has anybody got any good tips or advice for driving down steep hills on ice and snow??

had a bit of a moment last night going down a steep country lane.

at the top i selected 1st gear and set off really slowly with no gas,

as the hill got steeper all four wheels lost traction, locked, and the engine stalled.

i was now gathering speed quite quickly towards an abandoned car half way down and a narrow gap to get through!!!

as all four wheels were locked anyway i knew braking was useless so dipped the clutch to get the wheels turning to restore steering.

just managed to get through the gap.

it got me thinking... did i do the right thing?

your thoughts would be appreciated.

thanx in advance chaps

has anybody got any good tips or advice for driving down steep hills on ice and snow??

had a bit of a moment last night going down a steep country lane.

at the top i selected 1st gear and set off really slowly with no gas,

as the hill got steeper all four wheels lost traction, locked, and the engine stalled.

i was now gathering speed quite quickly towards an abandoned car half way down and a narrow gap to get through!!!

as all four wheels were locked anyway i knew braking was useless so dipped the clutch to get the wheels turning to restore steering.

just managed to get through the gap.

it got me thinking... did i do the right thing?

your thoughts would be appreciated.

thanx in advance chaps

Hi Clive

I cannot see how the wheels locked unless you touched the brakes !

I have been driving 4x4's for 30 years and never had a engine stall when doing as you said, and certainly never lost traction,

Radiotwo

has anybody got any good tips or advice for driving down steep hills on ice and snow??

had a bit of a moment last night going down a steep country lane.

at the top i selected 1st gear and set off really slowly with no gas,

as the hill got steeper all four wheels lost traction, locked, and the engine stalled.

i was now gathering speed quite quickly towards an abandoned car half way down and a narrow gap to get through!!!

as all four wheels were locked anyway i knew braking was useless so dipped the clutch to get the wheels turning to restore steering.

just managed to get through the gap.

it got me thinking... did i do the right thing?

your thoughts would be appreciated.

thanx in advance chaps

Yes, stopping at the top of the hill and then letting the car take you down in 1st gear was a good thing to do, pressing the clutch to get the wheels turning again was also a good thing to do, it sounds like you stayed calm and did the right things to me as you avoided an accident doing so. Why did the engine stall though, surely your car has the anti-stall devices on it? Did you have the brakes on? If you have an off road button then I would have pressed that and headed for any fresh snow that might have been on the side of the road as that would have increased the grip of your tyres. Try and let the engine do the braking for you and keep your feet off the pedals when decending a slippery, steep hill in a low gear, that is one of the first rules in off road driving and works equally well in poor conditions on the road.

Ian

Did a similar thing with my previous Yeti, but on that occasion the rear end overtook the front; becoming a rearwards travelling toboggan. No cars to hit but across a shallow bank there's a steep drop through trees into the valley below

Became very interested in all things winter tyres after that :yes: particularly as the high speed wide sports tyres fitted to the 17" wheel as standard, are the worst offenders for lack of grip in cold weather.

Regards,

TP

You shouldn't use the brake pedal going down steep hills on poor traction surfaces. Select a first gear and use engine braking as much as possible, if you start mashing the brake pedal all your wheel will loose grip. If you've got offroad mode use that as it will brake wheels individually, if you think you are going to hit something try and steer around it without touching the brakes. If all else fails and you're going to hit something take your hands and feet away from the controls otherwise you'll end up with broken wrists or ankles!

If you've got bad snow let your tyre pressures down to 20psi or so, you'll be suprised just how much of a difference it makes.

Clive,

first instruction we give all our trainees is; if possible DON'T!! Find another route. Obviously that isn't always practical so:

stop at top of hill and assess ANY possible danger.

select first gear and any electrical or mechanical aids available. In Yeti terms OFF ROAD button ON.

let the car slowly find it's own pace. If it does try to "run away" DO NOT touch the brakes, doing that puts you under the control of gravity, and that is unbeatable. If very brave one trick is too actually very gently accelerate. It is frightening but it can work. Also try and head for soft snow, that has a dragging effect and actually often allows more control.

I'm still trying to work out why your car stalled, but by dipping the clutch this did let the wheels turn again.

has anybody got any good tips or advice for driving down steep hills on ice and snow??

had a bit of a moment last night going down a steep country lane.

at the top i selected 1st gear and set off really slowly with no gas,

as the hill got steeper all four wheels lost traction, locked, and the engine stalled.

i was now gathering speed quite quickly towards an abandoned car half way down and a narrow gap to get through!!!

as all four wheels were locked anyway i knew braking was useless so dipped the clutch to get the wheels turning to restore steering.

just managed to get through the gap.

it got me thinking... did i do the right thing?

your thoughts would be appreciated.

thanx in advance chaps

Two suggestions:

1. If you have the Off-Road button, stop at the top and leave the car in neutral and let the electronics control you speed. All you need to do is steer.

