Landrover driver - irresponsible?

[RainbowFire]

But they know what they are doing. I wonder what this "planks'" insurers will be thinking if they saw the vid.

Why would insurance need to come into play? The only time it would be needed is if he hit anything, not if he got stuck/stranded.

[Jabozuma]

Why would insurance need to come into play? The only time it would be needed is if he hit anything, not if he got stuck/stranded.

Err, wrong. THe only time it would come to play if either he claimed himslef for water/other damage or he caused damage to third parties

[jkevs]

Only now i've seen this via the link, can't believe people tbh, it's a defender, it's designed to go off road/ through water, get a grip, whoever reported the video to the police needs a bullet / shot to the head and the police need to get a grip. It wasn't fast flowing water, all was still, the guy was a local as stated above so what was the bloody problem

Edited 6 December, 2012 by jkevs

[Jabozuma]

Welcome to The Political Correctness KooKoo Land mate :(

[jkevs]

Welcome to The Political Correctness KooKoo Land mate :(

:giggle

This country is going down the toilet, look at previous years when it's snowed and everyone is panicking and on stop, then you get the 4x4 drivers driving around as if everything is normal lol, I borrowed my dads discovery 3 for te last 2-3 years and it was awesome to use, towed a few cars up hills, also my dad towed an arctic up a slight hill with his previous landy, truly awesome bits of kit

J.E

[Lofty79]

Personally i think really really low cars can be just as dangerous as a landy in water. smashed sumps with oil on the road, and a car stationary blocking it.

[Jabozuma]

Personally i think really really low cars can be just as dangerous as a landy in water. smashed sumps with oil on the road, and a car stationary blocking it.

Then you pay for it and there is no problem - you were informed, made a decision against all the warnings. You bit much more than you could chew so now cough up pal! Simples .

[Lofty79]

yup same applies for both scenarios.

oily road endangers lots of folk, drowning due to daft underwater driving has same potential.

I have driven in deep water in a hilux, and i have a very low car, so im not pointing finger, just saying if people have a prob with deep water driving, but have a slammed motor - self analysis is warranted

[Jockdooshbag]

When i voted saying the driver was irresponsible i meant he was irresponsible doing it at that moment in time i.e country wide flooding. Doing it in isolation is not an issue as landies are designed for such activities as i can personally attest to.

Doing it while rescue services are fully stretched assuming the landy mans journey wasnt essential is kind of irresponsible. The fact he filmed it would suggest he was playing around. If he got stuck and subsequently got injured for some reason is irresponsible especially if he has dependants i.e family as he has caused then unessesary stress.

So assuming he didnt need to drive through the water other than for fun and that emergency services couldnt attend as they were stretched and he had a family who would miss him then yes i think his actions were irresponsible.

This is all speculation as his journey could have been critical and he might not care for his own life and have no family.

In fairness if i was in my landy and was confronted with a similar chalenge i dare say i may well have accepted the chalenge without really thinking about it properly. Doesnt make the landy driver a bad person as we all make decisions each day that werent the best ones.

[Jabozuma]

As we can see from the post above and others we know squat about circumstances really. All we know is that the road was flooded and there was a tractor going the other way. Somebody (a local?) said the road was closed as well . Also, there was no obivious current.

On that basis it is really hard to say anything except that the landy made it safely if not a bit leaky.

I would wager that the driver and passenger knew the road, knew the state of it under water (say from the tractor driver's report or they drove a tractor through there themselves) and they had people on stand by should they got stuck. In such a hypothetical scenario nobody would be at risk, no oil leak, no emergency services - just a drive through bonnet deep water, what's the big deal?

[Lofty79]

It may have been a farmer in whose land the flood was present

[Woody's VRS]

I have heard through the grape vine that he has been fines by the police so, if your of the thought he was a naughty boy then it may please you. I personally think if they have fined him then they need to fine the tractor driver also.

