down your favorite road.... I'm struggling a bit to be honest!

I don't know what it is, I can't seem to get a smooth rythm, I can't seem to get the best out of it like I could the fiat....

for those who know me on some of the "brisk" meets , I could really wring the fiats neck, and keep up, or out drive some much faster machinery, now I have a really quick car, i think I'm struggling to get the best from it... (Its not my general skills I'm an advanced driver, a DSA ADI, and certified to drive blue lights ect)

I have mastered the gearbox, that is not an issue.. maybe its because I am approaching corners at a quicker speed than I would normally be? Maybe its because, its so easy to be in 3 figure speeds on a normal A, or indeed B road, that I intentially slow down, for fear of simply going too fast, maybe its because i recently had a big accident in a work vehical (not nice, don't want to go into details, but it wasn't my fault...) and I'm being more causious than I normally would, due to other people trying to kill you... I DON'T KNOW!

It just seems I can't have the same fun, and satisfaction down my favorite roads, that I had in the fiat

it seems I can give it a blast, start to enjoy it, then slow down thinking "pah..." unlike, for example, when me and CrisRS were at a civic meet in the lakes, and left the type R's for dead (me exploding a brake pad in the process!) and I simply couldn't stop smiling at the fun you can have in a decent hot hatch down your favorite roads ect ect....

maybe its phychology sessions I need! lol...

don't get me wrong, its a good car, and very quick accross country, but I just don't seem to be smiling as much, don't seem to be able to enjoy it as much, I seem to want to drive it gently, not wring its neck (was the other way round in the fiat!)

ideas? :S

Maybe it's a sign of you slowing down naturally (my Dad doesn't seem to go fast any more and he's 58) due to age, or it could be that your being alot more cautious when your trying to have some fun due to the nature of your job.

A drive in a slower or less powerful car could also solve the issue.

Edited 8 March, 201115 yr by chrisw880

maybe its phychology sessions I need! lol...

...or some track time? Not your favourite road I know, but could be a good opportunity to exploit the "full" potential...?

Maybe it's a sign of you slowing down naturally (my Dad doesn't seem to go fast any more and he's 58) due to age, or it could be that your being alot more cautious when your trying to have some fun due to the nature of your job.

A drive in a slower or less powerful car could also solve the issue.

thats what I was thinking, you know how well I can drive quick Chris, but maybe the vRS II is just a bit too fast for a proper blast on a country road (slowing down due to age?! :wonder: look at Tiff!) maybe a blast on a 106 rally or something.... (and you are right, I've seen enough car accidents now, that I ALWAYS think of the possible consequenses.....)

...or some track time? Not your favourite road I know, but could be a good opportunity to exploit the "full" potential...?

indeed, as said above, maybe its just a bit took quick to use to full potential on the public road...

hhmmmm all good suggestions...

Edited 8 March, 201115 yr by sharkrider

I've always found that the newer the car, the less involving the drive.

I have the most fun in my mk2 polo saloon with twin carbs.

It's certainly not fast by today's standards. The handling's not exactly great either, but it's a helluva lot more entertaining than our Mk1 Octavia VRS.

Wringing a slower car's neck on a twisty B road I think has to be more enjoyable than driving a fast modern car on the same road - purely because the limits on the faster car are higher - and much more likely to result in your untimely death as a result of the speeds you're carrying...

Very interesting topic. Maybe putting a lesser powered but still nicely handling car like the Panda 100 to it's limits is kinda like you having complete control over the car, you "own" the car. The Fabia is so much quicker and the DSG box is so slick that it still feels like the car "owns" you. Even when thrashing a country road the Fabia is fast enough to be very quick indeed, so you will always be driving it at far beyond 100% of its potential, if you are a safe and responsible public highway user anyway.

I honestly don't think I'd want to drive anything with much over 200bhp, as with the state of the roads, traffic and obviously rules of the road there is absolutely no point in all the power.

An example, I personally find giving my mum's 107 some stick more enjoyable as it's more involving, but the fun keeps to relatively safe speeds. My mk1 Fabia is capable of much, much faster speeds but the fact I don't really feel safe (and break road rules) giving it some stick makes it less involving. A small exception was some of my jaunts up to Scotland where I felt much safer stretching the VRS's legs due to the lack of traffic and excellent roads.

how long had you woned you fiat? The more you drive the fabia, the more confident in its abilities you will become.

