NCT (MOT) very high emissions. Test failure

[Grainne O']

OK, on second inpsection and googling the VW forums, it might be a different pipe - the big one looks fairly new so it must have been changed when the MAF was done, and the guy must have broken the little one in the process and fixed it the irish way

It doesn't seem to have a fixed name :| Crankcase pipe, oil breather pipe, crankcase breather pipe..? can't find a part online either but then I am in a rush to work

For now I used the very last of my leak tape to seal it a little bit (there's a tiny bit of oil around it so it probably isn't perfectly tight) while waiting for a potential replacement

Thanks again chicken, I appreciate the help

[chicken_eyebrow]

I found a pic of the same engine on google last night in a Seat Leon and looks exactly the same as yours so I think your setup is normal:

Only thing is if it's been bodged in the past it might be split or leaking. If you can't get the exact part from a dealer by giving them your reg number then I suppose any piece of oil-resistant silicon piping of the right diameter will do, and secure it with a couple of jubilee clips.

[Grainne O']

Reg number queries always send me to the wrong parts (the AEE engine ones which is built completely different). But yeah, that's exactly it, and that's the same engine. It's already a handmade thing, and it looks like it's not tight enough. (I hope anyway because I don't need to test the emissions to know the problem isn't fixed, and the last time but one she did throw an air inlet fault too, the 0533 one)

There's a bit of oil around it, though not an actual leak, and there's a lot of moisture in my oil.

Looks like this set up is close to the vRS one though, I might make a new thread called "name that pipe?" That and I might know the diameter required for the pipe. The current bit of rubber isn't the right diameter for sure.

Tell me this...*if* there was an air leak in there, would that induce also some sort of loss of performance? just curious

Thanks again for taking the time

ETA: The dealer is miles away and they didn't strike me as all that friendly. I'd have more of a chance with the breaker up the road, the guys are really nice. I'll try to look as cute as possible and I'd say I'll get my answer and/or pipe

On the fuel consumption front, I did 185 miles on the previous 50€, and got 95 miles! off 20€ in the last 3 days (thermostat got changed with 60 miles gone)

That's a mad increase, and that was already increased from before

[i'm putting all those extra details for non-members who google those types of problems. As far as I know there are a rake of cars with the same problems as they're all getting to that age but no one ever bothers to post the answer online or the lack thereof]

Edited 10 May, 2012 by Grainne O'

[chicken_eyebrow]

Good to hear its running much better with the thermostat fixed, it will have been running cold before so the ECU would have been injecting more fuel than usual.

If that little silicon pipe was leaking what would have been happening is every time you opened the throttle it would have been sucking in un-filtered and un-metered air through the crack (as it's past the point of both the filter and the MAF sensor), which would mean the engine would be running lean (too much air + not enough fuel). The lambda sensor in the exhaust would detect this and the ECU would then try and compensate by injecting more fuel. So again that's upping your fuel consumption. not sure that on its own would cause the emissions to be high though.

[Grainne O']

Well it passes the test at low idle. But at constant high idle the lambda just gets stuck at high voltages after a little while, instead of flicking up and down, according to VAG COM, and then the fault appears. That would correspond to what you're saying? At the very least, worth investigating before I start buying expensive stuff.

I just got somewhere googling!

http://www.briskoda.net/forums/topic/107767-oil-leak-from-1-9-tdi-90-bhp-engine/

[Grainne O']

not sure that on its own would cause the emissions to be high though.

No you are right again. I sealed the pipe with tape and went for a good spin. Nothing's leaking anymore. And she's still smoking at 5k rpm :| Worse, actually.

Your posted photo and the website it came from, and from then on one google after another, led me to think the PCV valve is fried or completely stuck.

After watching this incredibly interesting short video on youtube on "what is a pcv valve and what does it do" and reading Audi forums I've no doubt that this is my next problem - maybe the open pipe destroyed the valve with gunk but it has all the symptoms of not working.

