Only slightly related to my other post, but after feeling disgruntled by being wrongly (in my opinion) of speeding, I had a bit of a bee in my bonnet.

I had seen a police car speeding down a residential street at night (21:40) without sirens or any flashing lights - I would estimate between 45-55 mph. certainly leaving other cars in the distance, and its engine was squeeling as it was being driven hard.

It was obviously driving TOO FAST for the road, and driving very dangerously as it sped past houses, cars parked at the side of the road, past takeaway shops and bus stops.

I followed it to find it just around the corner stopped at traffic lights. As the lights changed to green it went through and turned right through a No Right Turn sign. It done this right in front of the local police station - again still no blues n twos.

I followed it until it stopped - where it didn't appear to be attending an emergency situation and joined up with another police unit at the roadside with a road user who was stopped at the side of the road.

I took the reg plate of the offending police vehicle and reported them with an official complaint. Doubt it will make any difference - and I still have to go and give a statement about what I saw. Hopefully it will get someone's knuckles wrapped - maybe more. As much as I agree with them "doing their job" - they need to start doing it responsibly. I gave a bit of a lecture in my complaint about how I was glad I wasn't the person who would have to scrape up the remains of any children this idiotic driver could have killed and that driving a police vehicle was no excuse to drive like a fool. Hopefully they will take it seriously.

Ross

A police car can be responding to an emergency still. They don't HAVE to have B/T's going. Same for fire and ambulance too. They don't have to.

i've seen this sort of thing a few times and always intended to complain but never got round to it. must do it one day. hate it when they mouth off to you all high and mighty then drive worse for no good reason.

A police car can be responding to an emergency still. They don't HAVE to have B/T's going. Same for fire and ambulance too. They don't have to.

In this case - should they not have GOOD reason not to? Like a drugs bust stakeout or something?

In this case, I would hope they have a very good reason not to seeing as they were going through a residential area with other cars / road users, pedestrians (inc children) on the roads. The bit that really got me was why speed down a road, stop at a red light then once they've went green turn right into a no right turn?

Like you say - if they don't HAVE to, I'm sure thats the answer I'll get, but as far as I'm concerned they were well in the wrong and want to let them know that. I'm going to be looking out for and reporting any similar incidents in future too. Not a vendetta - just justice!! haha

If you lived down that road, would you want to be woken up at night (as thats the time you saw them) when they were going to help a colleague (as you've also confirmed)? Or would you rather they went as quick as reasonable and kept the noise down?

I bet you'd be the first to complain about loud music being played at 2am though.

Moose is correct. Nothing in law says that the police are required to use blue lights or sirens when using their exemptions for Police Purposes. From what you've said I'd suggest that the officer who had stopped the car wanted some backup from his collegues, for whatever reason, and the car you saw driving responded as such.

Traffic stops are the most dangerous 'routine' thing that police do and having assistance there when you stop a car to speak to the driver is important in a lot of instances. The Registered Keeper of the vehicle may have had Warnings on his file for Officer Safety, or something similar for example.

I've been in vehicles going to jobs without blues on on a number of occassions. One was New Years Eve this year where we were going to reports of an male threatening people with a knife at a house party... There wasn't any need to use blues as the traffic conditions didn't warrant it, but I can assure you the vehicle was making good progress anyway! Your regular driver often panics when they see blue lights in the rear view mirror and very often they'll do something stupid that risks their safety and the safety of the police officer(s), which is why they're not always used.

PC Ian Broadhurst was murdered whilst performing a traffic stop on boxing day 2004... You think there's no need for backup to be there promptly when you need it?

PC Ian Broadhurst was murdered whilst performing a traffic stop on boxing day 2004... You think there's no need for backup to be there promptly when you need it?

On the flip side, two young girls on their way to school were mowed down by a police car in Glasgow a couple of years back whilst crossing on a green man at a crossroads, and the car had neither lights or sirens going. 2 young lifes lost and all they needed was a warning.

I'm not on any side here, but it just goes to show for every situation where you can demonstrate something isnt required, there are plenty situations to contradict that

It has to be said though that if you spot that kind of thing and nothing comes of it, it really doesn't help promote the police as responsible though

Fully appreciate that the police does need to speed etc as a rapid response may be required at the same time however, and that will always override things in reality, even if a bit of P*ss taking is done on occasion.

Most of the time the police cars I see speed at the level where they would generally tolerate other traffic moving along, not much higher unless they're actually on a call.

i'll add that the coppers i have seen haven't been responding to anything or assisting anyone. just driving fast back to the depot

Just some points for additional info -

We're talking about the same police force who mowed down the two young girls mentioned by Bigw2069. Lesson learned? No.

It was 21:40 - late enough to be dark, but not late enough for the roads to be empty or for many people to be sleeping. If they were worried about waking people up they could have used lights without sirens.

The vehicle was fitted with blues n twos but the driver choose not to use them (unless unknowningly to us they were defective). Given there were other cars on the road they would have been better using them in this instance.

They stopped at traffic lights for a good while until they changed to green. If they were travelling to an emergency I would have hoped they would have at least put their lights / sirens on at this stage and went through the traffic.

Unless they genuinely have good reason not to have used them, I can't see any excuse for it. Obviously its going to be investigated and if I'm wrong or have overlooked something here - they may well tell me about it. If anything interesting comes from it I'll share it here.

I will say that there are policemen who drive cars about badly just like their are members of the public who drive cars around badly. We just have to be aware of the risks, although arguably the number of police units driving badly is very small compaired to the shear number that are arpund.

I will say that there are policemen who drive cars about badly just like their are members of the public who drive cars around badly. We just have to be aware of the risks, although arguably the number of police units driving badly is very small compaired to the shear number that are arpund.