I could throw my octavia through bends at speeds i wouldnt have dared when i first bought it. But you learn its limits and handling traits over time. Also theres always going to be a reluctance to go to fast with a new car for fear of wrapping it in.

Once its a bit older you dont care lol

Very interesting topic. Maybe putting a lesser powered but still nicely handling car like the Panda 100 to it's limits is kinda like you having complete control over the car, you "own" the car. The Fabia is so much quicker and the DSG box is so slick that it still feels like the car "owns" you. Even when thrashing a country road the Fabia is fast enough to be very quick indeed, so you will always be driving it at far beyond 100% of its potential, if you are a safe and responsible public highway user anyway.

I honestly don't think I'd want to drive anything with much over 200bhp, as with the state of the roads, traffic and obviously rules of the road there is absolutely no point in all the power.

I have driven a panda 100HP in anger down some of my favorite roads, and thoroughly enjoyed it, wringing its neck, bouncing off the rev limiter at 7k (and bouncing round the corners! interesting suspension set up!) closest car to the old 106 rally it think today maybe the vRS is just too quick for me to feel comfortable in on the public roads...

how long had you woned you fiat? The more you drive the fabia, the more confident in its abilities you will become.

I could throw my octavia through bends at speeds i wouldnt have dared when i first bought it. But you learn its limits and handling traits over time. Also theres always going to be a reluctance to go to fast with a new car for fear of wrapping it in.

Once its a bit older you dont care lol

I bought the fiat new, mapped it at 4k had it until 107k at 4 years old. so yes, what you are saying does hold some weight, but I can get in a car and drive it fast quite early, I drive many different vehicals at work, we use octavias as fast responce vehicals (although all the weight in the back ruins the handling.....) and I have now covered 2400 miles in the vRS....

all good points though....

has anyone else felt the same as me?

Dave...I know exactly what you mean.

We are BOTH diesel drivers

The torque makes you believe youre faster when, in fact, youre not

you are a good driver and know your limits in the Fiat

You will get used to the Fabia and adjust accordingly..Then youll get faster

My theory anyway

Sharkrider, the only answer is to sell the Vrs and buy a Fiat :yes:

ideas? :S

Because it's too refined?

I certainly went out looking for an old VRS to modify for exactly that reason.

Could have got a new one, an S3 etc...

Didn't like the driving. Great and capable, but not as much raw fun.

Too refined. You need something to grab by the scruff of the neck and have a good laugh. Thrash it a bit to get the best out of it.

Not something refined, comfortable and polished. It just doesn't feel the same to me.

Did the Fiat "feel" faster, or is the fabia simply faster so you find you are doing a lot more "go" and therefore a lot more "stop" which is perhaps detracting from the feeling of just keeping a reasonable speed on nice roads?

Maybe the tyres on the fiat were real good, and the vRS could benefit from some tyre upgrades?

I know I have slowed down a bit generally. I see most road situations as just "go" and keep up with traffic, conserving fuel etc. But show me a clean, decent road and I will not be afraid to use full power and induce some serious :D . I wouldn't be sorting yet another Castle Combe session, and planning further track work if I'd lost faith in the mongrel, or had somehow "slowed down" in nature. I also think me beginning to train for RoSPA has had an impact on my mental viewpoint to driving.

it seems I can give it a blast, start to enjoy it, then slow down thinking "pah..." unlike, for example, when me and CrisRS were at a civic meet in the lakes, and left the type R's for dead (me exploding a brake pad in the process!) and I simply couldn't stop smiling at the fun you can have in a decent hot hatch down your favorite roads ect ect....

Aaahhh sharkrider what a great day we had out in the lakes that day your fiat looked very tasty! I was in one of the black type rs that day. Hope to go back up there this summer. Anyway I'm sure it will just happen for you soon.

There WILL be another Lakes Meet but probably only for Skodas this time

Sharkrider, I know where you are coming from. And...it's pretty much the same for all of us. I firmly believe it's an age thing more than anything. In my younger days before training as a tech (I'm not old now inspite of my 'old git' description) I too was DOTADI (as opposed to DSA) and did my stint at Hendon with blue lights, I managed the BSM expert drivers course, and the IAM and ADI training for various regions too. John Lyons, Prince Charles driving instructor and co-owner of a high performance driving business based at Brands at the time, trained me in high performance driving in a range of exotic cars on and off road. I loved it, we had many track days. I was a very fast driver (but legal) on or off the track. But as time goes by no matter what the car or how good it is, you start to easy up a bit. with age. Don't forget you've been there and done that, you are not afraid to go fast or enjoy the drive but somehow there isn't quite that urgency anymore. My colleagues who had similar training to me also told me the same thing some time ago. We all still enjoy driving but we have all slowed a bit no matter what car we drive. It maybe a self preservation gene kicks in. I don't know for sure. Mind you, I make up for it by riding very large motorcycles...0-62mph in 2.57 seconds on my GSX1400!! She goes 0-100mph and stops...in 10.7secs. Now that thrills me still!!!

