Rapid Spaceback Electric issue

[Rapidspaceback]

Hi to all,

 

I am really lost and am seeking your help.

 

I have happily been driving a Skoda Rapid Spaceback for a year now.   2016 Diesel 1.4 Manual. 

 

No issues before except sometime tough turning ignition key . However WD40 the key and it turned nicely and was fine. 

 

Was sick with Covid and car was parked up for 3 weeks and then it would not start. 

Had it jump started and was ok for a few days thinking battery drained and then one evening after work it would not start again.

Jump started again however this time got a new stop start battery fitted and a n/s head lamp bulb changed.

The car was running fine without any issues for 3 weeks.

On the third week I was turning the ignition and hear a clunk sound and no start,  On second attempt it was fine and no the issues for a few days. 

 

My wife does not usually drive this  as its not Auto and was probelry the third time she took it out .   Engine stopped when parked up (Start Stop) and would not start again.  She left the car and walked home.

 

When I got to the car ;

Key goes in ignition- no steering lock. 

Key turn 1  Everything comes on , radio, wipers , lights etc

Key turn 2   The dial RPM goes all to to the end and all the signs come on as normal   

However no engine start, no turning, no ticking. no clunck nothing.  DEAD

 

It would not jump start , would not push start, and the spare key makes no difference. (doors lock unlock as normal.)

 

it was recovered to a garage who suspected the starter motor.  Starter motor fine however has no power to it on IGNITION 2 key turn.

Relays ok and tested, fuses intact and not blown.  

Code reader hooked up no codes , no faults.  

 

It was then recovered to a auto electrician/mechanic. They told me seen this before and I recovered the car to them.

Started motor removed and tested fine

Battery fine

Fuses and relays checked 

Earthing ok, teminals

Keys checked 

wiring checked,

Diagnosis shows nothing

Still nothing and says the same thing as the first chap no power to starter motor 

 

The second garage are about to give up and i am totally lost.

 

Auto locksmiths say its the keys and want £300 but i dont know if this is the actual fault and wont know until £75 call out paid.

 

Is this issue something some one has come across or herd about  before ,  I am really lost and don't  know what to do, 

 

I have already paid £100 recovery and £100 to the first garage.

yet to see the bill for the second garage.   But now says he cant find the fault. 

 

I am thinking of getting it towed to Skoda as a last choice but cant make my mind up. 

 

I am truly lost and any advise will be appriciated.

 

 

 

 

[inspectorman]

Hard to see how a garage and another auto electrician aren't able to get to the bottom of this. If you have a good battery and starter motor - one new, one tested, then the relay output to the starter motor (terminal 87?) is simple to check. But both of them say the relays are fine.

 

The only clue I can see is your initial difficulty with your ignition key. This is driving a switch behind the lock components which tells the ECU what to energise. here, it might be that the final switch turn to energise the starter motor has failed. Cheap enough part to change.

[sparky2]

I would also check or change the ignition barrel/electrics as like inspectorman says there's a sensor inside that recognises the key chip and it should give a feed to the starter motor in the start position.

 

[J.R.]

Sensor is external to the ignition barrel, it does not recognise the key chip but sends the data to the instrument panel that does, or doesn't as the case may be.

 

Sensor does not give feed to starter motor, the start contact on the switch does via a relay.

 

If the problem were non recognition of the RF chip in the key the engine would crank, start and run for a second or so and then die.

 

I agree with Inspectorman and would hotwire the relay coil first to eliminate that & then using a multimeter check the start output from the ignition barrel.

[Rapidspaceback]

On 21/12/2022 at 14:44, inspectorman said:

Hard to see how a garage and another auto electrician aren't able to get to the bottom of this. If you have a good battery and starter motor - one new, one tested, then the relay output to the starter motor (terminal 87?) is simple to check. But both of them say the relays are fine.

 

The only clue I can see is your initial difficulty with your ignition key. This is driving a switch behind the lock components which tells the ECU what to energise. here, it might be that the final switch turn to energise the starter motor has failed. Cheap enough part to change.

 

can you please advise  where i would find this "terminal 87 "  .      

[inspectorman]

Relay terminal numbers follow a DIN standard (and have done since the 80s).  On the base of a 4 pin relay will be 86 and 85 (low current switch and earth) and high current supply 30, then 87 is the high current output to device (in this case the starter motor).  Your mechanics will know exactly what you're on about and it should be one of the first things to check with the symptoms you have. My money is still on the ignition switch.