2. If no Off-road button, 1st gear and no pushing on the accelerator, just steer.

If neither of those work, then there is not enough traction to control the descent, and you need winter tyres (if you do not have already) - or find another way to get where you need to go.

Traction between the tyres and the road are the real limit - if there is not enough of it, there is NOTHING you can do, nor does all the electronic wizardry help you at all.

If I would come upon an icy road with water on top, I would not attempt the descent - and my little Snehvide is as well equipped as any. That is unless there is a nice wide verge on the side with no hedges or ditches, in which case that would be a better way down.

Clive,

first instruction we give all our trainees is; if possible DON'T!! Find another route.

d'you know, forum Yeti is just the best there is, I believe. Not many spats and loads of great advice. Thanks.

the quote above is just what i did just now - i went to peek at the 1-in-5 hill - sheet ice. Assessed it out of the Yeti, and came home again.

So - I didn't!! Came home to watch the hungry Birdies

IMG_3509 by george.m.cooper, on Flickr

url=http://www.flickr.com/photos/16259839@N04/5274114662/][/url]

IMG_3510 by george.m.cooper, on Flickr

When I spun Pat she was in 1st. gear off-road engaged and in hill decent, back end came round very quickly which appeared to stall the engine almost instantly. Came to a halt after sliding into the bank opposite the drop through trees thankfully.

Most thing was a Tiguan had gone down the same hill 5 minutes before without issue :wonder: what tyres they were running.

TP

I just had a situation through my own inappropriate driving and the off road engaged just sorted it it was amazing.

Heading down a hill and stupidly I braked so four wheel lock up, then I just took my foot of the brake and nudge the gear lever to neutral and the electronics took over but it was simply stunning what the Yeti can do, no more skidding and in control of the car again all safe.

So my advice would be if you have the off road button is give it a try in a safeish location, it's amazing how the electronics control the descent and that the accelerator when in neutral releases the brakes a little to increase speed if need be

The only note I would add is once the desent levels off it turns it self out of that mode and its full speed ahead

has anybody got any good tips or advice for driving down steep hills on ice and snow??

had a bit of a moment last night going down a steep country lane.

at the top i selected 1st gear and set off really slowly with no gas,

as the hill got steeper all four wheels lost traction, locked, and the engine stalled.

i was now gathering speed quite quickly towards an abandoned car half way down and a narrow gap to get through!!!

as all four wheels were locked anyway i knew braking was useless so dipped the clutch to get the wheels turning to restore steering.

just managed to get through the gap.

it got me thinking... did i do the right thing?

your thoughts would be appreciated.

thanx in advance chaps

I'm very interested to hear the engine stalled Clive.

Up till now, I've been amazed by my Yeti's capabilities in snow on standard road tyres - feeling quite smug actually.

But, yesterday, my SM did exactly the same thing on hard packed snow on a level road. With Off Road button engaged, I was proceeding gently on a slight trailing throttle in 3rd gear at around 15mph approaching a slight RH corner 50m beyond which I knew I was going to have to stop at a T junction.

A Corsa came round the corner on my side of the road, so I instinctively took my foot completely off accelerator at which point Yeti went into a four wheel slide and the engine cut out. I had not at that point touched the brakes, but I got the impression that the car was being pulled in towards the kerb. It all happened so quickly, I dipped the clutch but still clobbered the kerb with both nearside wheels at the same time, quite hard. Fortunately I missed the Corsa, which after mountingd the kerb behind me, drove off.

I now have two quite badly scuffed alloys and I am at a total loss to know why the engine cut. I consider myself reasonably competent at handling a vehicle on and off road, in most conditions, though I have never had a car with so many electronic "aids" before. I'm pretty certain that without TCS, ABS etc, I could have avoided the kerb, so I'm very disappointed and not a little annoyed by what happened. I feel that control of the situation was taken out of my hands and the car just did its own thing!

I realise that ABS etc only activates if one or more wheels are revolving at a different speed from the others. Clearly, if all wheels are locked, or all skidding at the same rate, ABS will offer no benefit at all.

