I totally agree that there should be paper printed (hardcopies) of the full Owner's Manual with the car from new but then many owners lose them or some men think there some law against them ever reading instructions. And the manuals would be as big and heavy (overweight) as VW cars because of all the bits that owners insist on having on new cars that they might only use once or twice or never at all, gotta keep up with the Jones too.

With computers interacting with other computers there so much that can go wrong including the physical side so you just have to keep on trying (or give up) or if you believe the glass is half full, and with a lovely drink, then you could try contacting VWŠkoda to see if they can sort things if it's their end, an enormous amount of lifeforce and patience might be required though.

Sorry I must be mixing you up I thought you used to work for a certain UK government security establishment. In 1996 onwards if you want to or able you could have perhaps been paid or earnt a lot of money as a consult for "legacy" systems as those that knew about them were got rid of and those newer to computers hadn't a clue about them. I had two lesson about computer programming at school in 1975 or 6 but the lesson were during the lunchbreak and at the time I was more interested in being with mates and getting a girlfriend. Day release a few years later a very small part of the course was learning about punch cards and paper tape. Other than watching someone use a keyboard and VDU with green or orange I never touched a PC(?) computer until around 1996.

Lots of working people don't earn a wage, some never have, but they have still been paid, often the more they're paid the less they do or did, wage or income often has little to do with real job or work value.

I wonder who I was thinking of if it wasn't you, I doubt if I'll ever remember . . .

You were quite right - I did work in IT in GCHQ, but had ceased programming in the 1980s.

I've no real problem with Skoda's policy regarding Owner's Manuals.

The company's approach for the Fabia Mk 4 involves a 'just the basics' printed Manual with a 'full' Manual available online and/or from within the car. It's an elegant solution and I'm sure most buyers of recent Skoda Fabia cars would find it acceptable/tolerable.

Chris's complaint is that he was not provided with a 'just the basics' printed Manual and that's bound to be a real negative for a buyer of a new Skoda car.

I can appreciate your preference for a 'full' printed Owner's Manual but - if the Manual is to also be available through the car's infotainment system - I can't see how that would be worthwhile or necessary.

My 2021 Hyundai i20 had a 'quick start' printed Owner's Manual (just a few pages) and a 648-page 'full' printed Manual with a pitiful index. The car's infotainment system was not covered by the latter Manual and was only held online. In 2021 there was no official online copy of the 'full' printed Manual and, although Hyundai now provides an online 'full' copy, this is out of date and does not reflect specification changes made to more recent models. None of the data in the Manual(s) were accessible through the car's infotainment system.

Dare I say this, but you don't own a recent Skoda car that uses this multi-level approach, so you don't know how well, or badly it works in practice. I'm comfortable with Skoda's approach (and I'm notoriously picky) but then I have a 'just the basics' printed Manual for my Fabia that Chris does not have for his Octavia.

How many desktop computers, tablets or smartphones bought today are provided with a comprehensive printed manual explaining how to use the device and how to exploit its full capabilities? My newish iPad came with no documentation whatsoever and, if I wanted guidance, I'd need to find it online or buy an expensive bulky aftermarket book with a title like "iPads for mentally-challenged octogenarians".

It seems to be assumed with modern cars that the buyer will be reasonably smartphone literate and at least Skoda does (or has been) providing basic printed user-guidance.

20 minutes ago, DerekU said:

I can appreciate your preference for a 'full' printed Owner's Manual but - if the Manual is to also be available through the car's infotainment system - I can't see how that would be worthwhile or necessary.

That because you're more used to using computers, but you know you want and often need back up, to information and systems. I have enough experience of helping neighbours and friends with small jobs and issues on their cars or doing other small jobs for them using the tools and information they have available plus working with professional workmen to know anything that requires electric power can be a PITA and unreliable if there isn't back up.

Looking something up on the car's info is fine, if it's working and you can get to it, not always the most comfortable or convenient way to get the information though if dealing with an issue. Yes could go indoors for better conditions and get a mug of tea and pee but then you have to have their computer fired up, hope the VW . . .

ETA: rocks, pressed Ctrl instead of Alt again, more to continue, follow

Edited 19 March, 20251 yr by nta16
ETA:

Yes could go indoors for better conditions and get a mug of tea and pee but then you have to have their computer fired up, hope the VW . . . Škoda website is active and working to use the online service, which as you have found isn't always the case.

Portable devices/tools, many owners don't have them pre-charged or with sufficient charge to complete the work or risk starting to use them, phone and portable "smart" device screens are difficult to see in daylight and sunlight, owner may not know how to change settings, I don't know and don't want to touch them in case I'm blamed for some app not working in the future that I've not touched. Then of course there's connection or signal issues. In the same way not all that drive cars know even the basics about their cars and how to use them same for device owners.

In a previous life I also dealt with the public face to face and in their own homes, I have experience of lots of different people of all sorts of levels, outside of institutions (perhaps like GCHQ though I know of a military person that was seconded there a couple of years back (now frustrated by real world civilian work and life).

45 minutes ago, DerekU said:

Dare I say this, but you don't own a recent Skoda car that uses this multi-level approach, so you don't know how well, or badly it works in practice. I'm comfortable with Skoda's approach

Yes you certainly can - and you have, and you are correct in as much as I don't own a VWŠkoda at all, it's my wife's car, but I have driven other manufacturers modern cars (2023 being the newest) with lots of computer stuff and screens, I don't think the Owner's Manual was on them but I never looked as a full paper printed copy was provide from new.

There's more than one way of doing things and different people can have different approaches, opinions and attitudes, it's good to get a diversity of answers, I'm not having a go at you or what you want to do, viewers can decide what they want to follow or try. Generally most/all (reasonable) systems have their own flaws and advantages.

2019 Kamiq manual doesn't show on site still, for me at least but it's not an issue for me at the moment.