So I'm looking to buy a decent perfromance diesel hatchback or estate and am having really problems decding what I should do.

I really fancy the Skoda Octavia vRS CR TDi DSG Estate (facelift) but I'm having problems justifying the costs.

Drive the deal will sell the car with certain options (Columbus, Maxidot, Xenons, PDC, Metallic paint) for £20,500 which is a great price.

However when you look on Autotrader or Pistonheads and then query Parkers the used price for a 3 year old car (based on 60,000 miles which fair enough the most I'll do is 30,000) the recommended price is £10,000.

That's an eye watering £10,000 in 3 years of driving!

I'm not sure I can justify that, especially when you could get say an older Audi for less and it would probably not depreciate that much, admittedly I'm struggling to find a decent low mileage one in Avant spec too.

Skoda lists very few 1 year old VRSs in estate form with the DSG gearbox

For the ones avalable as it's a Skoda price you're paying more so approx £2000 difference between that and the DTD price which for that you'd be better buying new with 0 miles.

Then there's the issue of ordering and length of build / delivery.

Just wondering what people's thoughts are on the depreciation ascept of the vRS

Are prices tumbling as fast as suggested?

Anyone managing to get lower new prices than the ones advertised? I know new cars have slumped a bit again so was wondering if there are any deals to be done.

Thanks for reading

random thoughts to consider:

- the guides will not take any allowance for spec/options, so you may be able to sell your car for more when the time comes

- if you do less miles then it'll be worth more mileage adjusted.

- the guide you're looking at is for a 3 yr old car ie a pre-facelift. whenever a manufacturer brings out a new model or facelift the earlier models inevitably suffer, so this may not be reflective of the value your new FL car would have 3 yrs in the future

- there's been a vat free offer for some time now, making the cars cheap to buy new, plus drive the deal and other similar options exist so very few people have paid retail for their cars (mine on Dtd was 16k new (pre-options) so 10k value in 3yrs is only 6k depreciation not 10k. I think 2k per year depreciation is pretty good actually..

- parkers guide prices are complete rubbish IMO and nothing lke the guides the trade uses.

- if you're really worried about depreciation, don't buy a new car, or if you do, don't buy it from a dealer!

HTH.

Just some thoughts - but it's up to you at the end of the day. You mention either a hatch or estate - go for the hatch it's vast and save a grand. It's probably quieter as well, if my experience of estates is anything to go by.

Go for petrol - save another grand. The Tsi engine can only be described as sensational. (I've got the 1.8). I have always been a huge diesel enthusiast in the past, but not any more. It takes a big mileage to recoup the extra cost and do some research on DPF's. Don't forget that in the UK, diesel fuel is more expensive than petrol. 'What Car' advise to go for the petrol Vrs, saying that the petrol is 'a gem' of an engine and that the diesel isn't worth the extra money.

Xenons - anyone for having a bad hit from a flying stone? You could save £600 here. The standard Octy light set up seems pretty good to me and I've driven a lot of different cars over the years. A cheaper option would be to go into Halfrauds and fit some uprated bulbs. I've done this in the past and it can make a notable difference. £600 for some fancy headlights that some consider to be an expensive liability is a lot of dosh.

DSG. Another grand. This is either a love or hate thing. Worth looking at various tests and user reports from other VAG sites. One of the features that a number have commented on detrimentaly is the situation that crops up a lot in real life - say approaching a roundabout, slowing down; then you see a gap and foot down to go. Apparently the gearbox doesn't see or realise what you do ...................................I think if you want a DSG box, it's definitely have a DSG car for a day and see what you think.

If you take the cost of some of these things into account and the fact that Skoda are doing 'No VAT' at the moment, it could be possible to bring down the cost very significanly. New cars are a bad buy anyway, because we always lose money, but we buy cars for different reasons and try not to think of the depreciation.

