http://autoexpress.co.uk/car-news/64097/everything-you-need-know-about-car-recalls

 

Minor Service Campaign work required,

then post it on the Manufacturers Website, and on a Poster / Notice at Dealership Service Desks.   Simples.

 

Secret Service Campaigns on a need to know basis.  

 

Simply Clever. NOT!

VORSPRUNG DURCH TECHNIK

'Which Survey says we have Great Customer Services & Reliability.'

In my opinion, you clearly don't get the point of being informed and having some knowledge of changes.

It also appears to me that you are far to Trusting of the manufacturer explanations for their changes.

We have examples of Skoda and other manufacturer convincing Authorities that their updates are minor "Non Critical".

(your description)

The Fabia vRS DSG- Oil change and ECU update. This clearly, in most owners opinion, had a Safety aspect to it.

Manufacturers (Not All) have a happy knack of treating the Customer with a lack of Respect - and consider them to be ignorant on technical matters, there are a high proportion that are not and like to understand what is going on within THEIR vehicle..

Your example, is a case in point relating to Aircraft, I expect the same standards of Safety whether I am flying Ryanair or British Airways or others, as they are governed by an independent authority ,with whom the Customers safety is paramount.

The Future - well your comments/vision about this would have me even more worried, change via the ether ,with no prior communications even more alarming.

I apologies for causing an argument re software update.

As a customer of Skoda with both my home address and email address in their databases, I would expect them to send me ANY relevant information about the servicing of my cars without the need to actual visit an overpriced workshop. (Retaliation for using the word cheap).

If instead of using airlines as an example, could I use Cinemas.

We all know ice cream, sweets and drinks are overpriced, so some of us choose to take own. If the prices were equivalent, no problem.

Quote Goneoffski:  then the DSG DQ200 7 speed twin dry clutch Service Campaign started in May 2014,

Synthetic Oil changed to Mineral & a DSG ECU Software Update

& still no Publicity from VWG or Skoda

 

 

 

Yup. I can just imagine what would happen if every DSG7 owner was informed on the 1st of May. There would be queues out of the door of dealerships. Customers (especially those of the "sense of entitlement" gang) would all get annoyed when they're told, "sorry, we don't happen to have an army of mechanics sitting in the coffee room, just waiting to run SW updates on the 1000 cars that just arrived on the forcourt. How about you come back in September. What, sorry, you also wanted to book in for a service in 2 weeks time? Well I'm terribly sorry but due to the angry motorists outside, we've had to put all out mechanics to work solely on updating software. So please call back in 4 months".

 

The "other option" is to keep it fairly low key. Maybe not ideal but someone with more intellignece and inside knowledge than you or me will have thought about the situation and made the decision.

 

EDIT to add quote.

Edited 24 December, 201411 yr by susi

In my opinion, you clearly don't get the point of being informed and having some knowledge of changes.

 

Don't worry Keith, I fully understand why customers want to be informed. However, managing information is very important in any business that deals with the masses. Does that sound arrogant to you? I think it does. But that's how corporations work. Yes there will be one or two customers who have a moan on a forum, some will say they will never buy brand X again. But in the greater scheme of things, the risk of uncontrolled information is greater than losing a few sales.

 

 

 

Manufacturers (Not All) have a happy knack of treating the Customer with a lack of Respect

 

That is of course, just your opinion, based on your own perception of how some manufacturers carry out their recalls and SW updates. Personally, I've never really felt a need for a manufacturer to treat me with "respect". I see something I want to buy, negotiate the price and sign the deal. I expect it to be delivered when promised and fit the specs agreed. If it breaks, I expect it to be fixed. I also like sales/service people to say "thank you" (we don't have a word for please in Finland). I don't expect more.

I apologies for causing an argument re software update.

 

Oh dear. I thought this was a debate/discussion not an argument.   I apologise if it looks like I am arguing.

Forget the 1st May.

 

it is Late December & there are people that have had cars in for Servicing and still not been informed.

They knew last November (2013) that it needed actions, & they went into Talks to be sure a REcall would not be done in the UK.

Ones that had the OIl Changed & not the ECU Update.

No Stamp in the Service Book, or Sticker in the Boot.

 

Cars 1 year out of Warranty, or on Extended Warranty & the Registered Keeper not let know.

&

Cars on Skoda, VW, Seat, Audi Dealership Forecourts and the Service Campaign Field Actions not carried out.

 

So Low Key is OK.

Not a Clue, no idea, and Press Releases saying No Recall Required, then a World Wide Recall,

& a very silent Service Campaign & no service campaign for many.

 

That is after VW persuaded the UK DfT / VOSA that Power Loss & Interruption to Power or Drive is 'Not Safety Critical,

You can still roll/coast  to a place of safety.

