Big sell off Opel and Vauxhall to PSA. Implications for operations and staff? UK and Europe.

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry/gm-plans-sale-vauxhall-and-opel-brands-psa

Edited 14 February, 20179 yr by vrskeith

Just like a 'Fire Sale', in the case of Vauxhall exactly like a Fire Sale.

 

Who will be paying fines and penalties in which countries if GM or PSA have fines and penalties to pay?

That 'Elephant in the room', fines and penalties for 'Cheats', if there were any....

How come all of the rubbish car makers are forming little groups to try and push more tat on us?

 

Based on previous experience there's no way I'd drive another Vauxhall or a Peugeot/Citroen.

35 minutes ago, camelspyyder said:

How come all of the rubbish car makers are forming little groups to try and push more tat on us?

Based on previous experience there's no way I'd drive another Vauxhall or a Peugeot/Citroen.

 

Well there are a number of standout products with GM and PSA.  

 

The Bolt is a ground breaking product from GM and the PSA 1.2 2 cylinder petrol has been judged by experts as the best engine in class ie 1 litre to 1.5 litre.

 

Whilst I agree I thought the Insignia was simply awful I do actually like the GM (Daewoo Spark I have)  safe, spacious and the 1 litre 4 cylinder engine a jewel at 68 hp for a non turbo one litre, mega cheap to insure, similar to Corsa, quite a good car.   Reliable which is important to many.    

 

https://www.carwow.co.uk/best/most-reliable-cars-0493

 

 

 

 

lol-lol,

 the 1.4TSI was judged by supposed experts as Engine of the year for 9 years, so the experts can be taken with a Pinch of Salt or a loud LOL.

So they build engines and cars that sometimes are good, sometimes so so and sometimes a bucket of sh1te. 

Seems a fair enough summing up.   If they keep trying they will get it right more often than not.

 

17 minutes ago, Offski said:

lol-lol,

 the 1.4TSI was judged by supposed experts as Engine of the year for 9 years, so the experts can be taken with a Pinch of Salt or a loud LOL.

So they build engines and cars that sometimes are good, sometimes so so and sometimes a bucket of sh1te. 

Seems a fair enough summing up.   If they keep trying they will get it right more often than not.

 

Loved mine.  Did 100K miles in it.   Regularly did at least 40 mpg and sometimes over 50 mpg.

 

0-60 in 7 seconds, Needed its Tescos Momentum or Shell Nitro.  Handling poorish, DSG would sometimes get confused by engine was great once lost the engine oil level anxiety.

 

It was an attempt to try a new technological path ie Twin-charge but in reality the 192 hp straight turbo 1.8TSI was/is a better engine is just about every way, just a shame, no a trajedy, it never made it in to a Skoda hot hatch.

 

I hope a GM Europe - PSA does gop ahead and work though I recall the sadness when the Peugeot plant closed at Ryton near Coventry.   

 

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2006/apr/19/manufacturing.motoring

  

I fear it could happen again for Liverpool and Luton with the post BREXIT trade barriers and costs going up.

Quite a bit of the Vauxhall output is dull and/or sub par including pretty much all their SUVs so far but the new Astra reviews very well and the Insignia Grand Sport coming in a few months looks good.
It doesn't strike me of an obvious merger for either party.

lol-lol,  

if various EU Countries Manufacturers need to Manufacture Vehicles in the UK for the UK to avoid Tariffs if Tariffs for Importing Parts & Vehicles into the UK becomes an issue there will be plenty facilities and grants (bribes) from the UK Government to have them manufacturing in the UK.

 

If they have to be built in the USA and then imported into the UK there are enough Manufacturers in the USA or will be in the near future to cope with that.

Ford and others do Global Vehicles and right hand drive.

Dacia / Renault can have that 'French' presence in the UK along with those other Foreign Owned Manufacturers Iconic British cars like MINI, Jaguar /Land Rover, Bentley, Rolls Royce, Aston Martin etc

My last GM product was a nearly new Astra that was really poorly engineered, and had terrible dealer service from every GM outlet we tried. Some of the faults were still unfixed when SWMBO got rid of it 8 years later.

 

My trust level for GM products remains zero 11 years further on.

Edited 14 February, 20179 yr by camelspyyder

1 hour ago, Offski said:

lol-lol,  

if various EU Countries Manufacturers need to Manufacture Vehicles in the UK for the UK to avoid Tariffs if Tariffs for Importing Parts & Vehicles into the UK becomes an issue there will be plenty facilities and grants (bribes) from the UK Government to have them manufacturing in the UK.

 

If they have to be built in the USA and then imported into the UK there are enough Manufacturers in the USA or will be in the near future to cope with that.

Ford and others do Global Vehicles and right hand drive.