Now I've sealed the pipe if i understand correctly I better hurry to get a new valve to let those gases out. If I ever find the part.

Again you're putting me on the right track and made me google the right stuff. Thanks!

[octaviadan]

My brothers partner has a 1.6 AKL Bora and she had rough running/idleling problems as you describe.  The hose from the PCV to the main air intake hose was split and as a temporary fix it was taped up.  It improved the running/idling issue to a certain extent until a new air intake hose was sourced.  Once this was fitted, the running of the car was transformed!

We bought an aftermarket part off eBay for around £20, however the plastic used is different to the original part and as a result is not as flexible.  This does result in the large parts of the hose (i.e the end that connects to the air filter box) has a tendancy to move a bit from engine vibration and can cause air to leak in if the seal is broken.

A genuine one from TPS is around £40, but in hindsight we wished we had bought the genuine part now even though it is double the price.

Here is a link below to an aftermarket one on eBay (there are many listed) - this listing does provide the original part number.  Not sure if there are any TPS's in Ireland, but they are very helpful in the UK, so they may post one out to you.

http://www.ebay.co.u...984.m1423.l2649

One thing that the Bora does need is a new theromostat as the temp gauge barely moves much further than 1/4 on the gauge.  Was this an easy job to change?

Dan

[Grainne O']

Well my mechanic did it while I encouraged First step was to let out the coolant through the tap (passenger side next to the grill close to the ground) Then locate the thermostat (it's on the left somewhere half awkward some way down, though not inaccessible like the lambda sensor) - (you'll need to take off the cover first); then a few bolts went out I think. He had to re-use the old ring as the none of the ones supplied with the Jorily thermostat fitted great ( which was ascertained after it was fitted and started leaking and everything had to be redone), but that ring was in a perfect order.

Fit in new thermostat anyway, that's easy, and put the coolant back in (close the tap first), giving it time to sink in the system. I ran the car on idle a bit to let the air bubbles come to the surface to bleed the system and then he refilled a bit, closed the coolant cap and away I went perfectly fixed (on that end). and warm!!

There was more time lost trying to look for the thermostat where the coolant sensor is and discovering it wasn't there at all than the rest of the job really.

Hope that helps! the thermostat itself costs nothing.

That pipe I was on about first and you're mentioning is actually fairly new looking and has been likely already changed as I discovered after rambling on about it. (which is probably when the pcv valve pipe broke, and got that ugly fix that let in air and probably clogged the valve - I'm now assuming it IS clogged because every problem I still have fits with what the video says)

Before the MAF was changed 18 months ago she was indeed idling like a tractor, and when I say tractor, I mean it. It turns out though that a lot of things seem to influence the idling :/ It's this close to perfect now though. Just the lowest intermittent deep rumbling when hot.

You should clean the throttle body too, that made another huge difference last month - not to emissions sadly but to the general running of the car.

[octaviadan]

Thanks for the info re changing the thermostat - doesn't sound too difficult!  A new genuine one has been purchased (pricey!), so hopefully 'o' rings etc should be a perfect fit....

Re the throttle body cleaning, I was very surprised that this didn't require any cleaning, therefore it was left alone (possibly would have had to have it realigned if it was removed anyway).

[chicken_eyebrow]

Sounds like you're making good progress. If the PCV valve is indeed part of that bit of piping and it's gummed up then that would explain why there's water in your oil. It's supposed to vent moisture back into the inlet along with the oil vapour. Could also be the root of your emissions problems.

[Grainne O']

Yeah I think I'm onto the final stretch now. I read a post yesterday by an american mechanic who listed the pcv valve as one of the top 3 causes of very high CO emissions.

Cross fingers!

[Grainne O']

The part is proving elusive, and no breaker in the area has it; it's not available online either as far as i can tell.

I'm taking the sealing tape off the pipe out ASAP though, because the engine's been increasingly discontent today. I've had rumblings, erratic idling, near stalling, choking, chugging and puffs of deathly smelly smoke.

If i needed more proof that the valve is broke, there I have it.

