Going Electric... Richard's EV thread.

[Dr Zoidberg]

I think you are right about the cost issue. It feels like they are marketing one manufacturer's vehicles as a one-off cost and the other closer to a lease so they can see which is the most popular option

[BossFox]

Over 2000 miles on the clock now.

It had a rest over Easter as I had towing and a track day on.

I've been keeping the heater on (screw the economy!) so I'm now up to an average 3.12p per mile from 3p.

Also visited a petrol station today... to use the cash machine.

[Paul007]

The other side of the coin - 420 mile round trip from here to Newbury visiting rellies and back at "around" the legal limit, journey time of precisely four hours (one way), no stops and £60 quid worse off with still around 120 miles left in the diesel tank of my vRS when we got back.

[BossFox]

The other side of the coin - 420 mile round trip from here to Newbury visiting rellies and back at "around" the legal limit, journey time of precisely four hours (one way), no stops and £60 quid worse off with still around 120 miles left in the diesel tank of my vRS when we got back.

A car bought for it's intended use then.

Sounds like a LEAF for commuting.

Could have used the wife's Yeti (for want of repeating myself), but wanted to see if a LEAF could do it.

A car is a tool. Motto is, buy the one that suits your intended use.

EV for distance runs: No.

Two seat convertible for family trips: No.

And so the list goes on...

I see people criticise EVs very frequently because they don't do what they want.

There are a lot of cars out there. Can't think of one that appeals to everyone.

[Dark_Hero]

Excellent write up Richard and a great experiment too.

You've done a brilliant job of showing the capabilities of the ev.

[BossFox]

You've done a brilliant job of showing the capabilities of the ev.

And limitations hopefully Charlie.

[BossFox]

After a bit of testing I can see that Nissan have really tried to stop people running out of range.

You have a gauge that shows your range. It's typically about 20% optimistic. (slightly pessimistic would be better, but you soon get used to it)

When you get to 8 miles of range it warns you by flashing the range display and telling you the battery is low.

When you get to 3 miles it tells you the battery is very low and the Sat Nav asks you if you want to do a diversion to get electric, then it switches off the range gauge!

I drove another 5 miles and the car was fine.

Didn't even enter "turtle mode" which is does before running out of juice so you can get it to a place of safety to stop.

There is no actual battery gauge with a percentage.

But when plugging into a rapid charger it always seemed to show on the display of the charger than the car was 10% charged more than the car was guessing.

So not only do Nissan turn off the range display at 3 miles, but they also seem to reserve enough electric for around 6 or 7 miles extra too on top!

What range anxiety!

[Dark_Hero]

And limitations hopefully Charlie.

That's true. I'm starting to warm to the idea of Evs and can see their usefulness.

out of interest if you do get caught short a mile or so away from a charging station what options are there? Get pushing/ towing?

I guess there isn't a "jerry can" equivalent for emergency use.

[BossFox]

Well, when on that holiday test trip I took a 50m extension lead.

Basically it's a case of finding someone willing to let you plug in (slow charge at about 7 miles range per hour) or call Nissan Recovery.

Hence the fear people have of running the battery flat.

[Dark_Hero]

Yep I agree that is the biggest fear. Thinking aloud here. Is there any jump leads of sorts that could give a little charge from a regular car?

[BossFox]

No, it's a lot more than 12v.

While the LEAF has a conventional 12v battery for the regular stuff, the heating and drive is from the large 24kw battery that takes 10 hours to fully charge from a 240v outlet at 10amps.

It would suck a car battery dry and ask what's for the main course.

[Dark_Hero]

Ah thought that was the case. Best cancel my appointment with the dragons den lol

[BossFox]

Just a little update as to how it's going... approaching 3000 miles.

Still using the LEAF as a daily driver and doing all my commuting and other running around in it.

In the seven seeks I've had it there have been three trips I couldn't use it for.

Twice when I was going to track days and was driving my other Nissan and once when I needed to tow a trailer, so was using the Yeti.

As I said before , it's good IF it fits in with your requirements.

Currently I am using 45%-55% of the battery to drive 40 miles to work, then fully charging to 100%.

Using 45%-55% to get home and plugging in for only two hours, drawing about 5kw (60p per day) to get me back up to about 65% for the drive to work the next morning.

Followed by a full recharge to start the cycle again.

So it's costing me 60p per day to drive 80 miles, assuming there is no sun at all, but in reality I'm getting about a third of that back off my solar panels, with leaves me with a total cost of about £2 to cover 400 miles per week.

I have to admit you can take it a bit too far.

On Friday I knew I wouldn't be using it much over the weekend, other than a bit of early shopping, so I left it unplugged and waited for the solar panels to start making 2.4kw (what the car draws) at 10:45am on Saturday. Plugged it in and by 3pm I was up to 80%.

Did the same again on Sunday and it was at 100% by lunch ready for Sunday morning.

Oh how exciting my life has become.

Still can't complain, I could just be sending all that electricity into the national grid and not getting paid for it, I am on a Feed In Tariff that pays the same no matter how little you generate over what you use.

So why not make use of it!

[domhnall]

you're on the wrong FIT, mine assumes I will consume 50% and export 50% so I get paid a higher rate fro 50%. And you do get paid for everything you generate. I work from home so I assume I use rather more then 50% of what I generate, especially when it;s as dull as it has been so far this month.

