Greetings,

 

Those that know me may be aware that I on't really like my car very much on the best of days, it generally does something to wind me up, but today I have decided that it is definately the worst car I've ever owned in terms of handling. I've spent this afternoon setting up an Autosolo course (like an autotest - load of cones, drive round them quick as possile) for my motor club's event which is being run tomorrow and once the course was set I had a quick spin round with the Fabia to check it flowed ok. It was the first time I've given the Fabia such a test and it was just plain awful. It wallows everywhere, the steering is vague, it lacks grip despite running Michelin PS3 tyres, will not turn in despite the Jabba rarb and there was no hope of getting decent traction out of the tight bits as without a LSD all it does is pick up the inside wheel and spin it forever.

 

Now before anyone says I'm not driving it right, I've been Autosoloing for about 6 years and for the past 3 years I've won my class in the championship with my 17 year old Rover 214 and generally finish each event with a position in either the top 5 or top 10. The Rover does have a LSD and a rarb from a coupe model but that's it for handling mods and it is so much better. Even before the diff and the rarb went on it was better than what I experienced today. When I compete with it tomorrow, it'll be so much better than the Fabia, it'll turn in, grip and go where I want it to.

 

So question is, am I expecting too much from what is supposed to be a "Hot Hatch" or is it just my car that is shocking?

 

Possibly a controversial view point as a lot of people seem to think that a Fabia vrs is an amazing racing machine, but I don't care. I think it's rubbish.

 

Discuss.

Lots of us Ibiza owners change our suspension for Fabia vrs as it's way way softer than what we get! I've never been in a vrs but I know my suspension is incredibly firm, almost too firm but i'd never ever say it wallows. Thought about a swap to something else?

In stock form they are definitely not the best.

I also think maybe you are expecting too much from a very luke warm hatch.

This ^. They are a diesel eurobox with a cheap suspension setup and a poor chassis. 

you can't really compare a car with a lightweight alloy engine and LSD to the tdi lump tho can you, I have rallied a fabia for a while now and it runs rings around most stuff, on the 2 endurance events I did in a 1.4 16v fabia we were amazed at the way it turns in, this on gravel forest tracks and firestone road tyres and going hard enough to get few 2nd fastest tests,I am building a vrs for tarmac rallies right now and fully expect it to handle well enough to get me up there with the big spenders but setup is critical and tracking will make a huge differance with these cars along with actually making sure the front suspension is actually bolted on properly so camber and caster is equal etc

The handling as standard is indeed very poor, this is quite an achievement since the bodyshell is actually quite stiff and free of scuttle shake.

 

Outright dry grip is good but not really exploitable.

 

The primary problem with the VRS is the weight of the drivetrain itself, this is then made worse by the vague rubber mounted suspension, soft standard dampers and the shockingly heavy standard alloy wheels.

 

Changing the front suspension bushes should be top of the list followed by a RARB, lighter wheels and quality springs and dampers.

 

Although mine has the much lighter petrol engine I made these changes and the turn-in is now very good, the car holds a tight line without any steering input and bumps mid-corner have little effect.

 

I suspect the VRS might also be slightly over-tyred, I believe the optimal tyre and rim combination is probably 195/50/15 in terms of real-world wet/dry B-road handling and grip.

I think it's not too bad, with good tyres, sorted bushes, good coilovers and a rarb.

Don't forget the often overlooked geometry setup although not a great deal you can adjust.

I've drove all sorts of cars Hondas in particular which are generally superb and compared to say an ek9 is obviously not aa good but far from terrible, I must say it was poor in stock form.

You've got torsion beam on the back, a heavy diesel lump at the front with poor weight distribution and little bracing in stock form.

I've got AP coil overs, rarb, decent tyres etc on mine and tbh I don't think they handle that well.

I am used to a fiesta Zetec S with handling mods and I had much more confidence in that.

The handling is the only thing that I think I would sell the VRS for.

In fairness though wasn't a Fabia vRS only around £12k new?

I wouldn't expect anything in that price bracket to handle particularly well.

I dont think the handling us all that bad, im not saying its all that good, but I doubt it would be very good for something like an autotest. I find it fine on spirited driving on country roads fine as long as you are smooth, any drving that involves chucking the front end in and you will get understeer of course.

Im very eager to get a rear ARB though.

Id say to anyone who hates the handling that much, why buy the car?

Doesn't help with the car being so narrow then to add to that it sits on stilts when it comes out of the factory

Id say to anyone who hates the handling that much, why buy the car?

 

It's not often you get to test drive a car on an Autosolo course before buying

 

I'd love to get rid of it but the Bird likes it and she drives it more than I do. My daily vehicle is a Ford Transit and I can honestly say I feel more confident throwing that into a bend and making it out the other side.

 

I've never expected the car to have world beating performance but also I don't expect a car marketed as a sporty model to be so uninspiring when driven in any sort of spirited manor.

Yup. I'd agree. I'm fully stage one'd and have all those 'must have' handling mods, and it still rolls and understeers. I don't blame it. It's a little Skoda fabia! But, it's not hot hatch. My friends sorted fiesta st way leagues ahead in handling. Christ. Even my 96 306 gti6 was miles better!

