Fabia not starting (fuel issues)

[7600ee]

Hi everyone!

 

I've just got myself a skoda fabia mk1 2006 1.4tdi but unfortunately its not starting. It did 70K miles up until 2011 which is when it just sat in the guys driveway I bought it from. Before that it had no issues, passed MOT's and he said the only problem was the battery draining if he left it for a couple weeks. 

 

The first problem I had was both the rear drums being seized but I fixed this. At first the car did start but felt as if it were about to stall (lack of fuel). Then over the few days of running it everyday it was becoming harder to start without pumping the fuel pedal and would stall if I took my foot of the pedal. Now it won't start. I thought this was the fuel pump because when I took the tube from the filter off and turned on the ignition it wouldn't give anything  (a few drips at most). There was also no noise. I got a new pump today and nothing has changed, so it's not the pump.  The codes I'm getting of the car are as follows: P0600, P0183, P0118. The last two I only got today after I disconnected and connected the ECU because I thought it could be a faulty connection. 

 

Any suggestions?

Thanks, Ewan.

Edited 25 July, 2017 by 7600ee

[SuperbTWM]

If you think its a fuel issue I would check all the fuel hoses are tight first, air ingress can be a pain, pay particular attention  to the connections on the fuel filter and then over to the tandem pump.

 

If all is good I would be measuring the pressure on the tandem pump, it does have a test port on it so you can hook up a test gauge.

Edited 25 July, 2017 by SuperbTWM

[7600ee]

Just now, SuperbTWM said:

If you think its a fuel issue I would check all the hoses are tight first, especially on the fuel filter and then over to the tandem pump.

 

If all is good I would be measuring the pressure on the tandem pump.

 

I've replaced the fuel and air filter. I don't think the fuel is coming through to the filter but I will look at the tandem pump thanks (didn't know there was one!).

[sepulchrave]

Check the fuel pump relay, if you've changed the pump then this has to be an electrical problem, check for voltage at the fuel pump with the ignition on.

[7600ee]

Just now, sepulchrave said:

Check the fuel pump relay, if you've changed the pump then this has to be an electrical problem, check for voltage at the fuel pump with the ignition on.

 

I checked but it had something along the lines of 0.02/0.03 iirc which didn't seem right. Do you know what it should be? I will have a look at the relay tomorrow. Thanks

[7600ee]

Just checked the relays and no luck. I heard all three click when the ignition was turned. Any more ideas? 

[usedabused]

take off the cam box and give the injector bolts a nipup,if this temporally helps the problem you could be looking at injector seals and bolts

 

[7600ee]

1 minute ago, usedabused said:

take off the cam box and give the injector bolts a nipup,if this temporally helps the problem you could be looking at injector seals and bolts

 

 

Thanks will give this a go tomorrow! I have spoken to a garage who said check voltage fuses etc but will give in and put it in next week if no luck.

[SuperbTWM]

On 26/07/2017 at 00:13, 7600ee said:

 

I checked but it had something along the lines of 0.02/0.03 iirc which didn't seem right. Do you know what it should be? I will have a look at the relay tomorrow. Thanks

If you get a short piece of wire and put 2 spade crimps on the end you can push that into the relay base to run the pump constantly (make sure you pick the correct pair of terminals)

 

You should hear it running, at this point you can check if its getting power also but if its running chances are you will be getting 12V at the pump. You can also take a hose off the fuel filter and pump some fuel into a bucket to prove its pumping. Finally you can try and start the car and if it still doesn't start you know the problem is not with the lift pump.

Edited 28 July, 2017 by SuperbTWM

[7600ee]

2 minutes ago, SuperbTWM said:

If you get a short piece of wire and put 2 spade crimps on the end you can push that into the relay base to run the pump constantly (make sure you pick the correct pair of terminals.

 

You should hear it running, at this point you can check if its getting power also but if its running chances are you will be getting 12V at the pump. You can also take a hose off the fuel filter and pump some fuel into a bucket to prove its pumping. Finally you can try and start the car and if it still doesn't start you know the problem is not with the lift pump.

I will give this a go tomorrow as well. Glad I left the dash cover off as it was a faff to get off. Will it be pumping constantly with the relay off and so would I need to be careful when starting the car? 

[SuperbTWM]

29 minutes ago, 7600ee said:

I will give this a go tomorrow as well. Glad I left the dash cover off as it was a faff to get off. Will it be pumping constantly with the relay off and so would I need to be careful when starting the car? 

 

With the relay out it can't run. The relay has 4 connections. A pair that energises the relay and a pair that powers the lift pump when the relay contact makes once the relay is energised.

 

If you measure across two opposite pairs of the base you should find 12V across only of the pairs (make sure the lift pump is plugged in at this point) this is the pair that will power the pump when shorted together.