'VW can handle the matter as a SErvice Campaign in the UK'.

 

So no.

"they will no doubt let you know"  is not correct.

**& VW can handle the matter as a Service Campaign.**

Edited 24 December, 201411 yr by goneoffSKi

If instead of using airlines as an example, could I use Cinemas.

We all know ice cream, sweets and drinks are overpriced, so some of us choose to take own. If the prices were equivalent, no problem.

 

I like your analogy. Corporations are there to make money. That shouldn't stop anyone complaining on the internet but the last sentence of this post says it all:

 

http://www.briskoda.net/forums/topic/335688-cheeky-so-and-sos-now-charging-extra-for-laser-white-and-corrida-red/?hl=%2Bcorporation#entry4040667

Not beyond Skoda UK,  or Skoda CZ to just get the Websites sorted out,

Explain clearly to the Buying Public and customers the situation.

& get a VIN Checker online, easily found on the Skoda Websites.     They are much more open with Business & Fleet Buyers. Lease & Owners.

 

http://volkswagen.co.uk/need-help/owners/recall-action

http://volkswagen.co.uk/need-help/owners/recall-actions

 

UK Consumer rights have Corporations by the balls,

well if the Governments in the EU actually acted like in other World Regions.

 

Corporate Responsibility.

Take actions against senior executives where they knowingly run Secret Service Campaigns',

or Blocking Campaigns.

Edited 24 December, 201411 yr by goneoffSKi

So no.

"they will no doubt let you know"  is not correct.

**& VW can handle the matter as a Service Campaign.**

 

Maybe I can quote my FULL quote, rather than the snippet you posted.

 

 

a.  If there's something majorly wrong that could cause failure and negatively impact on the manufacturer's warranty costs, they will be letting you know, of that there is no doubt.

 

 

The message was that they will make whatever decisions they make based on the effect on their costs.

'If only everything in life was as reliable as a Golf'.

 

The whole world is not in love with the Volkswagen Group, or blinded by the spin and hype of the advertising departments.

 

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/333042-think-dresden-mid-february-1945-vw-australia-dsg-recall

I like your analogy. Corporations are there to make money. That shouldn't stop anyone complaining on the internet but the last sentence of this post says it all:

 

http://www.briskoda.net/forums/topic/335688-cheeky-so-and-sos-now-charging-extra-for-laser-white-and-corrida-red/?hl=%2Bcorporation#entry4040667

Not in the USA ,CUSTOMER IS STILL KING! - ask many motor manufacturers who have had their fingers burnt over there for being complacent.

 

Oh! Have a Happy,safe motoring Christmas and New Year. Simples!

Edited 24 December, 201411 yr by vrskeith

Don't worry Keith, I fully understand why customers want to be informed. However, managing information is very important in any business that deals with the masses. Does that sound arrogant to you? I think it does. But that's how corporations work. Yes there will be one or two customers who have a moan on a forum, some will say they will never buy brand X again. But in the greater scheme of things, the risk of uncontrolled information is greater than losing a few sales.

 

 

 

 

That is of course, just your opinion, based on your own perception of how some manufacturers carry out their recalls and SW updates. Personally, I've never really felt a need for a manufacturer to treat me with "respect". I see something I want to buy, negotiate the price and sign the deal. I expect it to be delivered when promised and fit the specs agreed. If it breaks, I expect it to be fixed. I also like sales/service people to say "thank you" (we don't have a word for please in Finland). I don't expect more.

Perhaps it was a good job you never experienced the Fabia mk2 vRS Engine issues, (VAG-Global) still VAG continue to deny any real problems of Design, R&D,Quality Engineering and Manufacturing problems!! 

Check through the many threads relating to this particular problem and it might open your Corporate Eyes of how to treat Customers! I'm sure there are many more and I would suggest the dissatisfied  Customers are not small in number.("one or two")

Edited 24 December, 201411 yr by vrskeith

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/337918-rrg-skoda-rochdale-master-tech-brilliant

 

This week there seems to be a bit of attitude change with some Dealerships that have previously said.

Overblown & do not listen to Briskoda Forum, 

people only go to forums with problem cars.

 

Today i wondered if Alasdair Stewart Brand Director Skoda UK had got the point after 3 years of my Bad Mouthing him 

& Skoda UK Customer Services & Skoda DEalerships,

Maybe got an Instructions out to Dealerships to sort out the remaining bad Twinchargers before some like me ruin the launch 

of the 'All New 3rd Generation Fabia 2015'  

with a few well placed Internet Threads & Auto Magazine Forum posts.

 

But thats just my silly imagination running wild.  

 

How could negative publicity ever hit a Corporation like Skoda.?   'Who cares about the Internet posts?