Its not a hot hatch, its a shopping trolley with a taxi's engine. It was never designed to be nimble round the bends.

Maybe it would be fairer to only compare it's handling with cars that return the same mpg?

I don't think it's too bad if I'm honest. Coming from a 106 quicksilver which you could throw into any corner at any speed and still go where you wanted, I'm running AP Coilovers, Federal 595 RSR semi slicks and a powerflex lower engine mount. Had a play with the so called 'pure driving car' Toyota GT86 down some back roads and I was sat on his bumper in and out of every bend, even at a Jap track day It was going in and out of corners the same as the likes of the CTR's and other things that were on the track. The thing that let's the fabia down is its stupid ride height, you look at other hot hatches and how far they sit off the ground and they are all pretty low as standard, whereas the fab looks like it was made to go off road, even with 25mm springs it still looks like an off roader. A decent set of Coilovers would see you turning in much sharper, as got comparing 2 FWD cars, 1 with an LSD and one without, there is only ever going to be one winner lol

At the end of the day its a 1.9 diesel, if a good handling sports car is required buy one and yes i have a fabia vrs and mine is un mapped but i have a rear arb and strut brace and i think its a great little car and does what it says on the tin extremely well. :-)

I'm sorry but what part of the advert with the trouser press moving about chasing the bloke with "practical but exciting" didn't you get

 

I don't think the car was marketed at your all being fair - but why deprive your missus if she likes the car is one point I may add? Although if you weren't hoping for a third vehicle then I understand the problem.

 

In truth there isn't much for the moment that offers so much (well obviously other than a Seat or you could get a more expensive, heavier golf).

 

I'm not saying its the be all and end all, I doubt that was the intention of Skoda either. Its a tricky balance getting comfort or performance based on value for money so they have gone for comfort

 

Sounds like you want something more capable, more willing to spend out on, fair enough, just move on - no point winging though just get on with it !

In fairness though wasn't a Fabia vRS only around £12k new?

I wouldn't expect anything in that price bracket to handle particularly well.

Clio 172 Cup was. £13k

Clio 172 Cup was. £13k

did that include the optional oven gloves and lockable oven glove-box?

Ummm....

 

I agree with what's been said about standard suspension. Eibachs plus dampers plus RARB or look at Bonesetter's thread for an alternative make a lot of difference.

 

I'd add that it's rather difficult to modulate throttle response with a turbo car where you're aiming at the limits of traction.

 

J.

Am I suffering from brain slippage, or are we talking about a small hatch with a (heavy-ish) diseasel engine that is quite good at what it does for 90% of the people 90% of the time?

And a Rover 214? Isn't that a K series engine that is light (and in larger form used in the Lotus Elise); if you own both then you are bound to see a difference.

Surely it's like holding your arms out parallel to the floor, and in one hold a cricket ball, and the other holding a bowling ball. In essence, when you start to spin your arms around, the inertia of the bowling ball will feel even greater than that of the cricket ball.

I've owned a number of decent cars over the years, including a Ford Sierra RS500, TVR 5.0, and a Audi ur Quattro.

All performance cars in their own right, all handle very differently; the Rs500 felt a flyweight compared to the TVR, the Quattro felt very capable and despite a power deficit was able to cover ground on unknown roads equally as fast, especially on wet days.

Common thought is that the engine in the Audi is stuck out too far in front of the front axle, and that may be so.

BUT; if you know that, and take it into consideration, unless you are driving like an idiot, or pretending you are Ari Blowjob, it operates within reasonable bounds.

SWMBO used to ride a Yamaha R6, and being 5'2" and weighing as much as a fag packet, she was acutely aware how weight, or lack of it, effects how she could control the bike.

Likewise, she likes the vRS for its blend of performance, economy and handling that is suitable for her needs.

Having said that, a full set of poly bushes and a RARB are on the agenda....

May I be so bold as to ask why, if the cars handling is so bad, are they so popular and so prevalent on this forum?

For me.

It has a little too much body roll for a "warm hatch"

Dampers don't do a good enough job at controlling the springs resulting in a crashy ride over bumps.

That's my view on what needs improving.

I use to suffer from power understeer due to asking too much from the front tyres. Braking, turning then sudden acceleration. But treating the tyres with respect and I was amazed at the improved turn in capabilities and overall grip.

Yes overall it's not perfect but it's far from ****.

How tight was the autosolo out of interest? Any video's? On a very tight autosolo course a PD130 Ibiza with just a remap and IIRC some crappy cheap suspension for "lows" was actually doing ok and IIRC came in the top 7 or so out of 25+ cars we had running on the day. He kept the car in 2nd gear all the way round as it was very very tight...

 

Whilst I, well errr I get bored easy...

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_-NWC5sPuw

Edited 27 October, 201312 yr by T. Spark

Standard sucks but when you get a decent set of coilies, some poly bushes all round and learn to live with the steering they aren't that bad, u need a better geometry set up