I personally think that some of it is down to the DSG gearbox, its a fantastic piece of kit but no matter how you look at it, it does detract from the amount of driver involvement. With it largely chaging the gears most of the time all you have to do is go, stop and steer. Its definitely not as involved.

I'm happy the vRS has a DSG gearbox as this time round we were after an auto anyway but it makes me wonder how much better a car it would be with a nice actioned (and close ratio) 6 speed manual. Think they'd probably sell more of them too if it came as a manual and DSG was an option.

I've just read right through this, and I slowed down for a bit after being involved in a big shunt (after the shunt I bought a faster car, and have since bought an even faster one).

As a rule though, I don't really rag cars anyway; I try to make progress fast and safely (considering the conditions, weather, traffic, road layout, surface, sightlines...)

Have you just bought a sports bike?

I used to own a Lotus Elise and after the thrill of a Yamaha R6 found myself plodding about in the Elise, most bizarre.

Could be mellowing with age as others have suggested.

Or the overcrowded roads with a growing majority of selfish drivers which leave me grumpy/disheartened on many a commute.

A number of reviews I've seen of the vRS talk about it being less engaging than some of it's peers. They say the same about the Audi A1 in comparison to the Mini.

The engine note isn't as obvious apparently and the suspension to me seemed very capable but as it's soft and you're not fighting the steering it does leave you feeling driven rather than driving.

Maybe it's because it's a new car with a lot of fancy gadgets, and subconsciously you don't want to damage it or break it.

When I had my Octy mk 1 I used to make it sing round the bends and be driving on the ragged edge 60 % of the time with a big grin. I went to a 6 MPS from that and although it was a faster car it just wasn't as involving to drive so I didn't really test it's limits. I too thought "pah..." eventually getting rid. Maybe, dare I say it, the Fabia isn't as sweet a drive as the Fiat?

I've definitely slowed down since the Octy days. With the Beemer, I can be at half power and already be too fast for the conditions, so it hardly ever gets to be driven on the ragged edge. It's such an involving car to drive that I get more thrills at Lower speeds now and enjoy it twice as much if that makes sense.

With the Beemer, I can be at half power and already be too fast for the conditions, so it hardly ever gets to be driven on the ragged edge. It's such an involving car to drive that I get more thrills at Lower speeds now and enjoy it twice as much if that makes sense.

My dad used to have a 135i M Sport auto and that thing was mentally quick, fantastic engine the twin turbo straight six!

Thanks for the replys everyone! all good stuff, nice to have a thread that provokes thought

it seems I can give it a blast, start to enjoy it, then slow down thinking "pah..." unlike, for example, when me and CrisRS were at a civic meet in the lakes, and left the type R's for dead (me exploding a brake pad in the process!) and I simply couldn't stop smiling at the fun you can have in a decent hot hatch down your favorite roads ect ect....

Aaahhh sharkrider what a great day we had out in the lakes that day your fiat looked very tasty! I was in one of the black type rs that day. Hope to go back up there this summer. Anyway I'm sure it will just happen for you soon.

Nice one! It was a good day, send me a PM on how you find the vRS compaired to the Honda :yes:

Sharkrider, I know where you are coming from. And...it's pretty much the same for all of us. I firmly believe it's an age thing more than anything. In my younger days before training as a tech (I'm not old now inspite of my 'old git' description) I too was DOTADI (as opposed to DSA) and did my stint at Hendon with blue lights, I managed the BSM expert drivers course, and the IAM and ADI training for various regions too. John Lyons, Prince Charles driving instructor and co-owner of a high performance driving business based at Brands at the time, trained me in high performance driving in a range of exotic cars on and off road. I loved it, we had many track days. I was a very fast driver (but legal) on or off the track. But as time goes by no matter what the car or how good it is, you start to easy up a bit. with age. Don't forget you've been there and done that, you are not afraid to go fast or enjoy the drive but somehow there isn't quite that urgency anymore. My colleagues who had similar training to me also told me the same thing some time ago. We all still enjoy driving but we have all slowed a bit no matter what car we drive. It maybe a self preservation gene kicks in. I don't know for sure. Mind you, I make up for it by riding very large motorcycles...0-62mph in 2.57 seconds on my GSX1400!! She goes 0-100mph and stops...in 10.7secs. Now that thrills me still!!!