(Skoda UK that Registered 66,000 Skoda in the UK in 2013, 32,000 of which were Fabias.)

 

Lets see how they deal with any Snagging Faults on the 'All New cars' Customers purchase in 2015.

 

Only under 3,000 Twincharger Skoda sold in the UK in 4 1/2 years.

All faults are obviously overblown,

and Skoda / VW hold up their hands to Design & Manufacturing faults. 'NOT'.

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/294051-cave-cthe-14tsi-just-reply-please-if-you-have-had-an-engine-replaced

 

There are obviously other Volkswagen Group Engines around the world with issues,

but then it will only be a few online posters over blowing the problems.

VORSPRUNG DURCH TECKNIK.

'Move along now, nothing to see here'.

 **9 Times winner of Engine of the Year Award under 1.4 Litre with the Twinchargers.**

http://revotechnik.com/support/technical/14tsi-twincharger-engine-issues

Edited 24 December, 201411 yr by goneoffSKi

The money you pay at 1 does not include a post-purchase right to the latest software tweak packets.

I would argue that as long as the car is under warranty it should be entitled to all post-purchase tweaks.

Tbh I would prefer I was made aware of any updates or possible tweaks....as I have spent the money then it really should be my choice as to having them installed.

I can appreciate dealers not being able to deal with too many cars at the one time....but if by not getting an update it can cause other issues (to wear out) then it shouldnt really be soley left to dealership to push out the fix as owner may have a future financial implication

I would argue that as long as the car is under warranty it should be entitled to all post-purchase tweaks.

Tbh I would prefer I was made aware of any updates or possible tweaks....as I have spent the money then it really should be my choice as to having them installed.

 

 

 

Personally, I agree with you, I would also like to know, who wouldn't . However in this thread, I've tried to point out how it works in practice, in business and in the real world.

The administrative burden of contacting each and every customer to ask them whether they want each and every tweak is never going to happen.

 

Skoda Rep.: Hello Mrs Smith, I'm calling from Skoda head office, I got your phone number from our database.

Mrs Smith: Ooo hello. What's a database?

SR: We have a software update for you

MS:  A what? Are you going to mend my computer, it's been terribly bothersome lately and my son, you know, he's working down in London, he's very busy and he doesn't get to visit often. He's in charge of a whole department you know?

SR: Very intersting Mrs Smith,. Now about this software update, it will fix a small bug in your Bolero?

MS: Bolero? Do you mean the dance? I so miss that Torvill and Dean pair, they were such a credit to the nation, you know.

SR:  Yes Mrs Smith, I'm sure they were. Now this software update, there is a small bug in your stereo. 99.9% of users never notice it, but if you happened to press MEDIA, followed by three quick presses of RADIO and then moved the volume control to full, the terminal would reboot. Yes, it was a small error in the original code and we have included it in a software update that covers this, and a few other similar bug fixes.

MS: What sort of bugs, are they in my house?

SR: No, they are in you car, Mrs Smith?

MS: But I don't have a car, I sold it to a local garage six months ago. They took my licence away, said I couldn't see well enough. But you know, I can see very well enough to read a book, you know.

SR: Yes, ok Mrs Smith, sorry to have troubled you.

 

 

 

I can appreciate dealers not being able to deal with too many cars at the one time....but if by not getting an update it can cause other issues (to wear out) then it shouldnt really be soley left to dealership to push out the fix as owner may have a future financial implication

 

I agree, if there's a serious CRITICAL issue, then of course this should be pushed out as quickly as possible. From what I know of the vehicle industry, these updates are handled by dealers, on the basis that there isn't an army of engineers ready to be deployed around the country to do the updates. They would need recruiting, training, equipping with hardware and cars, and once the job was done, sacking. The ideal solution would be calling in an experienced agency to do the job. Now there's a business idea for someone

That's definitely one more reason why I hope the automotive industry starts to follow in Teslas footsteps one of these days. (Since the Model S gets over-the-air software updates pushed to it automatically.)

That's definitely one more reason why I hope the automotive industry starts to follow in Teslas footsteps one of these days. (Since the Model S gets over-the-air software updates pushed to it automatically.)

 

It most certainly is coming, I did suggest earlier in this thread, but reply from VRSKeith below , but maybe the market is not yet ready.....

 

 

 

The Future - well your comments/vision about this would have me even more worried, change via the ether ,with no prior communications even more alarming. 

 

No nyt mennään ulos....raketteja!

That's definitely one more reason why I hope the automotive industry starts to follow in Teslas footsteps one of these days. (Since the Model S gets over-the-air software updates pushed to it automatically.)

OTA worries me for security, but then if they had reasonable security protocols it would be fine.

Plus wifi/4g inbuilt to a car would be pretty good.