Dacia / Renault can have that 'French' presence in the UK along with those other Foreign Owned Manufacturers Iconic British cars like MINI, Jaguar /Land Rover, Bentley, Rolls Royce, Aston Martin etc

 

Might see even more Qashqais, and Dacias of course which are so cheap the Ad Valorem Duty is still chicken feed, but usually you have to have a major market across several countries to warrant a car production line.  Average car production line will supply cars for about 30 countries.   I cannot see mainstream car production surviving in the UK post BREXIT when we are outside the EU and having to pay EU duty of 10% on cars that would have been made here.   Much of car parts are priced in Euros and that is already a headwind for UK car production even though the UK wages costs is now lower in Euro terms due to the fall in the UK currency.  The EU will also check if cars are sold in the EU than in te UK and then would start Anti-Dumping Proceedings.  UK cars have sometimes been sold cheaper in the US than the were here which open the trade to ADD there also.  Sometimes business will do cars as a loss leader to get market share but this can lead to ADD.

 

Oz has lost its industry and it loss critical mass and BMW-Mini and JLR are moving some model production to mainland Europe.  The Defender to be made in Slovakia, sacrilege.  

    

Luxury British Vehicles have Luxury British price tags and who wants British Cars not built in Britain when they are buying them in other World Regions.

 

If those Continental Europeans do not want to Buy British Prestige Vehicles at British prices they can keep importing their German Cars from where ever the Germans are building them or the Far Eastern cars built in Europe.

 

INEOS will build their Electric 'Defender' Type vehicle where ever they please i would imagine and have Manufacturers happy to be involved in the manufacturing.

Edited 14 February, 20179 yr by Offski

Whatever happens I could imagine Peugeot wanting the Bolt and GM wanting the 1.2.

Id be worried if I was a worker at Ellesmere.

So what is Holden going to replace this Opel design with?.

http://www.caradvice.com.au/504600/2018-holden-commodore-liftback-and-wagon-revealed-in-photoshoot-slip-up/

So, Governments and Unions are now on the case.

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry/general-motors-meets-uk-ministers-discuss-vauxhall-and-psa-deal

Plan to profit- normally heads / people cuts and plants cut /consolidation and all peripheral industries . Same old, same old. Tax payers bailout again ?

http://www.autocar.co.uk/opinion/industry/analysis-how-psa-could-make-opel-profitable-again

Edited 17 February, 20179 yr by vrskeith

34 minutes ago, vrskeith said:

Plan to profit- normally heads / people cuts and plants cut /consolidation and all peripheral industries . Same old, same old. Tax payers bailout again ?

http://www.autocar.co.uk/opinion/industry/analysis-how-psa-could-make-opel-profitable-again

 

Interesting statement in the article....

 

" Making financial sense of the PSA plan to buy General Motors Europe (GME) is not easy according to city analysts. 

GME lost money from 1999 to 2016. The company estimated that it would have crept into the black last year, but the Brexit vote and the fall in the value of the UK Pound clobbered the bottom line."

I gather Ellesmere port and Luton were marginally BREXIT voters, wonder if they would be a different profile now?

 

So a maker of bland cars with a poor reputation for reliability buys another make of bland cars with a poor reputation for reliability.

 

Pug and Vx were two manufacturers I really couldn't see the point of this last few years. They're not pretty, not great value, not particularly economical, not particularly cheap to run.

 

What is 'Meh' squared. Maybe they have a plan to turn things around.

Edited 17 February, 20179 yr by Aspman

http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-opel-m-a-psa-britain-idUKKBN15X0EE?utm_source=applenews

So if PSA buy GM Europe, will that really include the Bolt/Ampera given that it is an American product with a Korean drivetrain?

 

Would that be like selling the Crown Jewels (or Calais come to think of it) to France?

"Meh" Squared is "FIAT-Chrysler"

 

 

 

Edited 18 February, 20179 yr by camelspyyder

As a driver of an opel insignia,

@Aspman is correct. I like my car, it drives well, goes fast (enough)when reqd, has plenty toys for the age and spec. Its comfy.

 

But i havnt  bonded with it like i did with my old octavia, which while only a 90bhp ALH was the same age as the insignia when purchased. The insignia is a car, where the octy became part of the family almost instantly. 

 

Having said that, id happily burn down every PSA factory in existence. I f'kin hate them....

Edited 18 February, 20179 yr by mac11irl
typo

I think being 'meh' is the worst thing. I might find Dacia's pretty 'orrible but they are very cheap so I get that, I can see the appeal of a simple solid motor that is cheap to buy and run. My BMW is a ludicrous car really, expensive to buy and run and with more power than you could ever use legally but it makes me grin so it's worth it to me.

 

Alfas/Fiat are pretty, unreliable but not too expensive

Minis are as stupid as my beemer but folk like the weird styling and drive

Koren cars are a bit dull but have toys and warranties

VAG group has perceived solidness and build quality at a price(it's arguable I know)

 

But pug and Vx just meh in the middle.

 

Edited 18 February, 20179 yr by Aspman

...no mention of anything Japanese .....so reliability isn't an issue I guess.

There must be a threat to jobs in Britain, because the first thing they would say is that WONT happen.

2 hours ago, Ryeman said:

There must be a threat to jobs in Britain, because the first thing they would say is that WONT happen.

 

 

Just another thing to add on top of BREXIT.