RNS 315 Retrofit. No phone, and no clock synch

[fabia220]

Hi guys, new here so apologies if this has already been covered and I can't find it. 

 

I'm trying to integrate a Skoda Amundsen RNS315 into my daughter's 58 plate Fabia.  It's a late head unit with bluetooth on board, and mostly it works, but the phone integration doesn't and it displays a few other quirks courtesy (I think) of the ECU not knowing it's there.  I thought I had all the kit I needed to fit it properly, but it seems I was a bit previous on that!

 

I have installed a new amplified DAB/FM aerial, a pukka VAG phone mic that snaps into the roof console, plus a GPS aerial.  Not the quickest job in the world, but all went together fine.   Getting the right fakra connectors and converters was a bit of a nightmare, but other than that no problem.  The radio, CD and SD card sound fantastic even on the stock speakers, DAB works great, satnav works, but...  the phone button does nothing apart from mute the speakers, the clock is wrong and the satnav is in km.  The latter two issues cannot be manually changed, they are synched to the car by the ECU if the RNS 315 is properly integrated which clearly mine isn't.  There are a couple of other items of weird behaviour too...  The unit does not switch off when the ignition key is removed, but it does turn itself off after about half an hour's driving.  This suggests that the power wiring is wrong, but the loom looks completely standard and the old radio/CD behaved properly.

 

I have the full VCDS software, but it doesn't seem to allow access to any of the relevant modules and Ross-Tech tech support were, let us say, disappointing.  Does anyone know how to get this unit to work, or is the car simply not new enough to accept it?  This was Ross-Tech's take on it, but I'm not convinced.  The vehicle scan is shown below - any guidance or advice gratefully received.  I only have a hex bus connector for my VCDS software (fine for my own 2007 Fabia VRS SE) but I'm wondering if I need to upgrade to a CANbus interface for the MkII Fabia?

 

 

Saturday,05,November,2016,19:20:06:05914

VCDS -- Windows Based VAG/VAS Emulator Running on Windows Vista x86

VCDS Version: 15.7.4.1

Data version: 20160216

www.Ross-Tech.com

 

 

VIN: TMBBH25J083164616   License Plate: 

Mileage: 46760km-29055mi   Repair Order: 

 

 

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

 

Chassis Type: 5J (5J - Skoda Fabia (2007 > 2010))

Scan: 01 02 03 08 09 15 16 17 19 25 37 44 46 55 56 76 77

 

VIN: TMBBH25J083164616   Mileage: 46760km-29055miles

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Address 01: Engine        Labels: 03E-906-033-AZQ.lbl

   Part No: 03E 906 023 B

   Component: SIMOS91 1.2l 4V     1891  

   Revision: --H04---    Serial number: SKZ7Z0H4829331

   Coding: 0000071

   Shop #: WSC 13765 790 00000

   VCID: 1E3D0E51CAA0CFCE6C-51B2

 

No fault code found.

Readiness: N/A

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Address 03: ABS Brakes        Labels: 6R0-907-37x-ABS80.lbl

   Part No SW: 6R0 907 379 C    HW: 6R0 907 379 C

   Component: ABS 8.0 front   H05 0002  

   Revision: 00000000    Serial number: 00000000000000

   Coding: 0002100

   Shop #: WSC 13765 790 00000

   VCID: 3E7DEED16A60AFCE4C-51B2

 

No fault code found.

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Address 08: Auto HVAC        Labels: 6Q0-820-045.lbl

   Part No: 5J0 820 045 

   Component: Klimaanlage        X0850  

   VCID: 62C57AA1EE58AB2E08-51B2

 

No fault code found.

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Address 09: Cent. Elect.        Labels: 6Qx-937-049-C.lbl

   Part No: 6Q1 937 049 F

   Component: 0000 BN-SG.         2S36  

   Coding: 25742

   Shop #: WSC 13765  

   VCID: 3E7DEED13A60AFCE4C-5196

 

2 Faults Found:

01304 - Radio 

            49-10 - No Communications - Intermittent

01598 - Drive Battery Voltage 

            07-10 - Signal too Low - Intermittent

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Address 15: Airbags        Labels: 6Q0-909-605-VW5.lbl

   Part No: 1C0 909 605 K

   Component: QN AIRBAG VW51 Q5   0010  

   Coding: 20814

   Shop #: WSC 13765  

   VCID: 2C59D499DC1C2D5EF2-5196

 

No fault code found.