One option that is cheaper on the Vrs for some reason is leather. This is a steal at £700 and I'd go for that if possible. Much better value I think than Xenon lights and the leather seats will be a good selling points in time to come when you want to change. Oh -- and get parking sensors - most people are glad they did...................................

Hope this helps, but these are only my thoughts, at the end of the day, it's up to you.

So I'm looking to buy a decent perfromance diesel hatchback or estate and am having really problems decding what I should do.

I really fancy the Skoda Octavia vRS CR TDi DSG Estate (facelift) but I'm having problems justifying the costs.

Drive the deal will sell the car with certain options (Columbus, Maxidot, Xenons, PDC, Metallic paint) for £20,500 which is a great price.

However when you look on Autotrader or Pistonheads and then query Parkers the used price for a 3 year old car (based on 60,000 miles which fair enough the most I'll do is 30,000) the recommended price is £10,000.

That's an eye watering £10,000 in 3 years of driving!

I'm not sure I can justify that, especially when you could get say an older Audi for less and it would probably not depreciate that much, admittedly I'm struggling to find a decent low mileage one in Avant spec too.

Skoda lists very few 1 year old VRSs in estate form with the DSG gearbox

For the ones avalable as it's a Skoda price you're paying more so approx £2000 difference between that and the DTD price which for that you'd be better buying new with 0 miles.

Then there's the issue of ordering and length of build / delivery.

Just wondering what people's thoughts are on the depreciation ascept of the vRS

Are prices tumbling as fast as suggested?

Anyone managing to get lower new prices than the ones advertised? I know new cars have slumped a bit again so was wondering if there are any deals to be done.

Thanks for reading

Dont forget it roughly works out at £100 per 1000 miles over the yearly average of 12,000

so a three year old car should have done on average 36,000, you have quoted from your sources £10,000 for a 3 year old with 60,000 otc. Fingers out - 3 x 12,000= 36,000. 60,000 - 36,000 = 24,000 over the average which equals approx £2400

Edited 13 July, 201015 yr by Hyperviper34

Dont forget it roughly works out at £100 per 1000 miles over the yearly average of 12,000

so a three year old car should have done on average 36,000, you have quoted from your sources £10,000 for a 3 year old with 60,000 otc. Fingers out - 3 x 12,000= 36,000. 60,000 - 36,000 = 24,000 over the average which equals approx £2400

Not many of them on the Autotrader but just as an example:

Year:2007

SKODA OCTAVIA 2.0 TDI PD 170 VRS 5dr Diesel Estate

Mileage: 36,000

£10,500

I'll admit I would quite happily not buy brand new but there is very litle currently available at the 6 months mark.

DSG would be preferred as I can spend quite a bit of time queueing to get through the Tyne Tunnel twice a day

Diesel as it gets better mpg, easier to sell on etc

Fair enough I could go hatchback or estate without too much issue

Xeons yeah I could take it or leave it but again come resale it'll probably **** quicker with

Leather seats are not for me, I've had a few and it's too cold in the winter and gives you a sweaty back in the summer

My two pence........

Not sure that the Columbus sat-nav is a good option if you want to save money - £1000+ (as an option), and you'll be lucky to see £500 come p/x time. A Tom-Tom (portable sat nav) is cheaper...... (other brands are available ). It is nice that the Columbus is integrated, and no marks are left on the windscreen from the portable sat nav holder. Bonus points with a portable sat nav you can move it to another car should you sell up or want to use it in another car!

The resale argument of Xenons - I know loads of people that given a choice would not buy a car with them, as they see them as expensive if the bulb goes/ anything else goes wrong. As mentioned earlier, some uprated bulbs would be a much cheaper option. They look nice, but not sure they add much to the resale value.

Engine - I like the diesel (170bhp CR), and the mileages I do justify the extra cost. I also like the low down torque that comes from the diesel. I must admit that I was put off the petrol engine as I find that my 170bhp diesel can be too much for the front wheels to cope with. I'd have no front tyres within a week if I had the petrol engine!

