2.0 TDI 110 upgrades?

[Fliptop]

My Mother in Law is trying to persuade me to buy her 2010 2.0 TDI 110 Elegance, a car that I talked her into buying about 4 years ago.

 

I have to confess, I do really like the car, always have done, and in many ways it's the ideal family bus for us but for one aspect and that is simply that it's way too gutless for me - I'm used to mega horsepower and torque Saab turbos (my current daily driver is a 9-3 2.8T Aero with 300bhp and 420Nm...and the quickest thing in my current "toybox" is an ancient 9-5 Aero with 370bhp and a whopping 600Nm  )

 

However, I am looking to swap the Saab soon and would be interested in a Yeti if I could get something close to the performance I am used to - torque being the key aspect for me.

 

What have people been able to do with this 110 engine?  I suspect if I were starting with the 140 or 170 I might stand a chance of getting decent grunt, but I know next to nothing about VAG diesels.  What exactly is the difference between the 110/140 and 170 lumps?  Is it just SW or do the turbos/injectors etc differ?

 

I've seen a few reports on here favouring Shark Performance in Mansfield.  Their website lists a stage 1 remap to 140bhp/350Nm and a "coming soon" stage 2 map with 175bhp and 400Nm.  Anyone know if the stage 2 is just SW or is there any HW involved?  

 

Is there much scope for doing more while retaining reliability for 20K miles a year?

 

I'm also interested in chassis upgrades to suit...I think the 110 FWD has the smaller brakes so presume there is an easy bolt on option to fit the 170 4x4 brakes - is it worth it?

 

What about more trick stuff like Quaife diffs, are these available?

 

Sorry, lots of questions from an eager noob... 

 

 

 

 

[The Plumber]

The 110 and 140 engines are physically the same but different software and gearboxes. 170 upgrades the turbo as well.

 

Oh and I found the 110 4x4 under braked for my liking and to upgrade you need to replace the hub carrier.

 

 

TP

[Gyp]

I looked into this a while back after buying a 2WD 110 and the conclusion I fast reached was that trading in for a 4WD 170 was by far the easiest option (though as the 170 V5 still hasn't been sorted out by the dealer I may well get the 110 back again...)

 

Revo do a 2-stage switchable remap for the 110 giving either 140 or 180 (depending on how you've got it switched). As has been mentioned though the 170 has a bigger turbo so the turbo on the remapped 110 will be working a little harder. I've no idea if the larger car has a bigger intercooler too. Other remappers are available...

 

The Plumber is bang on with the brakes and this was my biggest moan with the 110. Up-rating isn't helped by the 110 brakes being rather different to the ones on the 140/170.

 

The 140 and 170 have common rear brakes and front calipers; to make the 140 brakes into 170 brakes involves fitting 170 disks to the front and the 170 caliper holders; job done

 

The 110 has different disks, and hubs and caliper mounts and calipers on the front and different calipers on the rear (there may be more needs changing on the rear - I can't recall). Making 110 brakes into 170 brakes is a bigger and significantly more expensive job.

 

In terms of whether it's worth it? Hell yes, the brakes on the 170 are excellent.

 

The other issue for me was that my insurer would not insure me with uprated brakes or a remap, but only wanted an extra £15 or so per annum to insure a 170 over the 110.

 

As hinted at earlier, it's possible that the dealer might be getting the 170 back and me my 110 back. If that happens, the thing I'll miss most are the brakes, and they are the expensive thing to fix!

[Fliptop]

Thanks, guys.

 

That's a bummer about the brakes.  The Saab situation is much as you describe for 140-170 so I was hoping for a similarly simple swap.  Is there anything else in the VAG parts bin that would offer a bolt on upgrade for the 110 I wonder?

 

If it's just the turbo that's different on the 170 then I guess there's another easy bolt on upgrade...unless there is significantly different plumbing, or fuelling?

 

If I were to go for this, the attraction is the known history of the MIL's car and its low mileage...less than 20K, with a good spec - it's the dark metallic beigey colour (Muscavado?) with tan leather, which I far prefer to the more common dark grey/black leather.

On the other hand, the 170 4WD has lots of appeal given we live on a farm that's over a mile from the nearest public road 

 

Insurance not a problem, I'd just use an insurer who is mod friendly, have had to do that for years with my Saabs.

[BigHusky]

Celtic Tuning are stating a stage 2 remap of the 110 TDI Yeti to 206 BHP, (404NM) If this is the case, yes bigger, better brakes would be needed. :|

[Gyp]

That's a bummer about the brakes.  The Saab situation is much as you describe for 140-170 so I was hoping for a similarly simple swap.  Is there anything else in the VAG parts bin that would offer a bolt on upgrade for the 110 I wonder?

 

Insurance not a problem, I'd just use an insurer who is mod friendly, have had to do that for years with my Saabs.

 

The brakes are do-able, but not cheap.

