wondering what people's opinions are about where to put the best rubber on a front wheel drive car.

Rear wheels: unable to control them directly so best rubber there to help with grip?

Front wheels: doing all (most) of the work so best rubber here to get the benefit from it?

Would be good if arguments could be backed up with tests etc. but i guess tests havn't been done, so anecdotal guesses and postulating would be good also

Here we go again...

See this thread:

http://briskoda.net/forums/general-car-chat/new-tyres-front-rear-opinon/94590/

Here we go again...

As noted by my learned friend, this has been discussed before. IIRC, the tyre companies suggest that the new rubber should go on the back (I forget the exact reason), but I always put mine on the front.

I saw a video on the web with Vicki Butler Henderson from Fifth Gear doing some tests round a small lap in a front wheel drive car to prove that rear tyres have more of an impact.

It was a bit of an eye opener for me, demonstrated the difference quite clearly.

If I recall, the video was on one of the online tyre retail websites, saw it when I was looking for new tyres at the end of last year.

Rear every time

Lack of front grip causes understeer & usually recoverable by lifting off

lack of grip on the rear causes oversteer & lifting off /slowing can cause a spin

Normal driving wont make a lot of difference but you dont normally loose a car driving normally, its the sudden sharp bend in the wet that catches you out.

I would rather have a chance of saving it rather than an almost guaranteed spin.

For those with good front tyres & dodgy rears find a big EMPTY roundabout in the wet, drive round until the cars on the limit then lift off but be prepared to nail it again. Dont brake & BUILD IT UP SLOWLY over 2 or 3 goes. Dont hug the inside either as the car will tend to move towards the middle of the roundabout, keep it around mid point

Understeer - you see what you're going to hit.

Oversteer - you might hit something backwards, or you might scrub off enough speed that you don't hit anything. Also, you have way more options for correction than "lift off and pray it comes back".

I saw that episode aswell and was very surprised with the results, it made me think but still rarely change tyres over. To this day the only times the rear of my car steps out if iam chucking it in to corners sideways or if there is diesel or somthing on the road and if thats happens then no amount of tread will save you. The asr will also make a big differance but again only if driving to the conditions and not being stupid.

I'm sticking my new tyres on the back this weekend.

Have to say, it's mainly because my rears are now illegal really, and I cannot be bothered to do another front to back swap. I'll do it when the backs are scrubbed in and my current fronts look a little on the worn side.

Yip thats the only reason i did mine iam just to damn lazy.

i usually try and swap all four at a time as i usually swap fronts and rears every few thousand miles.

i prefer oversteer as imo safer but understeer is easier to control.

I'm wearing 4 T1-Rs pretty evenly ATM. I know it's even cos they were all fitted together!

I think it depends on whether you grew up driving rear wheel drive cars, Capri - Nissan 200sx etc, or front drive. My tyre place has been telling me I'm wrong for years! 4x4 understeers anyway so more grip on the front helps.

I originally grew up with RWD, but I've not driven anything RWD regularly since about 1993 (and that was a Trannie).

front everytime.... its more fun.

surely if the front wheels have no grip then sliding the back wheels will just add to the situation? but i understand what your saying aswell. wont be practicing it though tbh.

If you have 4 tyres put on... the front will wear out WAY faster.

If you put new ones on the front- the back ones will still be very good.

Is this a problem? Probably not.

Given that brand new tyres are notoriously slippy until worn in, the 'fit on rear cos it's safer' advice just doesn't make sense to me. Once the new tyres are worn in then they should be "as good" as the other set (assuming t'other set are nowhere near gone - say 4mm+) so no perceptible imbalance. This is based on how I experience tyre wear - a scary wear in period followed by a long even 'good grip' period which doesn't seem to change till ~3mm.

I've got 3 year old Michelins on the back which are hard and cracked, probably need changing. I was going to put my TR1s from the front there while they still have some tread left, or do I just wait till after the handling day and do all 4?

If you have 4 tyres put on... the front will wear out WAY faster.

Really? See post #12 above!

Given that brand new tyres are notoriously slippy until worn in, the 'fit on rear cos it's safer' advice just doesn't make sense to me.

So many specialists out there;) It takes about 40 miles to scrub a new tyre in unless you drive like a wuss:D

New tyres on the rear, end of...( courtesy of Michelin, Goodyear,Bridgestone,Avon,Pirelli.......)

Phil

If you have 4 tyres put on... the front will wear out WAY faster.

If you put new ones on the front- the back ones will still be very good.

Is this a problem? Probably not.

depends on how you drive but this is why i swao them over every so often.

So many specialists out there;) It takes about 40 miles to scrub a new tyre in unless you drive like a wuss:D

New tyres on the rear, end of...( courtesy of Michelin, Goodyear,Bridgestone,Avon,Pirelli.......)

Phil

a new tyre bedding in is more to do with heat cycles, and as for best rubber... it should go to the driven wheels... assuming the driver has the skills to compensate... but then I only run a racing team so what do i know.....

lets face it if it was critical on a road car to put new rubber to the back it would be illegal to run a staggered setup.

ISTR that it actually is now illegal to run a reverse stagger (larger tyres on front), although the early Citroen CXs were delivered with 185s on the front, 175s on the rear, specifically to combat understeer.

As with everything thats why freedom of speech is great;) I do not doubt anyones opinion.... although being involved in the tyre industry for the last 20 odd years i regard the technical knowledge of the big tyre companys, hence i can only "advise" you where to put the tyres:P yes it is now illegal to have larger front tyre on the front than the rear;)

Phil

My cynicism about the tyre companies' "about face" on this issue is actually based on the "proof" they've offered. This boils down to carrying out panic braking on a turn on a flooded road. Guess what; I've never needed to do this!

What I have needed to do pretty regularly is seriously hard stopping on a wet road in a straight line. With the better tyres on the front, I get better front end grip from the better tyres, and better rear end grip from the better tyres having dried out the road just before the worse ones get there.