Today, on a totally empty road, only a very slight crown on the road, same hard packed snow and nothing around to hit this time, I tried replicating the conditions, with and without the Off Road button selected. Nothing I did caused the engine to stall, but if I braked hard enough to activate ABS, the car did pull the rear in toward the nearside kerb every time, effectively causing oversteer to the left. Straddling the crown of the road still produces the same oversteer to the left. Driving on the "wrong" side of the road, produced oversteer to the right. I can only conclude that there’s too much brake bias to the rear of the car, effectively causing the rear wheels to lock first on snow. I wonder if this explains TP's experience too?

Of course if Yeti's winter boots had arrived and were not still stuck in some parcel depot somewhere, all this may not have happened in the first place.

Needless to say, I'm not a happy Skoda driver at the moment!

:'(

Edited 19 December, 201015 yr by speedsport

I dare not give advice 'cos I have spent the day driving up hill and down dale on ice and thick snow on (dare I say it) Summer Tyres. No problem.

The best bit was in Criccieth on the steep hill from the Lifeboat House to the famous Ice cream shop (those who know Criccieth will know the hill I mean). I was parked at the bottom and, as I was about to set off, a van passed and tried to climb the hill. It got about 2 mtrs. above me when it slid gracefully back. Saying a quick prayer to the Gods of Yeti, I set off and .........well you know the rest!! I did feel sorry for the van driver as I turned the corner at the top of the hill.

Seriously is there nothing this Yeti cannot do? With care it handled our back roads and gave no cause for concern. These have a covering of snow polished to a good shine by passing traffic and are now frozen solid. I use the Off-Road button and the Downhill Descent system. I stop at the top of the steeper hills and then let the electronics control the speed and braking.

Edited 19 December, 201015 yr by Terfyn

When I spun Pat she was in 1st. gear off-road engaged and in hill decent, back end came round very quickly which appeared to stall the engine almost instantly. Came to a halt after sliding into the bank opposite the drop through trees thankfully.

Most thing was a Tiguan had gone down the same hill 5 minutes before without issue :wonder: what tyres they were running.TP

Tyres are everything. Today I took out a secondhand Tiguan Sport on Goodyear F1s. It was snowing, and had been for a few hours. Taking a roundabout at quite a low speed resulted in hideous understeer and the only way to control it was to back off the power completely. My Fabia, fitted with winter tyres, felt far more secure taking the same roundabout in the same conditions half an hour later. Then we tried a Yeti 4x4 Elegance 140 on winter tyres. It was hugely impressive.

As an aside, the Yeti Elegance undercuts a Tiguan Match by about £2k (both with the 140bhp diesel engine) and yet is far better specced, at least as practical and spacious, and more imaginatively styled.

I reckon you mostly did the right thing. Don't know how it stalled though. About the only other thing to do when it loses traction is as someone else said, get the wheels turning to regain grip, though having the presence of mind to restart the engine and accellerate would be tricky :-)

do you know what?

this forum is bloody amazing!

thanx a million for all your replies and advice.

to answer the question why it stalled...

no off road button and summer tyres fitted.

I'm very interested to hear the engine stalled Clive.

"so I instinctively took my foot completely off accelerator at which point Yeti went into a four wheel slide and the engine cut out. I had not at that point touched the brakes"

that's exactly the situation i found myself in. i had set off with very little gas at just over tickover and was doing very nicely then i suspect i instictively did the same??

i wasn't touching the brakes and was trying to steer towards a grass bank away from the car.

it was only when i dipped the clutch and the wheels were turning that i got any steering response.

i did think about trying to restart the engine but it was dark and that involves turning the ignition off and therefore the lights.

i know they say " what you cannot see cannot hurt you" but i ain't that brave :(

i had stopped at the top and assessed it as a reasonable descent just like many i had achieved, with ease, earlier in the day but the abandoned car was much further down around a slight corner, unlit.

in hindsight i suppose i should have walked the whole hill to check 100% next time i will.

anyway, after reading all your comments and suggestions i will be better equipped if it happens again.

you are never too old to stop learning, afterall.

thanx again chaps

I was wondering whether the engine might have stalled because the Downhill Drive Support was applying the brakes - but you say you don't have an off-road button so that would rule that out. (I'd expect the electronics to be smart enough to avoid that happening anyway, TBH. Also, I'm not sure what countryboy means by "the anti-stall devices" - although I suppose DSG would fulfil that function, if you had it, which you don't.)