Wow... I could actually have written that! yeah, I think you may have hit the nail on the head maybe you should pick my lottery numbers for me?

I've just read right through this, and I slowed down for a bit after being involved in a big shunt (after the shunt I bought a faster car, and have since bought an even faster one).

As a rule though, I don't really rag cars anyway; I try to make progress fast and safely (considering the conditions, weather, traffic, road layout, surface, sightlines...)

indeed, the big shunt, it does make a difference, over the last few days, I have been assuming that every idiot I see will drive into me and not stop, (and every blind junction, something I can't see will appear at high speeds and hit me! :( may take me a little while to get over that....

anyway, I'm gonna go out for another blast now, over a couple of mountains in the rain, lets see how we go

Interesting observations.

I find that the biggest problem with the VRS is the DSG box...which I confess has grown on me...although I'd swap it for a manual anyday. The main problem is that with 7 gears (especialy in auto mode) it's hard to know what speed you're doing without looking at the speedo. I quite often find myself going either below or above the speed limit and this can be a little un-nerving when you start to press on as the box/car hides it's cross country pace quite well.

To contrast this my VX220 always feels quick...even when I'm going fairly slowly & I know what speed I'm doing by what gear I'm in & how she sounds. I love the rawness of the car & it's one of the reasons I didn't go for a VX220 turbo when I bought her back in 2003.

To enjoy the VRS more whilst pressing on you could try dropping the windows an inch...it'll bring you into the action a bit more & give you more of a sense of the speed.

I have to say these days maxing a car with the speed potential of the VRS leads you into a problem of being far above the speed limit.

Which if you've also had a crash will play on your mind even subcontiously. I noticed it after my accidents and they were relativly low speed impacts.

I know exactly what the OP means! Its really weird but the car just seems to have this mega-calming influence on me, I've never driven so slow!! :yes:

Agree it could be the fact its brand-new but I've had new cars before and not felt this way. Think it must be down to the DSG box, just doesn't feel right ragging it somehow...

Having said all this I'm still absolutely loving the car

down your favorite road.... I'm struggling a bit to be honest!

I don't know what it is, I can't seem to get a smooth rythm, I can't seem to get the best out of it like I could the fiat....

for those who know me on some of the "brisk" meets , I could really wring the fiats neck, and keep up, or out drive some much faster machinery, now I have a really quick car, i think I'm struggling to get the best from it... (Its not my general skills I'm an advanced driver, a DSA ADI, and certified to drive blue lights ect)

I have mastered the gearbox, that is not an issue.. maybe its because I am approaching corners at a quicker speed than I would normally be? Maybe its because, its so easy to be in 3 figure speeds on a normal A, or indeed B road, that I intentially slow down, for fear of simply going too fast, maybe its because i recently had a big accident in a work vehical (not nice, don't want to go into details, but it wasn't my fault...) and I'm being more causious than I normally would, due to other people trying to kill you... I DON'T KNOW!

It just seems I can't have the same fun, and satisfaction down my favorite roads, that I had in the fiat

it seems I can give it a blast, start to enjoy it, then slow down thinking "pah..." unlike, for example, when me and CrisRS were at a civic meet in the lakes, and left the type R's for dead (me exploding a brake pad in the process!) and I simply couldn't stop smiling at the fun you can have in a decent hot hatch down your favorite roads ect ect....

maybe its phychology sessions I need! lol...

don't get me wrong, its a good car, and very quick accross country, but I just don't seem to be smiling as much, don't seem to be able to enjoy it as much, I seem to want to drive it gently, not wring its neck (was the other way round in the fiat!)

ideas? :S

1- your geting old, reaaaaaallly old lol

2- you dont feel like your going as quick but your really going quicker than in the fiat, the fabia is probaly alot more comfortable at speed so not sounding like its working very hard, i found this when i got mine

and 3- it cost you lots and lots of money so your afraid to bin it, as any man would