205 1.9 GTI, perfectly capable of going backwards at a moments notice well below NSL if you lifted off the gas at the wrong time mid corner.

As would a Golf Mk1.

ESP wouldn't have stopped that. ESP is an aid, it is a piece of software designed around certain parameters.

Actually, it probably *would* stop lift-off oversteer.

Still, it would be better if the idiot at the wheel understood what to do (or not do) rather than rely on the electronics. I hate the current propoganda for ESP. How about teaching people to drive? The reason those of us with unmodified FWD cars have engineered-in understeer is because it's considered safe.

I think anyone who turns off their ESP on the highway is very naive.

If on a racing track yes turn it off but on the highway your never going to approach cornering speeds which could cause loss of control unless your driving too fast.

I mean 60mph these days in any modern car you can take nearly any corner at those speeds excl hairpins. So why not do it in even more safety?

Anyone on here who has kids in their car would you turn off your ESP? If no then why do you do it with them not in the car - you could hit a car carrying kids going iun the other direction.

THINK>

If i had ESP, the decision to turn it off would be nothing to do with who was in the car, as I drive within the limits anyway.

Yes, I'd turn off ESP without a quibble. One of my cars doesn't even have ESP or traction control, and I've carried my daughter in that her entire life without having any mishaps.

How this has happened...one of life's mysteries, eh?

Rob.

Maybe, just perhaps, you can drive without landing the car in the scenery?

And it's this attitude that annoys me. Rather than looking at what YOU did wrong, the attitude is that ESP will save me and you will get in the same situation again. How do you cope driving a performance car without traction control?!

Chris

Me too. It's the 'the car just span' attitude. No it didn't- the driver lost control. It's simple: drive like a prat=accident. Been there, done that, learnt a lesson. Drive within limits=no accident.

You *have* to trust the ESP to do it's thing and NOT try to compensate (at all) with the steering, just keep foot on brake or accelerator and point where you WANT to go. With it off, do what you should do..

Tried this in the Golf coming off a wet roundabout and was surprised how ungraceful it was and regaining control didn't feel any better than ASR :(

Quite like not having ESP/ASR in the Mondeo as it means that if I do push it beyond the limits I can correct it and predictably feel when the grip is regained to allow me to stay in control. In the Golf, it was a bit of a lottery as to when you could feel grip coming back with the ESP on.

Chris

Chris - I tried a Golf on the Airfield in the wet some time ago and can only agree with what you say. I think VW have tried to allow some degree of slip before the ESP kicks in - the problem is that the point it comes in is around the point you'd want to correct the situation yourself. So, often you can end up fighting with the ESP as to who's turn it is to help out.

5th gear's repeated on Sat, 10am, in case like me you missed it.

Five Online

5th gear's repeated on Sat, 10am, in case like me you missed it.

Five Online

you didn't miss much