10p a mile for depreciation is not bad considering you are the first owner, know what has happened to the car, and you get the car and specification that you really want (and need). You can also benefit from any other offers that may be only available on new cars (low rate PCP, or 0% finance for 2 years are currently available).

Personally, make sure you get the maxidot, PDC (do you really need front PDC - if not, only order the rear PDC and save more cash), metalic paint and a SPARE WHEEL (a bargain at £50 when ordered from the factory).

Justin

Engine - I like the diesel (170bhp CR), and the mileages I do justify the extra cost. I also like the low down torque that comes from the diesel. I must admit that I was put off the petrol engine as I find that my 170bhp diesel can be too much for the front wheels to cope with. I'd have no front tyres within a week if I had the petrol engine!

Justin

I cant say I agree there, the diesel is harsher on the front tyres because of the way it makes its torque and how the boost comes in all in a lump

The petrol is much much smoother in terms of power delivery and you'll find yourself using full revs in all the gears with no wheelspin ( in the dry )as long as you dont just mash the throttle pedal to the floor.

The petrol really is a remarkable little engine, it makes peak torque from under 1900rpm yet holds its power well up the rev range, its sooooooooooo tractable and nice to drive.

Anyone managing to get lower new prices than the ones advertised? I know new cars have slumped a bit again so was wondering if there are any deals to be done.

Certainly when I was shopping last October there were some dealers who would match, come very close or in some cases beat the DtD quote. You mentioned the Tyne Tunnel in one of your earlier posts, try giving Justin a call in Silbury Skoda, Cramlington (if you're from the south of the tunnel it's just off the A19, first exit after the Moor Farm roundabout). He got as close as made no difference to my CarQuake quote without even asking to see it...

Remember to factor in the cost of tyres though - the factory fitted Dunlops on mine lasted 8000 miles on the fronts (rears are still fine), and although I drive with some gusto (it'd be a crime not to ) I certainly don't thrash it. Opted for some Michelins so keeping an eye on them to see how they hold up.

I cant say I agree there, the diesel is harsher on the front tyres because of the way it makes its torque and how the boost comes in all in a lump

The petrol is much much smoother in terms of power delivery and you'll find yourself using full revs in all the gears with no wheelspin ( in the dry )as long as you dont just mash the throttle pedal to the floor.

The petrol really is a remarkable little engine, it makes peak torque from under 1900rpm yet holds its power well up the rev range, its sooooooooooo tractable and nice to drive.

The new CR engine is much smoother than the older PD diesel so is probably no harsher on the front tyres than the petrol VRS. The old PD gave a big lump of power which did put more strain on the front tyres but this is no longer the cost.

Also you do not need to do big miles to make the diesel pay. I think the difference in price is around £800 between the petrol and diesel price. However, the road tax for the petrol is £250 a year while it is only £125 for the diesel. Over 3 years this is £375 less (almost half the extra cost of the diesel. So by the time you factor in the extra selling price you pretty much break even without the saving on fuel you make. The CR engine easily returns 45mpg around town (50+ on a run) which will be 20-30% more than the petrol so even with 10k miles a year you are going to see substantial savings (even if diesel is a few pence more per litre). I could do the maths on this but can not be bothered at moment!!!!

The DPF was an issue with the PD engine but agin not so with the CR since the CR engine was designed to work with a DPF while the PD engine was not.

Think this has been mentioned in post above but may have been missed - ALL OCTAVIA MODELS VAT FREE (17.5% equivalent off the price until 31st December 2010)

Still cant justify buying new?

I took out a brand new A3 Sportback 140bhp black edition before i ordered the vRS, it made it a lot easier to justify buying the vRS. I chose quite a few options because I know I will have this car for 4/5 years minimum, wanted the toys and looked at the enjoyment factor rather than the depreciation. The last thing you want is to buy a car and then think mmmmmmmmm I wish I got that.

