Which oil do I buy?

[Ootohere]

What engine do you have Early 2012 a CAVE,  

or late 2012 CTHE,  it says on your V5. or in the Service Book.  Or when was it first Registered?

 

The Crank Case Breather Valve will most likely have been replaced because the Buyer of the EX Demo car complained of High Oil Usage.

It appears to not have improved things much if you are aware of Oil Usage.

But you have the Warranty, and they know they might be needing to replace your engine come time.

 

Likely it was the last owner that reported high oil usage, and had the consumption test, breather mod, then punted the car,

Because the Dealers running the Demonstrator & selling it after 3 months to a customer never seem to bother if it is an oil drinker.

They say it is in the 'Running in Period for 3,000 miles, so you can expect it to use oil', & @ 0.5 litres per 1000  km is acceptable.

then say to the new owner, give it time,

'It is Normal;, they all do that'.  They lie though. Only the Faulty ones do that.

 

I take it you have Dark Chrome Gigaro,

many of them get replaced,

so just be sure they are all corrosion free while still in Warranty.

They will replace them, sometimes they are awkward, but in the end they replace them.

(Do not accept Refurbishment or offers of Refurbishment.)

 

Expect to have a car without wheels with White Spider on the wheels before it is 3 years old.

(i have had Warranty Replaced wheels Replaced again because they went the same way, they were not happy,

but it is their Sh!te workmanship & Quality Control, or Parts Suppliers, so they need to suck it up, or get their act together.

Just like they need to with their engines)

[austenw90]

What engine do you have Early 2012 a CAVE,  

or late 2012 CTHE,  it says on your V5. or in the Service Book.  Or when was it first Registered?

 

The Crank Case Breather Valve will most likely have been replaced because the Buyer of the EX Demo car complained of High Oil Usage.

It appears to not have improved things much if you are aware of Oil Usage.

But you have the Warranty, and they know they might be needing to replace your engine come time.

 

Likely it was the last owner that reported high oil usage, and had the consumption test, breather mod, then punted the car,

Because the Dealers running the Demonstrator & selling it after 3 months to a customer never seem to bother if it is an oil drinker.

They say it is in the 'Running in Period for 3,000 miles, so you can expect it to use oil', & @ 0.5 litres per 1000  km is acceptable.

then say to the new owner, give it time,

'It is Normal;, they all do that'.  They lie though. Only the Faulty ones do that.

 

I take it you have Dark Chrome Gigaro,

many of them get replaced,

so just be sure they are all corrosion free while still in Warranty.

They will replace them, sometimes they are awkward, but in the end they replace them.

(Do not accept Refurbishment or offers of Refurbishment.)

 

Expect to have a car without wheels with White Spider on the wheels before it is 3 years old.

(i have had Warranty Replaced wheels Replaced again because they went the same way, they were not happy,

but it is their Sh!te workmanship & Quality Control, or Parts Suppliers, so they need to suck it up, or get their act together.

Just like they need to with their engines)

 

There is a sticker inside the drivers door which says CAVE. I haven't received the V5 yet but could check handbook.

 

The wheels all look fine at the moment so will keep an eye on them, thanks for the info.

 

So what do you suggest I do now - just keep an eye on the oil weekly or something like that?

[Ootohere]

It will be a CAVE pre Aug/Sept engine change to CTHE.

 

I was just interested if it was an Early CTHE,

because a Breather Valve mod would not be required on the revised engine.

 

Just keep a log of the Oil you need to top up, and how you do your miles, in and around town or longer out of town.

 

all the best & just do not overfill with oil.

Keep within area 'A'.

 

george

[austenw90]

It will be a CAVE pre Aug/Sept engine change to CTHE.

 

I was just interested if it was an Early CTHE,

because a Breather Valve mod would not be required on the revised engine.

 

Just keep a log of the Oil you need to top up, and how you do your miles, in and around town or longer out of town.

 

all the best & just do not overfill with oil.

Keep within area 'A'.

 

george

Thanks George.

 

I've just booked it in with the local dealer and they are going to run the oil test. So this will either offer peace of mind or they will sort any necessary work.

 

Is it correct that it should/could burn "some" oil or should it not use any at all?

 

Is it that all CAVE's suffer this problem? Does it affect the CTHE's as well?

Edited 18 December, 2013 by austenw90

[Ootohere]

Only a small percentage of the the almost 1,800 CAVE vRS Registered in the UK from 2010-2012 had problems.

& then also the Twincharger Polo GTI, Seat Cupra 2009-12.&  A1 185 ps.

Others around the world had problems, including Australia.

 

But that percentage is growing. 

The nearest i have ever got to the correct figures looks like 20% are bad. Or were.

 but VW Audi Group are the ones that know.