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Address 17: Instruments        Labels: 5J0-920-xxx-17.clb

   Part No: 5J0 920 910 B

   Component: KOMBIINSTR.    V2823466  

   Coding: 17403

   Shop #: WSC 13765  

   VCID: 264D26B1C2F0170E24-51B2

 

No fault code found.

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Address 19: CAN Gateway        Labels: 6N0-909-901-19.lbl

   Part No: 6N0 909 901 

   Component: 000E GATEWAY CAN    2S36  

   Coding: 00014

   Shop #: WSC 13765  

   VCID: 70E100E930B409BE8E-51B2

 

1 Fault Found:

01304 - Radio 

            49-10 - No Communications - Intermittent

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Address 25: Immobilizer        Labels: 5J0-920-xxx-25.clb

   Part No: 5J0 920 910 B

   Component: IMMOBILIZER    V2823466  

   Coding: 17403

   Shop #: WSC 13765  

   VCID: 264D26B1C2F0170E24-5196

   TMBBH25J083164616     SKZ7Z0H4829331

 

No fault code found.

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Address 44: Steering Assist        Labels: 6Q0-423-156.clb

   Part No: 6R0 423 156 

   Component: LenkhilfeTRW        V272  

   Coding: 10140

   Shop #: WSC 13765  

   VCID: 6DDF199D2786E456A5-51B2

 

No fault code found.

 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Address 46: Central Conv.        Labels: 6Q0-959-433.lbl

   Part No: 5J0 959 433 A

   Component: 03 Komfortgerát     0001  

   Coding: 00019

   Shop #: WSC 13765  

   VCID: 3167C5EDFB3E40B6C1-4B64

 

No fault code found.

 

End-------------------------(Elapsed Time: 03:25)--------------------------

 

[Rustynuts]

You should update your VCDS first thing. Although I suspect that could be why you found Ross Tech "disappointing".

After that, your car is most likely too old to have the required level of Canbus required for the functions you want, and also I suspect the Fabia runs DDP protocol while the Amundsen + is BAP protocol. They'll never talk to each other.

[b1ackb1rd]

I have a 2007 07 plate Roomster Scout with RNS315 fitted. 

 

I have time sync, lights sync ok, the navigation works fine (didn't when I trial fitted our RNS510). 

 

Neither directions, nor music show on the maxidot - and the car doesn't turn off with the ignition (and turns itself off every 30 mins)

 

There is a fix - search Kufatec for their 1.6 --> 2.0 canbus adapter

[fabia220]

Thanks for that B1ackb1rd.  Sounds like you have some very relevant experience of the issue.  I'll get onto Kufatec first thing.  This car doesn't have a Maxidot display so thats' one problem I don't have to worry about.  Have you fitted one of these Canbus adaptors or did the RNS315 work OK apart from the on-off issues?

[b1ackb1rd]

Hi, I'm way too tight to pay all that money when I can simply push the 'on' button every 30 minutes

[fabia220]

I think I'm with you on that!  This will have to fix the phone to be worth the dosh...

[b1ackb1rd]

Actually .... I've just remembered mine is an RNS310 not RNS315, this will probably be the reason I have more integration with my 2007 Roomster.

 

Both 310 and 315 are brilliant units, much quicker than the RNS510 - I have mine set up with the navigation CD in the slot and a 64Gb SD full of mp3 music (all of my itunes is converted to mp3) 

 

I may be wrong, but I THINK another module is required for full bluetooth integration 

[b1ackb1rd]

Just a thought, have you checked in the menus that yours actually is an RNS315 ? The chassis with a sticker can be changed easily etc etc

[fabia220]

The unit stacks up as a 315 with integral Bluetooth according to all the checks I can make (mac address etc) so I'm reasonably sure it's genuine, but as you say, stickers can be changed!  The fact that it has DAB on board confirms it's a high spec unit too. There is plenty of stuff out there about 'enabling Bluetooth' on the car itself before it will work on the head unit, so I'm hoping that if they can be made to talk to each other all will be well.  

 

I'll let you know!

[Rustynuts]

The fact it has DAB means it is an Amundsen + unit, and as such is BAP protocol. The Amundsen doesn't have DAB and is DDP protocol which is why Blackbird has had some success with making his work. I'm not sure there's much mileage in this attempted retrofit to be honest.