I took out a brand new A3 Sportback 140bhp black edition before i ordered the vRS, it made it a lot easier to justify buying the vRS. I chose quite a few options because I know I will have this car for 4/5 years minimum, wanted the toys and looked at the enjoyment factor rather than the depreciation. The last thing you want is to buy a car and then think mmmmmmmmm I wish I got that.

Same sort of thing here, I have had my Mk1 vRS for 8 years this october, and gotta be honest have loved every minute in it.

I have now ordered a shiny new blue vrs estate in petrol, as I dont do a great deal of miles.

The VAT offer has helped this enormously, coupled with the fact I will probably keep this one another 8 years, so i have added no extras, other than the spare wheel, as I see the extra's as things that may go wrong with the car, and just added expense when not really needed.

My last vrs was standard, no extras added, and have to be honest, has never been off the road for anything other than service

My last one cost 15100, and i have got 2100 as a trade in, so its cost 13'000 to buy over 8 years (as a rough working out)

Great value at 1625 per year, a pleasure to drive, and still in pretty good nick, although by the time it goes in will need timing belt, tyres and discs and pads all around (hence the low trade in value methinks....)

Roll on the new one, cant wait!!

Steve

The new CR engine is much smoother than the older PD diesel so is probably no harsher on the front tyres than the petrol VRS. The old PD gave a big lump of power which did put more strain on the front tyres but this is no longer the cost.

Also you do not need to do big miles to make the diesel pay. I think the difference in price is around £800 between the petrol and diesel price. However, the road tax for the petrol is £250 a year while it is only £125 for the diesel. Over 3 years this is £375 less (almost half the extra cost of the diesel. So by the time you factor in the extra selling price you pretty much break even without the saving on fuel you make. The CR engine easily returns 45mpg around town (50+ on a run) which will be 20-30% more than the petrol so even with 10k miles a year you are going to see substantial savings (even if diesel is a few pence more per litre). I could do the maths on this but can not be bothered at moment!!!!

The DPF was an issue with the PD engine but agin not so with the CR since the CR engine was designed to work with a DPF while the PD engine was not.

Have a look at this thread:

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/154448-calculating-running-costs-petrol-v-diesel-scout/

On there, there was a link to a .zip file (I've attached it again to this post) that has an excel 2007 format sheet that you can put your own numbers in to do a cost comparison between a petrol and diesel Octavia. I guess there is nothing to stop you putting other numbers in to compare other vehicles........

Justin

DieselVSPetrol_vRS.zip

Cheers for the spreadsheet so using that it would say even driving only 5000 miles a year it is cheaper with the diesel.

Diesel is cheaper - FACT

£800 more to buy, yes, but more MPG, half the tax, better resale value so at the end of the day its your choice for petrol or derv, initial cost doesn't come into it in my book as you make that up on resale easily.

If i'd bought a petrol I would be smiling all the way to the petrol station and then crying all the way home twice a week.

Ditch the Satnav - £1600 saved, keep the xenon's, you will love em! AFAIK new bulbs aren't too expensive? You can get a satnav fitted from oemretrofits for £600odd or one off ebay for around £500 which is what im going to do when ive got some cash.

You can also get 0% finance for 2years too so don't forget that.

+1 for spare wheel - ive used mine already and spent £140 on a new tyre after 3,000 miles :(

You don't need met paint either as you know that Red is the only colour worth having

The new CR engine is much smoother than the older PD diesel so is probably no harsher on the front tyres than the petrol VRS. The old PD gave a big lump of power which did put more strain on the front tyres but this is no longer the cost.

Also you do not need to do big miles to make the diesel pay. I think the difference in price is around £800 between the petrol and diesel price. However, the road tax for the petrol is £250 a year while it is only £125 for the diesel. Over 3 years this is £375 less (almost half the extra cost of the diesel. So by the time you factor in the extra selling price you pretty much break even without the saving on fuel you make. The CR engine easily returns 45mpg around town (50+ on a run) which will be 20-30% more than the petrol so even with 10k miles a year you are going to see substantial savings (even if diesel is a few pence more per litre). I could do the maths on this but can not be bothered at moment!!!!

