the one you select is going to be functional even or if thieves have been and stolen the cables. If that happens, would you have enough left to make it to another location? Fuel hoses are of no commercial value to thieves, so to my mind it's just like you're playing Russian roulette but with added bullets in the magazine if you don't always try and keep about 100 miles of range in reserve all the time.

Oh hang on, there is a large Gridserve hub at Braintree, which is about 15 miles from the start of the diversion.

Edited 12 July12 Jul by Graham Butcher

Keeping 100 mile range in hand if the total range of the EV is only 110-150 or even 170 miles.

7 minutes ago, Evolution13 said:

Keeping 100 mile range in hand if the total range of the EV is only 110-150 or even 170 miles.

That's where the type of car you have may come into play to a larger extent. If you have something like a Leaf, basically a city car, and you take it on a longer run, then range anxiety is going to weigh massively on your mind as opposed to, say, something like a Tesla, I expect?

^^^ An old Leaf maybe.Not the current ones Like older smaller cars from Stellantis, MINI / BMW etc. Which there are many of.

1 hour ago, Graham Butcher said:

That's where the type of car you have may come into play to a larger extent. If you have something like a Leaf, basically a city car, and you take it on a longer run, then range anxiety is going to weigh massively on your mind as opposed to, say, something like a Tesla, I expect?

LEAF Mk 2 is / was a C segment car, unlike the Zoe which was B segment.

The two versions 39 and 60 kwh versions. I tried to order / buy the 60 kwh but it was in short supply, long order delay. 60 kwh version has / had a 240 mile WLTP range and a buffer of around 10 miles below 0%

Went for the 52 kwh Zoe and did not regret it despite it only being B segment size.

Zoe has done well over 400 miles in hyper miling exercise.

12 hours ago, lol-lol said:

Zoe has done well over 400 miles in hyper miling exercise.

Hardly a normal usage scenario ...

Now more common Adverts saying 500 miles and plus range. eg Volvo EX60. £56,860-£70,360. Lease deals currently around £720 a month. If 400 miles is achieved without even trying that is pretty damn good. 4 miles a kWh, 100 kWh @ 7 pence a kWh, £7.00 to go 400 miles.

11 minutes ago, Evolution13 said:

Now more common Adverts saying 500 miles and plus range. eg Volvo EX60. £56,860-£70,360. Lease deals currently around £720 a month. If 400 miles is achieved without even trying that is pretty damn good. 4 miles a kWh, 100 kWh @ 7 pence a kWh, £7.00 to go 400 miles.

As we saw in that Johnny Smith video, life in the slow lane: everyone else is overtaking and getting to their destinations quicker.

^^^ Not how i see newer BEV,s being driven thankfully. Reps have places to be and people to see.

59 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

Hardly a normal usage scenario ...

No but if needs must one can go from doing 4 or 5 miles per KWh to up to 10 miles per KWh, Bjorn Nyland has proved this time and time again.

Not suggest one becomes a total menace driving at 20 mph, which is more than the average speed in London most of the time, but dropping to 30 mph, going on to city streets, it is the limited speed of new mopeds sold from late 70s to about a decade ago, and some of our EVs can then get approaching 10 miles per KWh.

In my 5 years and near 100k miles driving an EV, compared to my circa 1M driving ICE cars, only once had to think oh now not got the range to get me home and get the cheap electricity and that was when the M5 junction 1, the Baggies junction, was at a standstill. Satnav said go round Brum ring road clockwise, some 30 miles further, get a charge somewhere, zap and dash, and get home about an hour later. But one doesn't do that, I diverted down the Black COuntry Express Way and cut thru the Black Country. Got home about quarter of an hour later with miles to spare, not sure if I used my 20 mile of so buffer below 0% or not.

According to AA only about 1.5% of EV call out are for out of traction power. Sadly we suffer irreparable tyre failures and the like, same as ICE cars, much more oft the running out of lecky.

Goodwood festival of Speed over for another year.

Fastest times up the hill this year. McMurray did not run again this year.

Lots of ICE cars making lots of noise but not going that quickly. Quickest cars may surprise.

(Spoiler, not ICE cars but what you possibly did not want to see, or hear)

1 hour ago, lol-lol said:

No but if needs must one can go from doing 4 or 5 miles per KWh to up to 10 miles per KWh, Bjorn Nyland has proved this time and time again.

Not suggest one becomes a total menace driving at 20 mph, which is more than the average speed in London most of the time, but dropping to 30 mph, going on to city streets, it is the limited speed of new mopeds sold from late 70s to about a decade ago, and some of our EVs can then get approaching 10 miles per KWh.

In my 5 years and near 100k miles driving an EV, compared to my circa 1M driving ICE cars, only once had to think oh now not got the range to get me home and get the cheap electricity and that was when the M5 junction 1, the Baggies junction, was at a standstill. Satnav said go round Brum ring road clockwise, some 30 miles further, get a charge somewhere, zap and dash, and get home about an hour later. But one doesn't do that, I diverted down the Black COuntry Express Way and cut thru the Black Country. Got home about quarter of an hour later with miles to spare, not sure if I used my 20 mile of so buffer below 0% or not.

According to AA only about 1.5% of EV call out are for out of traction power. Sadly we suffer irreparable tyre failures and the like, same as ICE cars, much more oft the running out of lecky.

Yes, that is much the same with ICE; if running really low in an emergency, that is what any sane person would do.

All that I was attempting to demonstrate was for those EV drivers who show and deploy that scrooge mode time and time again that it is perfectly possible to come unstuck when a sudden massive diversion is imposed upon them and then the vulnerability exposes itself, with possible chargers not working, as @Evolution13 has discovered and documented on many of his trips; some had not been working for some considerable time and were awaiting repairs or, of course, were at remote locations or in the middle of the night, so thieves might have struck and nicked the cable for the high-value copper, leaving such persons possibly stranded. Whereas a sensible precaution of doing a zap and dash earlier when they knew that would be cutting it fine would have been the wise move. That way, if such a diversion is forced on them, as it only takes a second for an accident to cause such an event, they would still be able to make it home with ease and then top up with cheap leccy. A sort of insurance policy on being able to complete one's journey and get back to their loved ones.

These problems tend not to normally affect ICE drivers, as the hosepipe has zero value to thieves so thats an issue that an ICE driver does not have to worry about