[chicken_eyebrow]

It looks like the PCV valve is integral to the actual MAF to throttle pipework which you buy as a complete piece:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Air-Hose-Intake-Pipe-VW-SEAT-SKODA-AUDI-1-6ltr-AEK-AKL-AVU-BFQ-AEH-APF-engines-/310385142065?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&fits=Model%3AGolf%7CCars+Type%3A1.6&hash=item4844656931

It sounds from your earlier posts that it's been replaced once in the past but might need replacing again.

[Grainne O']

That's the one I asked you about first and that Dan was also talking about but I'm just now not sure it includes the actual valve with it. And since these guys charge a whopping 15£ just in postage to Ireland, it'd be a costly error for me :|

If the last two breakers don't deliver we're going to have to dismantle and take an actual good look.

ps: it seems to also be called a "breather valve"

2nd edit. I rang those ebay guys be ***. The part DOES include the valve. So that's sorted if the last breaker can't find it Stiff price and long wait though :|

Edited 11 May, 2012 by Grainne O'

[chicken_eyebrow]

There's some part numbers on that ebay ad that you could give to a Skoda or VW dealer so that might be quicker for you - but I guess that would be more expensive.

I reckon a new part is a safer bet than one from the breakers, you might find the same thing happens again within a year. If you do find one at a breakers then at least test the valve works before you take it, it should allow air through from the outside of the intake to the inside but not the other way.

[Grainne O']

I just wanted one fast as a temp measure really, but that was before I saw the big whole expensive hose had to be changed entirely.

Besides no breaker in the whole county has any. I ordered off the ebay people. The guy was really helpful and nice, and I would really recommend them for anyone in mainland GB, and they seem to have every part under the sun for all VW types. Postage to here is ludicrous though, but even the main dealers didn't reply my mails so I haven't a choice either way. (and no....knowing the irish dealing system it wouldn't be faster - and it would be twice the price again. Those guys don't fix cars they sell you new ones)

It'll be the end of next week then before I can report on the fitting of it and the final disappearance of the dratted 00537 fault < -- optimist

Edited 11 May, 2012 by Grainne O'

[chicken_eyebrow]

Fingers crossed mate

[toby]

if you still need to replace that intake pipe i bought one off ebay a while back as link below.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/INTAKE-PIPE-NEW-1-6-VW-GOLF-MK4-BORA-SKODA-OCTAVIA-SEAT-LEON-AUDI-A3-/221015234153?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item337588d669

this is the sort of thing you'll need. that little pipe is rubbish and snaps.

[Grainne O']

if you still need to replace that intake pipe i bought one off ebay a while back as link below.

http://www.ebay.co.u...=item337588d669

this is the sort of thing you'll need. that little pipe is rubbish and snaps.

Oh snap, I've ordered the other one already :| this one was cheaper and postage only 8£ which is the actual price it costs them more or less, and not 15£

Thanks for the link! I'll keep the seller bookmarked.

Kind of unrelated but while I was looking for a breaker part I ran through all the cars that came out with an AKL engine at some stage:

Skoda Octavia

VW Bora

VW Passat

VW Golf

Seat Leon

Seat Cordoba

Seat Toledo

Audi A3

Audi TT

at least..

that's a lot!

Edited 12 May, 2012 by Grainne O'

[Grainne O']

Right, intake hose fitted and not a minute too late as I went last week to the far side of the country and the damn car had great fun shooting all its oil off the disptick hole - 5 litres of oil needed to get there and back [managed to run out 500 m off a petrol station after 2 hours on the motorway lucky me]

The good news is it's not shooting oil into the sky anymore and also there seems to be finally no more mayonnaise being produced so far; the 00537 fault appears to be gone and there's no more white smoke at high idle

The bad news is now there is grey/blue smoke at high idle , and the general low idling is wrong again; Anything from slightly wrong/fairly ok to very wrong, and the 00533 fault is still there

- Can the cat be clogged/contaminated to the point of shooting all that smoke, out of curiosity (without being FUBAR altogether)? I seem to hear some sort of dim putt putting from under the car when I rev her hard, or some sort of intermittent vibration, and I'm sure it comes from the exhaust [i'm nearly resigned to replacing it but I need to fix that %$^&* idling first]

-Fuel filter is on the way, what does that do when clogged exactly?