The DPF was an issue with the PD engine but agin not so with the CR since the CR engine was designed to work with a DPF while the PD engine was not.

The diesel will still be harsher on the front tyres as it's a heavier engine, but I suspect the difference is less than on the PD engines vs the petrol...

I don't get anywhere near 45mpg round town though, more like high 30s for me, but there again, I have a DSG and a right foot that appears to be extremely heavy

You forgot to mention the insurance group is lower on the diesel too... When I got mine the diesel was group 14 and the petrol was group 15, I'm assuming that on the new scale (up to 50 instead of 20) the diesel will still be in a lower group than the petrol...

Not many of them on the Autotrader but just as an example:

Year:2007

SKODA OCTAVIA 2.0 TDI PD 170 VRS 5dr Diesel Estate

Mileage: 36,000

£10,500

I'll admit I would quite happily not buy brand new but there is very litle currently available at the 6 months mark.

DSG would be preferred as I can spend quite a bit of time queueing to get through the Tyne Tunnel twice a day

Diesel as it gets better mpg, easier to sell on etc

Fair enough I could go hatchback or estate without too much issue

Xeons yeah I could take it or leave it but again come resale it'll probably **** quicker with

Leather seats are not for me, I've had a few and it's too cold in the winter and gives you a sweaty back in the summer

Well, you are better of getting leather if you are slim. Otherwise, the seat is killing your back in summer. Sweaty back is better than painful back! Also you should only put on one layer of cloth to test drive the car with sport seats to see if your back is ok before buying. If your are slim, your bones are very close to the hard plastic frame of the sport seat!

Edited 14 July, 201015 yr by Bobfido

I am buying the diesel hatch, no stereo upgrade , rear sensors , Black magic pearl paint. £17k. I have a garmin sat nav and will put "sticky" plate mount ( for attatching sat nav mount to) on under side of lid of dash top storage box (therefore no marks on window). Maxidot is a good upgrade but not absolutely necessary. All the others are really "toys" and not absolutely necesary in my humble opinion.

Edited 14 July, 201015 yr by BillyT1903

Well, you are better of getting leather if you are slim. Otherwise, the seat is killing your back in summer. Sweaty back is better than painful back! Also you should only put on one layer of cloth to test drive the car with sport seats to see if your back is ok before buying. If your are slim, your bones are very close to the hard plastic frame of the sport seat!

I'm 5'11" and 11 1/2 stone so class myself as slim and in the 6 months and 14000 miles I've owned my vRS with the standard seats have not had any issues with comfort... The only seats I've had in a car that have been better were the ones in my Saab 9-3 and the vRS runs that very close in my opinion

So just phoned Silbury Skoda to get the low down, nothing in stock near him.

So I asked what the delivery times would be on a brand new model

vRS CR DSG Estate - approx 4 months :'(

now there's no way I can wait that long, ar$e!

4 months will go quick enough and a new VRS is worth the wait.

Edited 15 July, 201015 yr by PSM

So just phoned Silbury Skoda to get the low down, nothing in stock near him.

So I asked what the delivery times would be on a brand new model

vRS CR DSG Estate - approx 4 months :'(

now there's no way I can wait that long, ar$e!

Try the dealers in Darlington they had a race tdi with rear sensors and spare wheel in the show room. Sorry dont know name but is on dealer list on forum

4 months will go quick enough and a new VRS is worth the wait.

Not when I don't have a car (sold on Saturday)and am biking to work.

Plus need it for the trip to the Lakes in August.

You talking about Derek Slacks in Middlesborough I think?

It will be MSB Skoda.

Not when I don't have a car (sold on Saturday)and am biking to work.

Plus need it for the trip to the Lakes in August.

You talking about Derek Slacks in Middlesborough I think?

May have sold your car a little prematurely then. Even at the shortest time a new car will take at least 6 weeks to be delivered so looks like you would always have had to go secondhand or ex demo/prereg.