This might be of use to anyone thinking about changing their moderately hopeless Dueler HP Sports to something better.

 

It goes without saying that the decision to fit all-seasons instead of the standard tyres - what to get, mainly - involved many, many hours of careful research, most of which was undertaken while sitting on the can.

 

Comfortable, to a point, and no distractions.

 

"What are you doing in there?"

 

"Looking at car parts. Just looking at car parts."

 

First thing was whether or not I should go from the stock 225/45 19s to the other 'Skoda approved' size for this car; 245/40 19s.

 

Benefits were mainly getting more rim protection as you can see on the pics, and a greater range of offerings than the measly choice of 225 alternatives, as well as the fact that on average the bigger section tyres were cheaper.

 

Potential downside was that most of the bigger ones were extra load 98s rather than the Dueler's 92 and the consequent implications for ride quality. Not that the Duelers were particularly noteworthy in this regard anyway, though they were somewhat better than the skinny 225/40s fitted to smaller-engined Karoqs with 19" wheels.

 

I didn't want to change wheels. I like these Sportline wheels. Yes, they are vulnerable to kerbing damage, and their size means having low-profile tyres, but I can live with that.

 

I bought the car because I liked the way it looked, wheels and all. If I'd bought something for purely practical reasons I wouldn't have bought this car at all. My heart ruled my head.

 

Slave to fashion?

 

Sure am.

 

The Turanza All Seasons I did choose in the end are in the bigger (alternative) size for this car.

 

Thoughts after a thirteen or fourteen hundred miles are as follows:

 

The ride is a tiny bit firmer, but it's barely noticeable.

 

Honest.

 

Part of the dead-legs late night research involved what pressures to use in the bigger-section tyres, the result of which is dropping the pressures by no more than a couple of psi all round, and that probably helps.

 

They aren't any noisier than the stock Duelers except on one short oddly-surfaced stretch of the M42 near Solihull, but since I don't go on the oddly-surfaced stretch of the M42 near Solihull very often it doesn't matter.

 

The wet-weather braking is better than the Duelers, and the dry-weather braking at least as good. I'd had a set of Vredestein Quatrac Pros (225/45 17) on an A3 2.0TFSI before this Karoq, and there was a noticeable drop-off in dry braking on that car with them fitted so I had a yardstick of sorts with which to measure these Turanzas, and they are much, much better.

 

It hasn't snowed (well, it did the other day but I couldn't be arsed to get the car out just to see how they were) so I can't say how they are in properly crap winter weather.

 

Other than that I have no regrets about having spent a not inconsiderable amount of money on four new tyres when there was quite a lot of life left in the Duelers. I was lucky that National Tyres had a special on these Turanzas at the time though, which dulled the pain somewhat.

 

So there you go. A proper no-reservations recommendation.

 

 

 

Edited 7 March, 20242 yr by Phutters

25 minutes ago, Phutters said:

It hasn't snowed (well, it did the other day but I couldn't be arsed to get the car out just to see how they were) ...

 

You should be banned from this forum for that!  🙂

 

Our 2020 Sportline came with the 19in Bridgestones and had to get shot of them within about 6 weeks as the ride was so uncomfortable, felt every pothole and bump in the road. Swapped them for Michelin CrossClimate2s, like chalk and cheese, an absolute revelation 

Comparative tyre tests agree that the new Bridgestone Turanza All Season 6s are better suited to English (ie southern UK) weather than the esteemed Michelin CrossClimate 2s which have sacrificed wet weather performance for snow performance. The new Continental AllSeason Contact 2s fall somewhat between these 2, but also aren't offered as 225/45 R19s yet. 

 

I'll probably be choosing these too by this autumn when my present Duelers should be down to 3mm. To be honest I've found them pretty good, with my only embarrassing moment coming last month when I was parked on sodden grass and found that an attempt to drive up a 5% slope left me with all 4 wheels spinning happily!

 

Chris 

There are some good deals on new tyres until the end of August so I've taken the plunge and am replacing the Duelers on my 2.0TSI Sportline. I've just done 20,000 miles in 3 3/4 years, and although the tread depth over most of the tyres is still 4.0 mm, the outside edges have worn away.