[DaKKs_152]

Ridiculous... The damn thing was design to survive that. Its not like he was driving a micra. However, if he had gotten stuck, i do agree with the fact that he does not get rescued. Dunno how its in the UK, but over here flooded roads are considered closed, if you drive there and you screw up, the responsibility is on you. Meaning, you get stuck, you swim back to "shore". And if you're lucky, you get a blanket.

I was in a similar situation once, I drove across a flooded forest road, and the copper blocking the road said that I would not be winched out if I got stuck on the mud. I was however armed with a off-road modified samurai with mud tires. I ended up winching them out, but whatever.

Just take this snowstorm we have this week for example. People drive around in random volvos and audis with 2wd and ****ty tires. And then I get an earful when I drive past in a dodge wrecker. I mean, if you know your car wont be able to pull if off, you leave it at home. You do far more damage by getting stuck in traffic than parked at home. I know damn well I wont be able to get anywhere in my fabia, so I drive the dodge instead. Its not that complicated.

Edited 6 December, 2012 by DaKKs_152

[mdon]

I have heard through the grape vine that he has been fines by the police so, if your of the thought he was a naughty boy then it may please you. I personally think if they have fined him then they need to fine the tractor driver also.

He won't have been fined, if so for what offence. If his vehicle is road legal then there's no offences to fine for.

[FUBAR]

I can see exactly where both camps views are coming from on this, I agree that the vehicle and the manor in which it was controlled was appropriate but this does not answer the question of was taking the decision to do it in first place appropriate.

The wading kit for a defender does not include bonnet mounted sonar to establish the depth of the water. That to me is the irresponsible side.

If he had of gone off side of road it could have ended up on its side or roof with soft fully saturated land that could end in someone having to find two bodies and sort out the mess after. The road itself could have broken away and not been visible, I find that irresponsible.

Had there been an obstacle, perhaps a fallen tree visible or not what would he have done? I find that irresponsible.

Any debri washed onto road which may have punctured a tyre...

Had it rolled or gotten too deep or they became stranded for any of a thousand different reasons he may have been totally unable to summons help at all water and mobile phones (if charged) do not tend to mix. I don't know but did he have wading plugs in at time (you don't run a Defender with them in all the time and its not a 20 second thing to do) If he didn't he has some work to do if he wants it to survive much further. You can't just go wading that deep in a defender with a snorkel. I used to work for Landrover as an apprentice technician (never completed it) and new Defenders with shiny diamond plate on top surfaces to me indicated a poser lots ask for the snorkel just for the look of it..... then they don't want the tow bar as its ugly.... Have done full hard core wading kits on them and the just for the look ones big difference.

There are just too many what if's for my liking to say it was a perfectly acceptable thing to do and Police are over reacting. Fines that may have been levied would most likely not be motoring offence. As there are so many different ways that things 'could' have gone wrong that he couldn't have calculated he may have had to rely on others putting their lives at risk and for what?

Taking it to an entirely new level this is was done where I used to live in the UK ........... I find it highly entertaining and there were lots of people in the bad winter that year did it (inc defenders). Not talking a pond here its over 10 miles wide at points!

Person made it and so did all the others there is a vid of one going through ice but where it was shallow so can it really be no foul? Police didn't think so either as you can imagine.

***MUTE*** if you would be offended by some bad language

[BJM]

FFS - lots of opinion by people who have no idea where this is or what happens.

This road is in the middle of part of the R. Ouse flood relief system.

Put simply, as most of the surrounding area is below sea level the R. Ouse can't naturally run out to sea when in flood and so the surplus water is allowed to spill over the surrounding area, locally known as the Welney Washes.

This has happened for about 150 years since the Fens were drained. It happens a few times pretty much every year.

It's an area pretty much empty, except for a few farms, but the road is a local route to Kings Lynn.

Locals do it regularly - I've once driven it on business in about 6 inches in a Vauxhall Vectra when I lived over there.