 

Shorting this makes it easier to tell if the pump is running as turning on the ignition only powers the pump for a few seconds, it then runs continuously once started. Having the pump running shouldn't matter a great deal for a short period. I have used this method of running the lift pump before the drain the fuel tank of diesel.

 

You can of course just check the relay with 12V and check if the contact makes.

[sepulchrave]

The lift pump supplies fuel to the filter housing to keep it full up, once the housing is full the fuel simply returns to the tank so it's getting pumped round in a circle, If the filter housing is empty then the engine cannot run.

[usedabused]

On 28/07/2017 at 23:25, 7600ee said:

 

Thanks will give this a go tomorrow! I have spoken to a garage who said check voltage fuses etc but will give in and put it in next week if no luck.

 

Also if you can get hold of any clear fuel pipe check for bubbles in he fuel line after the filter..

[7600ee]

Thanks for the help guys. It was a relay all along. When I checked the relays I heard all three click however I didn't realise there was actually a fourth relay. Fuel pump relay had gone. Got a new relay. I can now hear the pump loud as it seems like it has bubbles in the system (hear the swooshing noise). After taking the hose off the fuel filter there is definitely fuel going through the lines. 

 

However it's still not starting. Battery light is on. Air bag light is on. Check engine light is on. Glow plug light is flashing. Any more ideas?

[sepulchrave]

Sounds like you have some serious wiring issues, time to start tracing the faults, it would help if you could read all the fault codes.

[7600ee]

Just now, sepulchrave said:

Sounds like you have some serious wiring issues, time to start tracing the faults, it would help if you could read all the fault codes.

 

I had 4 codes earlier on tonight (I cleared them to see which ones would return). They are as follows

 

P0118 - Powertrain - Engine coolant temperature circuit high input

P0183 - Powertrain - Fuel Temperature sensor A circuit high input

P0230 - Powertrain - Fuel input primary circuit

P0600 - Powertrain - Serial Communication Link

 

When I got it it only had one (P0600)...

[sepulchrave]

You really need VCDS, those generic codes aren't very helpful, is the battery ok?

[7600ee]

Just now, sepulchrave said:

You really need VCDS, those generic codes aren't very helpful, is the battery ok?

 

Was looking into that and think I will buy a cable next couple days. Battery is on charge as its flat . I was using one earlier on tonight I took out from another car and it didn't start but sounded better than before the pump was fixed. Should using the battery of the other vehicle work? Its off a vauxhall zafira petrol (12v)

[sepulchrave]

If it fits it'll work, make sure it's fully charged as well, the ECU does not like low battery voltages and will throw codes.

[usedabused]

@7600ee

 

All the dash lights you are describing are typical of continuous cranking and flat battery dont let them loose your focus on the fault..

 

A pd does not need a lift pump to oporate the early pds wernt even fitted with a lift pump they only came along to increase power..

 

Were in the country are you I have full vcds and dont mind plugging it in...

 

Edited 1 August, 2017 by usedabused
Cos i felt like it

[sepulchrave]

Dude, that's not right, these engines have to have a functioning lift pump, as I explained above the lift pump fills the fuel filter housing which acts like a reservoir from which the tandem pump draws the fuel for the unit injectors.

[7600ee]

21 hours ago, usedabused said:

@7600ee

 

All the dash lights you are describing are typical of continuous cranking and flat battery dont let them loose your focus on the fault..

 

A pd does not need a lift pump to oporate the early pds wernt even fitted with a lift pump they only came along to increase power..

 

Were in the country are you I have full vcds and dont mind plugging it in...

 

 

Thats somewhat reassuring about the lights then. I'm just outside Dundee, Scotland so I think it would be quite a trip from where you are! Thanks for offering though. I'll pick up one of the £6 VAG COM cables from ebay.

[usedabused]

get some clear fuel pipe and see how much air is in your fuel lines.

just the short sections from the fuel filter to the metal pipes on the front.

The cheep cables are ok of ebay but you really do need to monitor fuel flow with full vcds ask around on any of the vag forums for someone closer with a full setup that knows what they are doing...

 

instead of changing batterys your best off fitting the og battery fully charged and use jump leeds off another vehicle running only place the negative clamp on a solid part of the poorlys cars engine..

[usedabused]

On 01/08/2017 at 08:55, sepulchrave said:

Dude, that's not right, these engines have to have a functioning lift pump, as I explained above the lift pump fills the fuel filter housing which acts like a reservoir from which the tandem pump draws the fuel for the unit injectors.

 

 

DUDE..

 

Do your homework..

 

The first pds were not even fitted with a lift pump .

The lift pump is only there to improve power and responce.

[usedabused]

The pd is a very refined power plant and unless you are fully clued up on them leeve well alone ,its no good using old style deisel engine diagnosis on these machines...

 

My money is on injector seals,,,

 

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