[Brimma]

Oh how exciting my life has become.

Sounds far more exciting than checking your oil temperature every mile, Richard

[BossFox]

you're on the wrong FIT, mine assumes I will consume 50% and export 50% so I get paid a higher rate fro 50%. And you do get paid for everything you generate. I work from home so I assume I use rather more then 50% of what I generate, especially when it;s as dull as it has been so far this month.

I get about £110(ish) a month back, which I thought was quite good on a 4kw system.

I got in just before the revised deadline in Dec 2011.

Considering my monthly gas and electric bills are around £80-£90 it seemed quite handy.

[Dr Zoidberg]

If anyone is tempted by a Leaf, there are some great deals on them at the mo to..

http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/nissan-leaf-acenta-auto-full-electric-car-17-495-saving-10-995-off-rrp-from-wilsons-1532185

[BossFox]

The new 2013 model, which looks nearly the same and has a few extras has really effected the prices of the old ones, making them bargains IMO.

Nissan seems to have adopted a policy of selling them off cheap (well, cheaper as they were over £23k) rather than sell the old model alongside the new one.

[Yeti_Man]

Isnt that link for a new 2013 model? I was looking again at the new line up of three trim levels with buying the batteries or leasing... lots of options now but from a base price of under 16k its an even more realistic proposition imo. (compared to the 25k price of the initial models after the government grant)

[Dr Zoidberg]

It would be a new 13 plate, but it's the original version as opposed to the UK built 2013 model which has a bit longer range.

[Yeti_Man]

It would be a new 13 plate, but it's the original version as opposed to the UK built 2013 model which has a bit longer range.

Ah ok, thanks, thats great info as Im going to be helping a friend out with her next car purchase - this is one of her preffered options! The new one though does have a good amount of other improvements, not just the range from what Ive read; bigger boot, 30kg weight saving, retuned UK suspension setup for improved handling, better high speed stability, changes to the steering system for better feedback and more firmness at speed, braking system changes with more aggressive regeneration yada yada yada - problem is as ive been reading up on it for her Im getting my second wind of 'Im sure I could make one work for myself as our second car!! Thanks for the updates Richard, im finding them very interesting indeed.

[BossFox]

Yes, the 2013 comes in three spec levels. Order books opened last Monday.

The new one has:

Redesigned grille for slightly better areodynamics.

40kg or so lighter weight due to motor downsizing and a few tweaks.

Charger moved to under the bonnet, freeing up a bit more boot space.

More efficient heater (not base model, which stays the same) which uses less electric so does not hit range so much in cold weather.

Two brake regen modes (not base model) so you can have an even more fierce mode.

UK tuned suspension settings for a less floaty ride.

If you go for a top spec one (£25k) you also get a BOSE sound system and surround view cameras with an option of adding a heated steering wheel and seats, as it's got leather.

I looked at the benefits.

Then looked at it being a cost saving car which I paid £18,600 for and with a bit of depreciation the trade up price was around £9k which blows any savings I'm making out of the water.

So this "old" 2012 model is here to stay for a bit.

You can get the entry level model for around £20k, but it's got the old heater and regen and it's not as well specced as the single spec 2012 either.

Also, don't believe the range marketing.

The current car is quoted at 109 miles and realistically does 70-80.

The new one has the SAME battery and power motor, but is quoted at 124 miles.

I can't see how making it 40kg(ish) lighter and tweaking the front grille can make it 10-15% more efficient.

What you will find (IMO) is that the new heater in the mid spec and top spec will give it a more reliable range if it's hot or cold.

I'd expect it to have a range of 5 to 10 miles more than the current car. Maybe 20 if it's rather chilly.

[domhnall]

I get about £110(ish) a month back, which I thought was quite good on a 4kw system.

I got in just before the revised deadline in Dec 2011.

Considering my monthly gas and electric bills are around £80-£90 it seemed quite handy.

ouch, we have a 1.88 kw system and get nothing like that back - but then you're in the deep south where the sun shines a lot

[Gti Jazz Blue]

I almost got a lift back from the Skoda dealer in a leaf as mine was in for some warranty work and they didn't have any cars available (they are also a Nissan dealer) but the sales guy had forgotten to plug it in overnight to charge, so they had to source a backup plan a diesel Fabia instead.

Doesn't sound like they have a rapid charge location at their dealership yet either.

Is it a requirement from Nissan UK ?

[BossFox]

Doesn't sound like they have a rapid charge location at their dealership yet either.

Is it a requirement from Nissan UK ?

I thought it was, but maybe they have not been selling the LEAF for that long.

Nissan are now rolling out the Rapid chargers to other approved Nissan delaerships in addition to the ones they supply to groups like Ecotricity that are plonking them in motorway service areas.

To be honest, the Nissan located chargers are a bit hit and miss.

Many are located where they can only be accessed during working hours of the dealership, which is not a great deal of use for promoting the car as a credible occasional distance vehicle.

For example, when I went to the Forest of Dean I'd have had to completely alter my plans if relying on Nissan's dealerships.

Fortunately they seem to be getting the message as they are now fitting them where 24h access is possible, like the one at Nissan HQ less than a mile off the M25. (which I have used)