I reckon the guy (and the tractor driver) knew exactly whare he was, where he was going and what he was doing.

[Woody's VRS]

He won't have been fined, if so for what offence. If his vehicle is road legal then there's no offences to fine for.

Not sure on what grounds he was fined but just something I heard that's all.

[Kiwibacon]

If he'd fitted longer springs, the water wouldn't have looked as deep and the video not as impressive.

The overall moral of this story is not to put anything on youtube more provocative than a dog fetching a ball.

[Jockdooshbag]

We used to do some seriouys **** in our landies that would defy belief. When i first started doing it years ago i didnt think some of the things they were capable of where even possible.

We did these things at an organised event which had proper insurance to cover us. Its the same for folk in England who are lucky enough to be able to greenlane. Greenlaners dont do so on their own for the very reason that if anything happens they are screwed.

Doing the sort of stuff we did at our events on public roads and alone i would definately consider irresponsible. Something is considered irresponsibvle if the potential risks overshadow any benefit to be gained from doing whatever it is.

There isnt much to be gained from a joy ride through a flooded area therefore any consequences of failure would be irresponsible. If he was driving through he flood to save someone then its not irresponsible.

We dont know the situation enough to decide but it doesnt matter if the vehicle was "designed" fot it or not as the potential risks where pretty severe either way we just need to know what his reasons where to determine if it was irresponsible.

Remember planes are designed to fly but they still fall out the sky now and again. I wouldnt even class driving to work through a flood as a responsible thing to do. The only thing that would warrant such action would be to rescue someone who was stuck. If however the landy driver had mates in convoy with him then there is no issue and if would be perfectly responsible to go for a wade. We just dont know.

[GentleGiant]

Flooding local to me ended up with a large number of 4x4 and transit drivers being prosecuted for driving through flood water on the basis the waves caused by their passage was damaging flood defences and exacerbating damage to properties along the roadside.

The next year some were still doing it and got into serious difficulty; a large storm drain cover in the middle of the road had been pushed out by the water pressure just prior to the road flooding and they fell into the hole.

[Jabozuma]

I'd love to read that expert witness report proving beyond reasonable doubt that bow waves caused by cars ACTUALLY damaged anything. If it was true no boats or any other water craft would be allowed on any watercourses lol. Imagine the damage to river banks (flood defences) caused by large'ish river craft lol.

[Jockdooshbag]

I'd love to read that expert witness report proving beyond reasonable doubt that bow waves caused by cars ACTUALLY damaged anything. If it was true no boats or any other water craft would be allowed on any watercourses lol. Imagine the damage to river banks (flood defences) caused by large'ish river craft lol.

Boats have to obey speed limits on lochs etc for this exact reason.

[mdon]

Flooding local to me ended up with a large number of 4x4 and transit drivers being prosecuted for driving through flood water on the basis the waves caused by their passage was damaging flood defences and exacerbating damage to properties along the roadside.

The next year some were still doing it and got into serious difficulty; a large storm drain cover in the middle of the road had been pushed out by the water pressure just prior to the road flooding and they fell into the hole.

I can't see how a simple bow wave would damage a flood defence, if it did then it isn't much of a defence is it?

If the wave was causing more water to enter a house then I can understand perhaps careless and inconsiderate driving but since this is a country lane with regular measuring sticks to show the waters depth for passing motorists I would say there's no chance of prosecution. Also the video doesn't show the vehicles identity or the driver so there must be a witness somewhere. And lastly as others have said, the tractor would have to be prosecuted as well.

[TriggerFish]

Boats have to obey speed limits on lochs etc for this exact reason.

And in Venice. Except for the taxis, they seem as mad on water as they do on land!

[Jockdooshbag]

And in Venice. Except for the taxis, they seem as mad on water as they do on land!

I doubt bow wave damage would trouble venice much. Its buggered anyway as its sinking at an alarming rate.