 

  

 

This could be due to potholes affecting the tracking, but it seems pretty similar across all 4 wheels, so I suspect it's down to me being too heavy footed when cornering. No doubt the free wheel alignment check I'll get with my new tyres will show whether the wheels need realigning, but I'm not sure I trust the tyre fitters to do it properly! 

 

I'm also a fan of all season tyres, and note that the Bridgestone Turanza 6 All Seasons and Continental AllSeasonContact 2s both come in 225/45 R19 sizes now (the standard factory size for my Sportline.) Both have rave reviews and are reckoned to be better than the old favourite Michelin CrossClimate 2s. Having studied the details for them both and compared prices, I've decided to buy the new Continentals. The Bridgestones seem to be slightly better in dry braking, but the Continentals are said to have a better tread depth when new - hence a longer life, and be quieter. They are also reported to have good rim protection. 

 

More updates when I've got them fitted.

 

Chris

1 hour ago, CJJE said:

 

 

the Continentals are said to have a better tread depth when new - hence a longer life, and be quieter. They are also reported to have good rim protection. 

 

More updates when I've got them fitted.

 

Chris

If your able to post a photo of the Continentals when fitted with a tape to show the rim protection to compare with the Turanza 6s it would be useful. Thanks.

3 hours ago, CJJE said:

The Bridgestones seem to be slightly better in dry braking, but the Continentals are said to have a better tread depth when new - hence a longer life

 

Buying the Contis is a good decision and I agree with all the points you make.  I'll just add that the point you make above is a case of cause and effect. That is, the deeper tread on the Contis when new is the cause of their poorer dry braking, as the deeper tread will squirm more under braking load than a shallower tread.  And for the same reason, if you frequently brake hard, they will probably wear no better than a tyre with a shallower initial depth.  These are the reasons why many new tyres are sent out into the world with slightly less tread depth than used to be the case.  On the plus side, when the Contis are part-worn, they may well overcome their dry braking disadvantage - which is more than slight: when new, they take nearly 4 metres further to stop from 60 mph than the best of the latest all-seasons.  But every tyre wins some and loses some. The Conti is a great choice at present.

Tyre manufacturers these days take advantage of the law and make the tread not as thick on the edges.

28 minutes ago, Blue8793841 said:

Tyre manufacturers these days take advantage of the law and make the tread not as thick on the edges.

 

The tread is less deep at the outer edge because steering response when cornering would be badly degraded otherwise.  I don't see what this has to do with taking advantage of any law.

21 hours ago, mumpsim said:

 

The tread is less deep at the outer edge because steering response when cornering would be badly degraded otherwise.  I don't see what this has to do with taking advantage of any law.

Explains why my Goodyear EfficientGrip have seemingly come to the end their life with a good  4mm on the main body of the tyres after just 30k - I’d normally expect 50k out of a set of good quality rubber…….

I’ll be looking for a tyre without the shallow edge tread in the next few weeks.

On 24/08/2024 at 21:00, thamestrader said:

If your able to post a photo of the Continentals when fitted with a tape to show the rim protection to compare with the Turanza 6s it would be useful. Thanks.

 

Holding a straight edge against the sidewalls leaves a clearance of a few millimetres to the diamond cut edges of my Vegas - so probably less protection than the Turanzas give. 

 

Still very new so can't comment yet on the grip, and as KwikFit had inflated them to 2.8 bar (now checked and reduced to 2.5 bar) I'll leave comments on their comfort for a while. But initially seem a bit quieter that the Duelers.