OTA worries me for security, but then if they had reasonable security protocols it would be fine.

Plus wifi/4g inbuilt to a car would be pretty good.

They'd have to use 3DES encryption as a minimum (mobile phone technology). You'd be surprised what your mobile operator can and probably DOES do without your knowledge!

 

3DES is very secure, though.

Tesla seems to be pretty serious when it comes to security. They've even hired hackers to attempt to crack their security to find weak points.

3DES is very secure, though.

3DES was cracked quite some time ago. AES256 as an absolute minimum if you are serious about security.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

3DES was cracked quite some time ago. AES256 as an absolute minimum if you are serious about security.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

Well, yes and no.  3DES using COMP128X was cracked about 10 years back.  Milenage on 3DES, I believe, is still secure.  Whatever, we are all agreed there is a serious need for good security on any OTA devices

Personally, I agree with you, I would also like to know, who wouldn't . However in this thread, I've tried to point out how it works in practice, in business and in the real world.

The administrative burden of contacting each and every customer to ask them whether they want each and every tweak is never going to happen.

 

Skoda Rep.: Hello Mrs Smith, I'm calling from Skoda head office, I got your phone number from our database.

Mrs Smith: Ooo hello. What's a database?

SR: We have a software update for you

MS:  A what? Are you going to mend my computer, it's been terribly bothersome lately and my son, you know, he's working down in London, he's very busy and he doesn't get to visit often. He's in charge of a whole department you know?

SR: Very intersting Mrs Smith,. Now about this software update, it will fix a small bug in your Bolero?

MS: Bolero? Do you mean the dance? I so miss that Torvill and Dean pair, they were such a credit to the nation, you know.

SR:  Yes Mrs Smith, I'm sure they were. Now this software update, there is a small bug in your stereo. 99.9% of users never notice it, but if you happened to press MEDIA, followed by three quick presses of RADIO and then moved the volume control to full, the terminal would reboot. Yes, it was a small error in the original code and we have included it in a software update that covers this, and a few other similar bug fixes.

MS: What sort of bugs, are they in my house?

SR: No, they are in you car, Mrs Smith?

MS: But I don't have a car, I sold it to a local garage six months ago. They took my licence away, said I couldn't see well enough. But you know, I can see very well enough to read a book, you know.

SR: Yes, ok Mrs Smith, sorry to have troubled you.

 

 

 

 

I agree, if there's a serious CRITICAL issue, then of course this should be pushed out as quickly as possible. From what I know of the vehicle industry, these updates are handled by dealers, on the basis that there isn't an army of engineers ready to be deployed around the country to do the updates. They would need recruiting, training, equipping with hardware and cars, and once the job was done, sacking. The ideal solution would be calling in an experienced agency to do the job. Now there's a business idea for someone

 

Obviously contacting of individual customers isn't practical, BUT a minimum should be a system where an individual should be able to see if there is anything showing against their VIN (like the radio link on here).

How hard would it be to set up a system where customers can periodically check their car against a database?....assuming the database is up to date. The infrastructure is probably already there, just needs a way for limited external user access. You only need to look at the number of members on here to see the appetite for owners asking questions about the cars.

 

You mentioned critical issues being handled by dealer network, being a Skoda owner now for 13 years (and without being disrespectful to dealer network).......I wouldn't trust this current system.

It is a shame the UK doesn't have a system like they have in Australia where you can go online and check for recalls etc.

 

If you click on 'Volkswagen' on the left hand side of the link below all VW Group vehicle recalls are displayed, this is where I found the Skoda page, Skoda doesn't have their separate section, strangely Audi does.

 

https://www.recalls.gov.au/content/index.phtml/itemId/1049026

 

https://www.recalls.gov.au/content/index.phtml/itemId/1056521

Edited 3 January, 201511 yr by cnc

 

How hard would it be to set up a system where customers can periodically check their car against a database?....

 

 

From my limited knowledge, I think it shouldn't be too difficult to do. I'm sure Skoda have thought about it at some point. Their business managers will also have asked the question, "what's in it for us? Will the investment in time, people and money give us some cash return". If the only benefit for them happens to be, "making a few enthusiasts on Briskodia happy", then the idea will get booted out.

 

Companies are there to make money. Sometimes they even manage to show an interest in "customer satisfaction", but only if the result of that satisfaction is making more money. The prime purpose of a corporation isn't to stroke the hair of the customer (hairdressers and Indian head massages excepted ), or make them feel valued or loved, or to bull up their ego, or the make them "feel like a king" as Keith quoted above. These things might happen along the way but the main aim is making money    I'm not saying I agree with the hard-nosed way of doing business but it is certainly the main explanation for any one of a million different grumbles that customers might have about cars (be it product- or service-related)