2008 Scout replacement engine options

[Scathel]

Hi all

 

I'm looking to be educated in PD140 engine code numbers!

 

A garage local to me is getting in what I believe is a 2008 Scout with a blown engine so I'm looking for advice on possible improved engine replacements for it whilst deciding to take the plunge or not; I don't have time to fiddle with cars so the garage would be doing the engine change.  Therefore any extra info I can gather as evidence to deviate from a like for like swop would be very much appreciated.

 

As I understand it, the Scout has the BMM engine with DPF.  I believe that there are other PD140 engines that do not require a DPF (possibly the BKD and/or BKP) so would this be a relatively straightforward transplant and could the original ECU still be used?  If not, are there any tricky harness conversions, etc?  

 

My initial thought was to drop in a PD170 but I understand that would be rather more involved.

 

All help and advice is very much welcome.

 

Thanks

 

Steve

[karlos1987]

Change of engine is possible only with same type: BKD-BKD, BMM-BMM etc, no next option available at all.

 

Skoda has no legal possibility.

[Scathel]

Thanks for the prompt response karlos

 

That saves me a bit of time and money then!

 

Steve

[silver1011]

The PD140 BMM engine in the Scout is an 8V SOHC with the DPF as you mention.

 

The 4x4 models also have a different gearbox (or at least slightly different gearing - shorter 1st gear), not sure if this would affect a different engine transplant?

 

Expensive, but low mileage and free shipping from Denmark...

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SKODA-OCTAVIA-engine-BMM-build-2008-14695-miles-/351407018025?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&fits=Model%3AOctavia&hash=item51d17d9029

[karlos1987]

Change of engine type is not allow by Skoda Auto => there is no legal chance for it.

 

Yes, devil Yeti exists and mechanically etc is there no problem, but problem is law, so you can re-built, but not use on the road as regular car.

Edited 19 July, 2015 by karlos1987

[silver1011]

A 2008 model is well out of warranty. I very much doubt Skoda UK will be bothered!

[karlos1987]

I dont speak about warranty:)

[brad1.8T]

Change of engine is possible only with same type: BKD-BKD, BMM-BMM etc, no next option available at all.

 

Skoda has no legal possibility.

I don't understand this.

 

Mechanically, I would think you would have plenty of options.  Where it would fall over is electronically with the ECU (coding, fuel maps, timing, etc).  

 

I know of plenty of engine swaps in other VW equipment - and yes, some of them took a fair bit of faffing with the wiring to make them work.

 

karlos, I understand what you are trying to say but that's not relevant in the UK.  Plenty of folks have done engine swaps and they are legal.  Skoda Auto and what they think doesn't come into the equation.  If things I've seen on YouTube are any indication, there have been plenty of engine swaps done in CZ too.

[karlos1987]

Engine swap is possible, it works etc, but for example in Czech republic, you cant change engine to different type or dismount DPF. For example BMM is 8V with DPF => EURO4, without DPF is not EURO4 and is out of homologation => not legal. Next, change of PD engine to CR with all things (DPF, ECU, exhaust...) is not possible, only 2008 RS was homologation with CR engine and only with 125kw...

 

Technically, there is no problem, chassi is same, original parts are available, but it is restricted by law and Skoda too. So you cant passed trough STK (DEKRA/MOT) legally, and if you see any rebuilt car, it is sure it is not legal or must pass trough many tests (emission, brake tests etc.) wich are not gratis => nobody do it.

 

Is very interesting, that UK is very similiar to USA and is open to customization of cars!

[simion_levi]

Let's put it this way;

is road legal in the UK.

[Scathel]

Well, many thanks to all concerned for their replies!

 

My question could have been better put and a couple of replies have summed it up for me:

 

Why can't you change engine types? As long as the ECU and wiring is compatible there shouldn't be a problem.

 

 

Mechanically, I would think you would have plenty of options.  Where it would fall over is electronically with the ECU (coding, fuel maps, timing, etc).  

 

I know that almost anything is possible given time, patience and money but the garage has as little as possible of the first two as I have little of the third.

 

So in the hope that somebody knows the answer, I'll rephrase my query:

 

Are other PD140 engine codes compatible with the BMM ecu - ie would the BMM ecu be plug and play with the other PD140 engine codes?

 

If not, would a non BMM PD140 engine and ecu be plug and play with what wiring harnesses remained on the Scout after the BMM was removed?

 

I'm keen to whip the dpf off for obvious reasons, and I would probably get the replacement engine remapped if that's any help.

 

Surely the corresponding ecu's have codes/serial numbers too?

 

 

The PD140 BMM engine in the Scout is an 8V SOHC with the DPF as you mention.

 

The 4x4 models also have a different gearbox (or at least slightly different gearing - shorter 1st gear), not sure if this would affect a different engine transplant?

 

Expensive, but low mileage and free shipping from Denmark...

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SKODA-OCTAVIA-engine-BMM-build-2008-14695-miles-/351407018025?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&fits=Model%3AOctavia&hash=item51d17d9029

 

Thanks for the find, but my pockets don't quite stretch that far!!

 

But I'm sure that the gearbox housing will be the same as other six speeds, it'll be the internals that will be different.  Or will it with the haldex...

 

I'm regretting thinking about this now!

 

Steve

[Scathel]

Right I think I have found something for the BMM courtesy of ATP Electronics

 

BMM has a Bosch EDC 16U34 "system" (can anybody explain?) of which there are seven variants.  The EDC 16U34 belongs to BMM, BXE, BLE, BKC, BLS and AZV - a mixture of 1.9 and 2.0.  

 

The OE ref numbers change with the last 4 digits and the VM (?) ref numbers change with the last two letters.

 

According to wikipedia, the

"2.0 R4 8v TDI PD 47-103kW...has...Bosch EDC 16 or EDC 17 or Siemens VDO SIMOS PPD1 electronic engine control unit (ECU) with altitude compensation... DIN-rated motive power & torque outputs, ID codes 100 kilowatts (136 PS; 134 bhp) @ 4,000 rpm; 310 newton metres (229 lbf·ft) @ 1900 rpm — BGW, BHW 103 kilowatts (140 PS; 138 bhp) @ 4,000 rpm; 320 newton metres (236 lbf·ft) @ 1,750-2500 rpm — BMM, BMP"  

So I'm now more confused than ever.

 

Thanks to all but I think I'll just stick with a rebuilt BMM!

 

Steve

 

[Niall]

Surely a PD170 sourced from an A3 quattro/Yeti/Tiguan would be 4x4 compatible without any trouble?

[skomaz]

I very much doubt the bmm ECU will work with other engine codes. Apart from the fuel mapping it has the dpf as you've already said which no other pd140 has. I would also be surprised if it would work with a pd 170 as the bmm was basically a development of the 1.9 8v whereas I think the other 2.0 pd 140 and 170 were not and were 16v.

By far the easiest option would be another bmm and a visit to shark for a dpf delete and map