I suggest you look up the figures on accidents caused by the police, it's pretty bad and compares very unfavourably to the normal driving public.

I'm going to be looking out for and reporting any similar incidents in future too. Not a vendetta - just justice!! haha

As i'm sure they will be for you now you have made yourself known to them!!

They are only human, just as you get p*ssed of with them, they will be p*ssed off with you, and possibly seeking justice of their own!

I'd keep a low profile for a while if I were you!

The rozzers don't do themselves any favours do they? They depend upon public goodwill in the fight against crime. Each motorist they nab is someone else convinced that the police aren't interested in real crime, just in making the statistics look good.

Anyway, if you're interested in fighting your speeding rap, then visit http://www.pepipoo.com/

Moose and DM, I disagree.

I believe those police officers should be fined. Those lights are there for emergency situations when the sirens can't be used, i.e., during the night where silence takes over and man sleeps. If there had been anyone crossing the road where the police vehicle was speeding, should they have been hit, the police would be in big trouble. As officers of the law, it is their responsibility to uphold it, and ensure the people they serve are well aware of their reasons for breaking whatever law need be broken for emergency situations. The cops Ross spotted broke the law. They are not above the law. It could have been accidental, i.e. they may have forgotten to switch them on, but then again, that's a failed responsibility as an officer.

They should have had their lights on, it's not like the sleeping public can see through their eyelids.

Good going Ross.

Mil, you dont live in this country and have not got a clue about whether what they were doing is legal or not.. as already mentioned a police vehicle may act in that way quite legitimatly.

lets face it the thread is started by someone with a grievance. We have one side of a story.

what if the Police had just had a report that someone was becoming threatening to the officer and by the time they got to the traffic lights they had over the radio that everything had calmed down

also did you report this before or after you got your speeding ticket?

because the coppers could have had a bit of a grudge saw your car there and thought serves you right for wasting are time

I had an instance when the copper called for back up because he thought I wasn't going to stop

When I slowed down for the 30 sign and looked in my rear view mirror long enough to realise it was an unmarked copper following and flashing me I pulled over and the copper said to me "let me just stop the back up cars"

I think what everyone has forgotten in this argument is, that the police do not have any exemptions to the law. Even if the blues and twos are going. It is common courtesy to let them through lights etc but not necessary.

They are still breaking the law. If an investigation does take place, they have to provide a reason for breaking the law.

If a colleague is being held at knifepoint, then that would most likely see them getting of with a slap on the wrist.

If the doughnut shop is doing special 2 for 1 offers on strawberry jam (officers favourite) then they will be prosecuted.

I think what everyone has forgotten in this argument is, that the police do not have any exemptions to the law.

Thats true , but not in the way you are thinking.

The road traffic act specifically states that police officers can *when needed* exceed speed limits , go the wrong side of keep left bollards and treat stop signs and red lights as a give way.

They are *not* breaking the law becuase the law allows them to do this.

The law makes no requirement for them to be on or off duty , or be jusing lights and sirens

Just to give my view on a few things.

Regarding the two girls that were killed yes that was terrible but this is kind of a typical thing that happens all to often (police or normal driver) the highway code does state that you should not cross until a vehicle has stopped for you, not it's your right away they have to stop. I wasn't there so I cant say that is what happened but going on what most kids do, I'm guess that was the case. Ok fair enough if the sirens were on the girls "might" not have crossed the road.

Also if you followed the police did you exeed the limit to "keep up"?

I'm all for the not letting them abuse their power but I think you should have thought about it before reporting it, rather than what it would seem to be you gettin one over them. (not saying you are just how it seems)

Mil' date=' you dont live in this country and have not got a clue about whether what they were doing is legal or not.. as already mentioned a police vehicle may act in that way quite legitimatly.

lets face it the thread is started by someone with a grievance. We have one side of a story.[/quote']

I think what everyone has forgotten in this argument is' date=' that the police do not have any exemptions to the law. Even if the blues and twos are going. It is common courtesy to let them through lights etc but not necessary.

They are still breaking the law. If an investigation does take place, they have to provide a reason for breaking the law.

If a colleague is being held at knifepoint, then that would most likely see them getting of with a slap on the wrist.

If the doughnut shop is doing special 2 for 1 offers on strawberry jam (officers favourite) then they will be prosecuted.[/quote']

Everywhere else in the world it is a legal requirement for officers of the law to have their lights on in any emergency situation where breaking the speed limit is needed. I don't see how Britain cannot have that law. Ross came with a grievance and we have all put our views down, including myself. It is pretty 'common knowledge' for the police to use their lights when sirens cannot be used in an emergency situation where they themselves will need to break the law. It is then that their action can be considered 'legal'.

Everywhere else in the world it is a legal requirement for officers of the law to have their lights on in any emergency situation where breaking the speed limit is needed. I don't see how Britain cannot have that law.

I used to be a police officer.

There is no such law

Rossm - As mentioned above I think you are in danger of winning the battle and losing the war with this one.

No proof of it, but I've always suspected that some police (although hopefully a minority) will find some way to get you back if you stir up trouble for them.

Just hope you don't have a brake light blow in the next few months!

I used to be a police officer.

There is no such law

Then Doc, in my opinion that is absolutely messed up. Do you not see the common sense in using the lights in an emergency if they're going to break the speed limit? If not, then that gives every citizen the right to break the speed limit 'in an emergency'.

That indirectly says your police officers are allowed to 'break' the law :thumbdwn:

That indirectly says your police officers are allowed to 'break' the law :thumbdwn:

If you feel strongly that you are right, try pursuing your line of argument on 5ive-o.org and see where it gets you.

Here is their link:

http://www.5ive-o.org/forum/index.php