-All this is still pointing to the fuel pressure regulator as well, so anyone has any advice on that? it's not cheap.

- Going to do a new emissions test soon to see where we stand on CO at least. Quite obviously we're losing the HC battle here lol

- Would I have other obvious symptoms if one of my injectors was failing? (which is another possibility)

Oh yeah...forgot to add...the car's now idling most of the time much faster than usual, over 1k RPM, especially when cold

Edited 21 May, 2012 by Grainne O'

[Grainne O']

Went for emissions check, the guy found a lovely leak in one pipe still, wich accounts for the idling again and which we taped more or less for now, but the long and the short of it now is the engine simply is on the way out. There's zero emissions improvement at high revs lol, and we nearly got poisoned with the smoke. At lower revs though, she is perfectly perfect, everything is ship shape and under control.

*Piston rings* *seals and things* .....Makes sense though and I sorta know when that happened too anyway.

Waiting for a quote from this mechanic who in fairness to him knew the job. Every single part he asked me about first I had already changed so of course we now may keep going and see this to the end. Still cheaper than a new car, if getting a bit pricey. The guy told me it'd be cheaper to rebuild than buy another engine. Thoughts? if anyone stilll reads this

[IulianE]

100% rebuild the engine...2 months ago I rebuild the 1.5dci diesel renault engine with my friend,the engine was a dizaster,and now is running soo smooth,it pulls so good and feels very torquey.

Edited 25 May, 2012 by IulianE

[Grainne O']

Wish you could rebuild mine..lol. It does look like a piston rings problem alright now. Maybe valve stem seals as well, just for safety and while we're there.

Provided there is no cracked piston or other nasty, how hard is it and how long does it take to change the above do you know?

Anything else you'd recommend to change?

[IulianE]

Before even thinking about rebuilding the engine,you must do a compression test.If the compression is low there's a sealing problem at the piston rings,valves or valve's seats.This is the crucial test.If the compression is ok,forget about the engine rebuild.

You have changed alot of unnecesary parts,and I blame your mechanic for that.

My oppinion:first do the compression test,is very easy ,and if the compression is ok you need to find a specialist in diagnosis.He will check for long term fuel trim,short term fuel trim and how ECU corelates with those,faulty sensors,shorts,lambda parameters corelated with computer signals ,and others.This is beyond mechanical knowledges.

[Grainne O']

No, the parts I changed *were* broken (except maybe the temperature sensor). So that wasn't unnecessary, as such. They were just corollaries really, to the bigger problem. I ran her 3 years without doing anything to it, not even decent servicing and it shows. After all that revving the past few weeks, there is no more need for a (EXPENSIVE) compression test though; it is now obvious that the piston rings are on their last legs; what was a little of white smoke is now clouds of blue smoke, and it eats oil increasingly; basically it has taken a sharp turn for the worse; maybe the holiday trip to achill Island finished it off... The emissions figures are absolutely perfect until it gets to the point where oil seeps through the exhaust and then it skyrockets. (2.5k/3.5k rpm average)

Sadly I finally found cars with the exact same emission figures as mine on the net, and the same smoke (Ford Mondeos actually), and they all have been diagnosed with leaky piston rings (a known issue apparently with the old ones)

Now the options are:

-rebuild (still waiting on quote). The chassis and electrics so far are in excellent order

-sell it for parts, a guy in Laois wants one like mine for parts

-buy another one that's just come for sale in Dublin, the exact same one including sunroof, and maybe use the parts of this one in that one

I agree it could have been diagnosed earlier, but not all mechanics are equal. And tbh there is now absolutely bugger all else that could cause this, after all the rest has been done.