** Maybe Formally ask Skoda UK, just how many Warranty Claims on faulty Twinchargers, and how many Engines have been Replaced.**

A request to 'ALASDAIR STEWART,  SKODA UK BRAND DIRECTOR',

for some honesty on the problems that effect owners of many Fabia mk2 vRS. might be worth while.

 

Many i am aware of were Demonstrators, certainly the first cars, July 2010-2011 were liable to be wrong when sold on from being demonstrators and before they were given an ECU Update.

 

Some oil use can be expected, depends on how being driven.some cars use almost no oil.

Short Journeys cold start and cold oil, might mean more oil used.

Some that had engines rebuilt like mine was at 4,000 miles are OK 25,000 miles or more later.

 

There are at least 2 members here that have had engines replaced in CTHE cars.

 

george

 

I have bumped this thread again.

There are quite a few members here with engines replaced that never posted their experiences.

So more Briskoda Members cars effected than shown here,

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/294051-cave-cthe-14tsi-just-reply-if-you-have-had-an-engine-replaced

[austenw90]

I took a call this morning from the dealer who are meant to be running my oil test. They phoned to inform me that if it comes back ok I will have to pay £110. I've made a case with Skoda UK as I think this is completely unacceptable, especially on a car I've owned just one week! I only want them to test it for peace of mind or so that any relevant work required can be sorted.

Edited 19 December, 2013 by austenw90

[Ootohere]

They have charged customers that have cars that have been tested and they say have used within acceptable limits.

At least 3 members with posts in the last 2 months.

 

But for the test they are driving it for 300 km (186 miles) or having the owner drive for that,

 then measuring the oil used, multiplying and saying that equals the use over 1000 km.

 

Total Rubbish,

There is an Invoice in posts showing where another Member had to pay, but does not even have the accurate figures.

3.6 litres of oil weighs about 3100 grams.

Engine oil is not 1000 grams per litre.  in an unopened bottle, it is only 900 grams or so.  

1000 grams is the weight of a litre of water.

The Invoice that the Member got for the Test showed the Oil at the start of the test as being over 3600 grams,

& using 78 grams of oil.

 

Stick with it, and be prepared to put the case to Skoda UK that their Franchised Dealers are selling products that Skoda UK know have faults.

 

If they say an engine might use 0.5 litres in 1000 km,  then that is 621 miles, not 186 miles.

 

Get them to seal the Filler cap & dip stick after filling with the correct amount of oil, and go back in 1000 or 1200 miles

to see how much oil is used.

If an oil light came on within 1200 miles than it is likely it used more than 1 litre of oil in the 1200 miles.

 

They are taking the Pith.

[austenw90]

Thanks again for the info. 

 

So I am guessing new cars off the production line can still suffer with oil issues? 

 

I thought I was buying a sound product being VAG but I had a better experience with Fiat. 

 

Why should a customer pay for peace of mind!

Edited 19 December, 2013 by austenw90

[austenw90]

Just to update this...

I had my car in the garage today for the consumption test which Skoda UK have agreed to cover the cost of. Unfortunately they were unable to start the test as the place they take the oil to for initial weighing is closed until Monday so I am rebooked for a later date however they did provide a fresh full quantity of oil.

What was quite concerning was that the oil removed (which didn't look much - a lot less than 3.6L) was very black and "gloopy" as they described it. I thought oil in a petrol engine stayed a light golden clear colour for quite some time - the oil was only replaced 2000 miles ago at the service and has obviously had top ups since.

I've had the car less than a month and am really concerned about all this...

[Ootohere]

Unbelievable that a Garage does not have an accurate set of scales of their own and a clean measuring jug.

£30 Quid for Digital scales, and £1.99 for a jug.

 

You might not get the 3.6 litres out of the drain hole but you get most of it,

and surely they know exactly what came out, by a Measuring Jug that they do have laying about.

Like a 5 litre Bottle with the Scale on the side.

 

They really sound like they will be a laugh to deal with.

 

All the best with it.

[austenw90]

I've heard back and been told that the next step is a breather valve modification and hose replacements so I'm guessing that the oil consumption is out of tolerance. Skoda UK have confirmed to me already that this was done last year. The dealer didn't realise this until I mentioned it.

 

I am just waiting to hear back from the dealer now they are aware of the mod being done already...

 

Does anyone know if there is more than one set of modications to be done with the breather valve mod or is it always air intake hoses as well? I assume it will be the next step (whatever this is?) as the mod has been done? The service advisor wasn't sure if the note on the system saying "breather valve mod" was a 1st stage and if there was a 2nd stage to it so obviously wants to go away and check.

Edited 27 January, 2014 by austenw90

[Ootohere]

Best that you get in writing from Skoda UK what there technical plan is to deal with your engine.