 

You could possibly get a reasonable result by changing pads, but that does feel like tweaking at the edges rather than sorting the problem.

 

Insurance may not be a problem at the moment, but be aware that remapping on the newer engines isn't unmappable in the easy way that it was on the earlier ones, so should insurance become a problem or you want to sell it on to someone that can't get insurance for it when mapped, then there might be an issue

[Gyp]

Celtic Tuning are stating a stage 2 remap of the 110 TDI Yeti to 206 BHP, (404NM) If this is the case, yes bigger, better brakes would be needed. :|

 

Ah yes, good point!

 

IMHO the priority on a 110 would be brakes first, remap second

[Ryeman]

Trade it on a 170!

[Fliptop]

Had a look at the Celtic website...hmm, interesting!

 

I note that (like a lot of tuners) they quote their power increase on the basis of what a modded car achieves on their dyno vs the manufacturer's stock figures, whereas the actual gains against a stock car on their dyno are rather less.

 

E.g. the 170 upgrade plot here:

 

And the 140 plot here:

 

Where both standard cars make a bit more than the Skoda quoted figures (especially the 170!).

 

Nonetheless, decent hikes.  I'm getting quite interested in this...

One more question - if I don't bother getting the MIL's car and look for another Yeti, is the 1.8T worth a punt from a tuning perspective?  It's such a shame that Skoda don't use any of the more modern VAG petrol turbos, like the 2.0TSi from the current Golf/A3/TT/Seat ranges.

[muddyboots]

 is the 1.8T worth a punt from a tuning perspective?

I await input from Yeti Man, and BossFox

They're both running comfortably over 300bhp.

[Fliptop]

Cheers, I've now found Yeti Man's project thread.  That's talking my kind of language - lol
Excellent bit of work, and very, very tempting...

[muddyboots]

Now have a read of the threads by the loon that it Richard (BossFox).

You'll probably lose a few hours of your life reading about his track-orientated Yeti, and his epic Citigo-go-go project

[muddyboots]

Back to original post.

If you're looking to achieve some decent performance, and wanted to go down the diesel route, I would avoid the 110.

The 170 has more powerful engine, higher spec brakes (312mm diameter discs) and is 4wd (no traction issues or any needs for an LSD) - all this out of the box.

 

You could either live with this, or use it as a higher spec starting point!

A Stage 1 remap on the CR170 from Shark will see around 205bhp, with no other modifications. £449 if you're a Freedom member on here (which gives 10% off).

A Stage 2 remap on the CR170 from Shark will see around 215bhp, but requires removal or gutting of the DPF (and the associated issues with that - search around about DPF removal, subject done to death on most forums!) and will give a bit of smoke. £769 if you're a Freedom member on here (price includes DPF work).

The 312mm brakes are pretty good as standard, but of course you have the further option of uprated pads, and maybe discs if that's your thing. The 312mm brake setup is pretty common across the VAG range, so good choice of discs and pads.

 

I haven't used Shark, or Celtic Tuning.

But I've looked at Celtic's remaps in the past and was concerned that their claimed figures may be over optimistic, or they push the tuning too far for my liking.

 

Or of course just go the bonkers petrol route

[Yeti_Man]

Cheers, I've now found Yeti Man's project thread. That's talking my kind of language - lol

Excellent bit of work, and very, very tempting...

apologies, not able to get on the forum much as Im in deepest darkest Wales for a couple of week... Lots of tuning potential as you'll see from my thread - stage 1 from Shark with a 312mm disk, ds2500 pads and ATE superblue fluid is the best bang per buck setup by far IMO I got great mpg and managed to surprise a good few things when combined with the awd chassis

Edit - forget Celtic, I run one of their maps on another car, Shark all the way for this application.

[JCP]

The 110 is the wrong starting point-The 1.8tsi and the 170 Tdi are the two quickish Yetis and both can be made significantly quicker. The 110 requires much more work and will never do as well. The 4wd is a significant everyday benefit which both have -lots of power and not much grip can be amusing but is not the way to go quickly.

[rockhopper]

When I had my CR140 remapped, Shark wasn't interested in getting the highest figures. They concentrate on drivability. My CR140 drove like a petrol, but had the torque of a diesel. It was great fun, revving up to the red line without any flat spots. It was probably running around 175bhp, with around 400nm torque. With the big brake upgrade and a flappy paddle steering wheel, it was a great car.

But........ I sold it last year.

Now I run around in a slow, diesel auto that is not as fast or as economical, but way more comfortable, and is great off-road with loads of ground clearance. The driving position is about 170mm higher than the Yeti, but it is the same overall size. I park it next to a a Yeti, and the Yeti looks so small :lol: it is the low bonnet on the Yeti that gives that impression.

[Fliptop]

lots of power and not much grip can be amusing but is not the way to go quickly.

Ah, you've driven my 370bhp/600Nm Saab turbo then? 

 

Actually, it's not that bad on grip, it's just that the torque/traction ratio is a little "entertaining"