One thing I would say is that if your engine stalls while you are in gear then all four wheels are going to lock anyway, even if you aren't braking - until you depress the clutch they'll be directly connected to the engine, which isn't going round any more, so neither will they. Maybe it was the engine starting to stall which precipitated the loss of traction? Still doesn't answer the question as to why the stall occurred in the first place, though. But in answer to your original question: yes, you did the right thing in dipping the clutch to regain control of your vehicle. If only a few more people had exercised such presence of mind these last few days...

And finally: I am in a similar position to speedsport, except in my case just one of my winter tyres is stuck in the courier's depot. The other three were delivered last week, but aren't much use without the missing fourth

I'm glad you were ok Clive, no matter what kind of car you have an icy hill can be extremly dangerous.

After being out for an hour with the dogs this morning I eventually persuaded them to get back in the snow monsters boot, and thought I would give the 225/50/17 Falken Eurowinters a little workout in this very rural and empty car park with about 5 or so inches of snow.

After pushing the car harder and harder to see if the tyres would lose there grip (they didn't) and taking turns at full lock in 2nd gear the car stalled? Which reminded me of this thread. No idea what caused it, but there you go!

Stalled engine, now I think of it clearly:

Downhill, in 1st gear, brakes applied to lock-up all four. Of course the engine will have to stall. What else can it do? It would do the same on dry McAdam surface.

Downhill, in 1st gear, brakes applied to lock-up all four. Of course the engine will have to stall.

Except that the OP is adamant that he didn't touch the brakes. Which is why I wondered whether the Downhill Drive Control might have been involved - but he has no Off-Road button. He even says that the hill was getting steeper when the incident occurred - which would tend to help the engine keep going on the over-run.

Maybe it happened this way: the road was so slippery that the skid started spontaneously when the hill steepened. That in turn stopped any rotational input to the wheels from the hill, so the engine stalled - the OP did say he wasn't giving it any gas. The stalled engine in turn meant that the wheels not only skidded but actually locked, until the clutch was depressed.

By the way, I agree with those who say that re-starting the engine in such circumstances is not something you can do quickly, because you have to turn the ignition fully off first. I hinted on another thread that I managed to stall mine a few times when I had it new. When you're half way out in to a junction with a dead engine, you really just want the thing to come back to life again ASAP! Why does it insist on being put fully to sleep first?

Quote Ejstubbs

Maybe it happened this way: the road was so slippery that the skid started spontaneously when the hill steepened. That in turn stopped any rotational input to the wheels from the hill, so the engine stalled - the OP did say he wasn't giving it any gas. The stalled engine in turn meant that the wheels not only skidded but actually locked, until the clutch was depressed.

probably the most likely cause if my memory serves.

if i had the off road button and used it, as i understand it the car would be in neutral for a steep descent so no stalling possible?

in answer to your stalling statment, that's one trick the new mini eco has up it's sleeve.

if you stall just press the clutch, in gear, and the engine restarts automatically.

no key turning required.

probably the most likely cause if my memory serves.

if i had the off road button and used it, as i understand it the car would be in neutral for a steep descent so no stalling possible?

You can use the Downhill Descent control with either the engine in neutral or in gear. I normally engage first. The accelerator pedal will control the speed either way.

Edited 20 December, 201015 yr by Terfyn

ll i took the plunge and have just driven down the same hill tonight.

the road looked almost exactly the same as the council had coned it off for the last few days as that car was still there.

taking all your ideas on board harry went down it with absolutely no drama at all this time, and perfectly under my control.

I had to take a back route to work on Monday and that was pretty much 13 miles of untreated rural roads. This thread was great for giving me a little extra knowledge and confidence so thank you everyone who gave advice.

It was the first time I really appreciated the slow descent gizmo and it was superb. I have used it before but it was just for play then. This time it was genuinely needed and it really worked well.

I had a stall situation the same on Saturday.

Going down a hill towards the Arsenal Emeratties stadium, there was a car trying to come uphill, but just spinning.

I was in 1st gear about 10 mph, and went to stop my Yeti using the brakes.

It stalled as the wheels locked up, but I depressed the clutch, and restarted the engine quickly.

The Yeti was excellent in snow, the only blemish was early in the journey, when I was 'cocky' in doing a turn, and slid the car into a parking sign, it was all my fault, and the only damage was to the light grey front bumper area, a small crack. Still pushed over the pole and a street name sign.

One thing I noticed yesterday whilst sliding down a very steep hill with hill decent on and all four wheels lost traction was that if you accelerate the car sorts itself out and slows down again. I was in first gear and on summer tyres but the hill was starting to thaw so very slushy which I find the most slippy of conditions. I had already been up and down this hill several times with no problems in the last few days.

It is a case of holding your nerve.