You are wanting your car fixed properly under Warranty,  

let them set out what they intend doing now that 2 Oil Consumption tests have been done

and obviously must be showing the engine uses too much oil

&

They are the ones paying the bill,

and if the Service Advisor can not easily get the Information he is as much use as a chocolate teapot.

You are as well getting it from the Organ Grinder and not the Monkey.

 

george

[austenw90]

Skoda Customer Services said they can confirm it on writing once they've rectified the issue... They really are a joke! It's not personally the peoples fault as they are doing their jobs but how can a car manufacturer operate a customer relations department who have no knowledge of their vehicles and are not technically trained!?

As for the test, the car burnt approx 1/3 of its oil contents in the 350 miles I covered on the test...

I am told the next step is to replace the air intake hose and another hose that I can't recall the name of. The breather mod has already been done.

How can a few hoses possibly clear an issue with oil consumption?

To be fair to the dealer they are just following guidance from Skoda technical and the service the dealer are provided is pretty good.

[Ootohere]

The Air Intake Hose is a Mystery to me.

 

Best just ask Skoda UK to confirm in Writing just what is what they intend having done.

(They can confirm in Writing fully afterwards as well, but they can not just play about with someones car 

and expect you to accept their Trial & Error.)

Insist as the Vehicle is Faulty that you want to know the Exact Procedures to Test and then repair the faults.

Ask what the Part Numbers are that are being fitted to your car.

 

Ask your Dealer to give you a Copy of the Technical Advice they received, about what has now to be done.

 

They get 3 chances to get the repair right, then start action against them,

they are taking the Pith.

 

As long as you have a courtesy car off them untill they rectify the faults, and get all your out of pocket expenses covered.

 

Call your you Local Trading Standards, ask their Advice, start a Case,

and forward any thing you Have in Writing from Skoda UK to Trading Standards.

[austenw90]

Thanks for the advice, very helpful.

[austenw90]

Just a quick update...

 

Through frustration I emailed the MD of Skoda UK last night.

 

I have just taken a call this morning confirming that the Head of Technical has given the go ahead to replace the engine without any of these further modifications.

 

I wonder if the email did something...

[Ootohere]

Wunderbah.   Well done.

 

Was that to.

Alisdair Stewart Skoda UK Brand Director, ?

the person that up to now seems to totally ignore the plight of many Skoda Fabia vRS owners with major engine problems.

[austenw90]

Wunderbah.   Well done.

 

Was that to.

Alisdair Stewart Skoda UK Brand Director, ?

the person that up to now seems to totally ignore the plight of many Skoda Fabia vRS owners with major engine problems.

 

It certainly was.

 

I must say that the dealer service department have been helpful with this but I'm not sure they've had many cases like this to deal with.

 

I can't say it worked but I can't see why else there would suddenly be such a dramatic change of path. Here is what I wrote for anyone interested. It's not the best email ever, it was written on an iPad at 10:30pm and contained a few spelling mistakes (since corrected for below), but it seems to have done something...

 

Dear Mr Stewart

I am writing to you directly with hope that Skoda UK will abide by its Customer Promise and "work competently and in your best interests" and "provide a clear explanation of our work" as I currently do not feel that this is the case.

I have owned my Fabia vRS (registration CU62 ***) for little more than one month and have unfortunately found that the car is not fit for purpose due to high oil consumption. It has already had the crankcase breather valve modification but is still burning a high quantity of oil therefore it has failed its recent oil consumption test which was completed last week. Now Skoda UK are instructing the dealership to replace some hoses, one of which I understand to be an air intake hose and carry out a further oil consumption test - I must add that Skoda UK have not confirmed any of this to me in detail or in writing. This is simply word of mouth from the dealership service department.

It seems that I as the customer am not being put first and that Skoda UK are not working in my best interests. I am having to go back and forth to the dealer frequently which is taking a great deal of time and costing money. Most importantly it is also interfering with a new job I have just started for which I rely on my car. I also cannot rely on courtesy cars due to the unreasonable lead time to get one.

It seems to me that Skoda UK are more interested in experimenting and trying to make minor tweaks to my clearly faulty engine with a view to being able to tick a box instead of fixing the root cause of the problem, which is the engine itself. I struggle to understand why my car should be the subject of many ongoing experiments and why Skoda will waste so much time and resource when inevitably the engine should simply be replaced with cost being negligible.

The Customer Services department despite being amiable people have no technical knowledge, therefore I am left to make my own assumptions and having to do my own research which takes a great deal of time. The dealership it would seem aren't overly knowledgable on the matter. Therefore I have no technically competent point of contact.

This is my first Skoda and I would hate to have to say it will be my last. But currently I do not feel that my custom is valued and that my car and I are being treated in line with your Customer Promise. Further questions come to light when I ask, why were a Skoda dealership (Sparshatts Group) allowed to sell me a faulty product in the first place?