[DamoR]

Prob stating the obvious but the power issues will be down to the ignition live and permanent live being the wrong way round.. :|

[Rustynuts]

No ignition live on them as such. The unit wakes up and sleeps via signals from the Canbus system.

[b1ackb1rd]

No ignition live on them as such. The unit wakes up and sleeps via signals from the Canbus system.

 

My RNS310 switches on/off entirely on the button, it takes the time and lighting signals from the car.

 

Can someone explain the ign/perm live switching please, I'm keen to give that a whirl  

[Rustynuts]

There is no ignition/permanent live switch trick which will help you with the issue of the unit going to sleep. The only way to keep the unit awake is for the canbus system to tell it to stay awake.

 

Edit: As I've said before, you can buy a canbus emulator which will allow the unit to function correctly with ignition on / off, but when I mentioned it you told me that using your finger every 30 minutes was cheaper...

Edited 22 November, 2016 by Rustynuts

[b1ackb1rd]

Ok, didn't think that was an option - but you have to ask !

 

Have you fitted one of these?

 

https://www.drive2.ru/l/884886/

[Rustynuts]

No, not seen one of those before. I have used a simple can emulator on my bench power supply to keep my units awake while working on them for testing purposes though.

[b1ackb1rd]

Or this;

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Volkswagen-RNS-510-MFD3-CANBUS-Interface-TP-1-6-2-0-VW-Touareg-T5-/222205895280?hash=item33bc80e270:g:a54AAOSw3YNXaSTg

[Rustynuts]

No, never used one of those either.

[hutchysrs50]

If you can simulate the top one, let me know the English version.

As for the second one, just as expensive as the 1.6 > 2.0 interface really

[DamoR]

No ignition live on them as such. The unit wakes up and sleeps via signals from the Canbus system.

 

Every day is a school day..   They are not like the old skool ISO connectors due to CanBus then...

Edited 22 November, 2016 by DamoR

[Rustynuts]

That's correct. the unit needs to be told when the car's in use (ignition on) so that it stays awake, otherwise it assumes there's no need to stay on and goes to sleep.

[hutchysrs50]

I can confirm the above. I've had cambus and none canbus side by side to see if I could wire it up swapping lives etc and it wasn't possible.

[fabia220]

Thanks for all the feedback.  It all seems to boil down to whether some kind of CANbus simulator is going to do the trick or not.  Thanks to Rustynuts I now understand that the on/off problem, and it seems feasible that a black box of some kind can trick the unit into thinking it has a proper CANbus connection so that this aspect at least works as it should.  However, there is also the issue of the clock and the km satnav, plus the main problem which is that the phone integration doesn't work, and it's harder to see how a CANbus 'trick' is going to fix that lot.  I agree with Rustynuts that it's highly unlikely that the car and the radio can be persuaded to talk to each other, so I suspect it comes down to how comprehensively the RNS unit can be fooled by an add-on item.  I am in correspondence with Kufatec, the supplier recommended by B1ackb1rd, so I'll let you know how I get on.

[Rustynuts]

I don't think a Canbus emulator will cover all the options here mate. It might be possible for the canbus emulator to convert 1.6 signals to 2.0, but nothing will address the DDP/BAP protocol mismatch.

 

For it to work correctly you need signal inputs from the wheel speed sensors, steering angle sensors, and possibly others as well so that the unit can operate outside of GPS signal (like going through a tunnel). Also it needs these to calculate when you're actually moving to route correctly, otherwise the voice announcement will keep saying "Guidance will start when you join the highlighted route, even though you're on it and driving. To get the sat nav and phone functions on the dash will not be possible due to the DDP/BAP mismatch which can't be addressed by a CAN emunlator, and there'll be other issues no doubt.

Edited 23 November, 2016 by Rustynuts

[b1ackb1rd]

My RNS310 gets a speed signal, the correct time and lighting from the car - it's just the turning off after 30 mins that does my head in. 

 

I have maxidot, but I think I'll need a MFSW to get into the MFD menus to see whether mapping, music etc is read also. 

 

(Surely BAP/DPP settings for these units are in the VCDS menus? However I'm sure you need the unit in a Golf mk5 platform Golf/Octy/Touran etc with canbus 2.0 to be able to access this)