 

Chris 

On 24/08/2024 at 22:52, mumpsim said:

 

Buying the Contis is a good decision and I agree with all the points you make.  I'll just add that the point you make above is a case of cause and effect. That is, the deeper tread on the Contis when new is the cause of their poorer dry braking, as the deeper tread will squirm more under braking load than a shallower tread.  And for the same reason, if you frequently brake hard, they will probably wear no better than a tyre with a shallower initial depth.  These are the reasons why many new tyres are sent out into the world with slightly less tread depth than used to be the case.  On the plus side, when the Contis are part-worn, they may well overcome their dry braking disadvantage - which is more than slight: when new, they take nearly 4 metres further to stop from 60 mph than the best of the latest all-seasons.  But every tyre wins some and loses some. The Conti is a great choice at present.

Good points, and mine have certainly been delivered with the anticipated 8 mm of tread depth.

 

Chris

On 25/08/2024 at 23:59, Blue8793841 said:

Tyre manufacturers these days take advantage of the law and make the tread not as thick on the edges.

 

The law requires 1.6mm tread depth over the central 3/4 of the tyre, which to my mind is not good enough. But mine had certainly worn worn more on the outer edge than the inner. As I got a hefty discount on my new tyres I thought it better to change now rather than wait until the autumn.

 

Chris

1 hour ago, CJJE said:

 

The law requires 1.6mm tread depth over the central 3/4 of the tyre, which to my mind is not good enough.

 

That is indeed what the law requires.  But it isn't a case of tyre manufacturers taking advantage of the law to skimp on tread depth at the edges. It's the other way round: the law sensibly recognises that modern tyres would have much less safe handling during cornering if the tread were equally deep all the way to the edge, leaving a right-angle profile at the shoulder. The tyre is part of a mechanical system that has to take account of suspension camber, roll angles, and much else.

 

Tyre design and manufacturing is fiercely competitive. Manufacturers are of course mindful of cost, but certainly not to the point where saving a small amount on tread would make a tyre a much poorer performer and less safe than others in its price bracket.

 

As for 1.6mm, Michelin has been saying for several years now that their tyres will retain full performance all the way down to the legal limit and there is no need to change them at 3mm or 4mm as many recommend.  When it comes to aquaplaning resistance, that claim

takes some believing, but Michelin knows more about such things than any of us, and I for one would not assert they are wrong without some empirical evidence.

Edited 27 August, 20241 yr by mumpsim

3 hours ago, CJJE said:

 

Holding a straight edge against the sidewalls leaves a clearance of a few millimetres to the diamond cut edges of my Vegas - so probably less protection than the Turanzas give. 

 

Still very new so can't comment yet on the grip, and as KwikFit had inflated them to 2.8 bar (now checked and reduced to 2.5 bar) I'll leave comments on their comfort for a while. But initially seem a bit quieter that the Duelers.

 

Chris 

 

Mind you Phutters was advocating 245 wide tyres rather than the 225 standard tyres, so they would project more on 8J wheels!

 

Chris

4 hours ago, CJJE said:

 

The law requires 1.6mm tread depth over the central 3/4 of the tyre, which to my mind is not good enough. But mine had certainly worn worn more on the outer edge than the inner. As I got a hefty discount on my new tyres I thought it better to change now rather than wait until the autumn.

 

Chris

 

Given the uneven wear were they inflated correctly as that wear pattern points to under inflation 

1 hour ago, skomaz said:

 

Given the uneven wear were they inflated correctly as that wear pattern points to under inflation 

He said the tyres were more worn on the outer edge than the inner.  That points to too much toe-in, not under-inflation.

2 minutes ago, mumpsim said:

He said the tyres were more worn on the outer edge than the inner.  That points to too much toe-in, not under-inflation.

 

Ah...   I misread and thought they were worn on both inner and outer edges.

 

As you say wear on the outer edges suggests too much toe in but you'd have thought that would also manifest itself in a degree of instability and wandering at speed too

 

18 hours ago, mumpsim said:

He said the tyres were more worn on the outer edge than the inner.  That points to too much toe-in, not under-inflation.

The toe-in was measured as being correct by KwikFit -- if you believe their wheel alignment check! I had to tell them they were comparing my G03 car with a Karoq G01, and even then they did not comply with the Skoda Workshop directions of checking ride heights etc. However I still believe the wear on the outer edges is due to cornering a heavy vehicle too exuberantly

 

Chris