Apologies for contacting you with such negativity but I do hope you or a member of your team can help me to resolve this issue once and for all prior to contacting Trading Standards.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Kind regards

Edited 29 January, 2014 by austenw90

[vrskeith]

What an excellent and openly honest letter.

 

About time a senior executive took notice of the CUSTOMER.

 

WELL DONE AND GOOD RESULT!!

[austenw90]

What an excellent and openly honest letter.

 

About time a senior executive took notice of the CUSTOMER.

 

WELL DONE AND GOOD RESULT!!

 

Thanks, hopefully this will help others now as we should all be treated equally and fairly.

[austenw90]

For reference, this is Skoda UK's customer promise I refer to:

 

http://www.skoda.co.uk/owners/customer-promise

 

As always we are working to ensure your happiness and here's how we intend to do it...

Care and consideration for you and your car

 

We will:

 

• Work competently and in your best interests
• Treat you as a valued individual and respect and care for your property.

A flexible and convenient service

We will:

• Provide flexibility and choice of dates and times for booking and collection
• Ensure our price will be all-inclusive for the work we agree to undertake
• Endeavour to diagnose a vehicle defect within 24 hours of the vehicle being presented to us
• Offer free collection and delivery within a 10 mile radius (up to 20 minutes drive time) for pre-bookings
• Provide a courtesy car or arrange onward mobility if your vehicle is to be kept overnight

Expertise and attention to detail with no surprises

  

We will:

 

• Complete the work as agreed with you
• Always gain your authority if any additional work is required
• Keep you informed of progress and advise you when your car is ready
• Complete a complimentary visual health check if your vehicle is left with us and include a professional recommendation of:
  • Any components that require replacing immediately
  • The point at which any part of your car should be re-checked in the near future
  • Check for any warrantable product enhancements recommended by ŠKODA and perform these free of charge
  • Always use genuine ŠKODA parts and accessories
  • Wash your car following a service

A clear explanation of our work

 

We will:

 

• Ensure our invoice matches the booking price
• Provide a full explanation of work completed and any charges made
• Communicate clearly in an open and honest way avoiding jargon
• Review the vehicle condition report and explain all work completed
• Where possible, perform a walkaround of the vehicle with you
• Value your feedback and will encourage you to complete our 'your opinion counts' survey so you can tell us what you liked and how we can improve further

[Big Sheep]

Now that we have got some momentum going, what recompense would Mk2 vRS owners who have gone through the mill with oil consumption problems like to see?

 

A two year free of charge extension to the standard warranty perhaps? (This must be transferable).

 

Over 100 UK based Briskoda members have reported oil consumption issues on with this car on the forum. Word is getting out and we don't want to be sitting on lemons that will be difficult to sell. Whether or not SUK have agreed to an engine replacement I think customers require better from Skoda customer services. Too many owners have been messed about and not enough compensation has been forthcoming.

 

It might soon be time to confront Alisdair Stewart.

[Ootohere]

I am hoping that the Volkswagen Audi Group are going to make an announcement at some point of 100,000 mile warranty on Twincharger engines World Wide.

Where they are scared by legal challenges in other countries, they had to do that on DSG's with Issues..

They treat the European Customers like dirt in comparison.

 

Their Dealers as well as customers have cars,

that quite a high percentage of owners have been having issues with.

 

Honesty from the VAG Brands CEO's would go some way towards getting matters moving among their employees and Franchised Dealerships.

A public Statement and Press releases to the Media accepting poor Quality Control & Manufacturing or Design seems to be required.

Hopefully the Motoring Press in Europe will grow some B,all5 and question Volkswagen Audi Group on their behaviour towards customers.

Treated as Mushrooms.

 

Kept in the Dark and shoveled with sh!t.

 

george

[austenw90]

Gents

 

I've just taken a phone call from a chap who works as Customer Relations Manager for the Executive Team (i.e. for Alasdair Stewart). He confirmed my email had been recieved directly by Alasdair who has pulled the head technical person in on my case who has reviewed the dealers report and said to get the engine replaced.

 

They are also looking at making an offer as a goodwill gesture, unlikely to be financial but not ruled out but most likely something like a FOC service plan or some free accessories. I have said I will think about it and we are going to speak again next week. I have also said I expect and want confirmation that the new engine will come with a new 3 year minimum warranty which they are going to confirm.

 

I can't think of any accessories but I guess a service plan would be useful...

Edited 29 January, 2014 by austenw90

[vrskeith]

Buying off an individual again!!

Okay for you I guess?

But not admitting to the overall design / engineering fault.

Weekends thinking time for you. New replacement car with 5 hr warranty would be best conclusion.