Hi

 

I realise this is a Skoda forum but I'm sure some of you have experience of standard Audi seats, i.e. without lumbar adjustment.  I am considering changing my Skoda for a second-hand Audi, either an A3 saloon or A4 Avant.  From my search of the Audi approved used selection, almost none of the cars for my specification (petrol Sport models) have lumbar support as this is an option for the Sport trim level.  Are Audi seats without lumbar support comfortable enough?  The vast majority of cars I have owned in the past 20 years have had lumbar support and I'm a bit nervous of committing to buy a car only to end up with low back pain after a long journey.

 

Any experiences much appreciated!

 

Thanks

 

TheITGuy

Seat comfort is a very subjective topic...

Id say just go find a few and sit in them tbh.

Alot of people dislike insignia seats for being "like theyre full of rocks", but i find mine quite a lot more comfy than my old mk1 octy..

@TheITGuy - That's a very subjective question - Worked example involving Citroen. A work mate and I both had BXs and found them comfortable enough to drive all day... I could also do this with a Xantia, but he got back pain after 30 minutes.

It also depends on how effective the in built lumbar support is. Apparently I have lumbar support on my Octy Scout, but even though the mechanism turns for ages it doesn't appear to make much difference. It's not as effective as that fitted to my Honda Civic nor my Nissan Primera. 

 

I ended up buying something similar to the item below. You cannot see it on my vehicle as I have seat covers on. Even without the seat covers, I would still fit it as it makes the seat sooooo much more comfy. I recently done an overnight trip to Aviemore with no issues and no constantly adjusting the seat. 

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00EIGCY2O/ref=asc_df_B00EIGCY2O58589890/?tag=googshopuk-21&creative=22122&creativeASIN=B00EIGCY2O&linkCode=df0&hvadid=310705025920&hvpos=1o11&hvnetw=g&hvrand=3151722734495163460&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=1007363&hvtargid=pla-599475353956

Lubar support isn't standard on BMW seats either. It's only with the powered seats option.

Saying that I've never had a sore back form the beemer and that's with some very long drives (10hr).

 

I had lumbar adjustment in my VRS but I was never sure if the handle actually did anything.

 

I definitely had it in the Accord but I'm not sure it really added anything.

 

I suspect that if your car seats are good it's not really necessary. Lumbar covers up where seats offer poor support maybe.

I've owned 5 Audis (S3, A4, 2xS4, RS4), 4 of which (S3, 2xS4, RS4) had electric seats with electric lumbar adjustment, but the other one (A4) even though it had manual seats still had a knob on the side of the side to provide lumbar adjustment.

 

So I'm puzzled when @TheITGuy mentions standard Audi seats not having lumbar adjustment

In Sport trim lumbar support is an option.  Even Whatcar mention it as a negative for the a4 sport in their buyer's guide.   I'm going to test drive an a3 sport saloon later so will double check and report back.

2 minutes ago, TheITGuy said:

In Sport trim lumbar support is an option.

That's another bit of Audi cost saving then - my A4 was a 1.9TDi Sport Avant which came with lumbar support and GmbH bodykit as standard.

If you have ever suffered with a bad back then do not compromise on a VAG seat without lumbar support, the manual lumbar support is barely effective, whilst the electric lumbar support is highly recommended.

 

If you only drive short distances then most seats will be fine for around 30 mins, after that a comfortable seat is worth it’s weight in gold.

I can definitely confirm that both the A3 and A4 in Sport trim do not have lumbar support as standard, at least 66 plates models.

As far as back / spine comfort is concerned i found my A4 more comfortable without lumbar support than my Octavia with lumbar support.

The Octavia does adjust correctly (i've had it to bits).....it is just ineffective......as has been mentioned.

 

I even made a cardboard template to highlight the differences in the seat back shape, as i suffer with back pain from lifting too many fridge freezers and kitchen equipment.

I use a seat back pad (thin piece of foam), works well. Tried that thing Finn uses, years ago.....Binned it...horrible....as said though...subjective.

On 22/02/2019 at 13:56, Aspman said:

Lubar support isn't standard on BMW seats either.

 

When we bought our BMW it was fitted with M sport seats but we still had to specify 4 way lumbar. Having had back issues in the past and problems with some seats it seemed a stupid omission. Turned out to be a waste of money. With no lumber support the seats were fine, when I added some I had pains. So for over 5 years I drove with no lumbar in perfect comfort.

 

On 22/02/2019 at 15:49, PetrolDave said:

So I'm puzzled when @TheITGuy mentions standard Audi seats not having lumbar adjustment

 

My next car may well be an A4 Avant 2.0 TFSI SE trim. Lumbar is definitely an extra and I will be specifying it despite my comment above. Not having it and being in pain would be a stupid and expensive mistake.

Its not just seats though. Swmbo has a torn tendon in the rear of her left shoulder. It bothered her for about 5 yrs. Then it faded away for 2yrs and came back randomly for a couple of days.

The cause of it flaring - she drove a pug 206 for the 5yrs it was at her. It stopped being painful when we got her the citigo. The random flare up was because of test driving a couple of 208's when we were looking at a potential  change of car for her. Back in the citigo for 3days and it hasnt bothered since (3 1/2yrs later). it was the peugot gear change.

Edited 27 February, 20197 yr by mac11irl

I find having the Auto (DSG) helps me get more comfortable in general than i would with a manual box.

 

Not having to reach the clutch pedal enables me to have the whole seat slightly further back, which enables me to stretch my right leg a little which i think helps my back too whilst still being in a safe driving position.

 

I find a lot of seats come up short in the base too, as good support for the leg...i think the vag group are the best for this...the Octavia is ok.

Thanks everyone for your replies.  I've been driving my Octavia for the past few days with the lumbar support round right back and there has been no discernible difference in low back comfort.  In fact I've driven 330 miles in it today with no adverse effects.  I'm going to assume that I can manage without this option for an Audi, which is just as well as I have today traded in the Octavia for a 66 plate A4 with no lumbar support!

Dont forget to give us an entirely subjective review of what the seats are like

 

On 27/02/2019 at 10:32, skidpan said:

 

When we bought our BMW it was fitted with M sport seats but we still had to specify 4 way lumbar. Having had back issues in the past and problems with some seats it seemed a stupid omission. Turned out to be a waste of money. With no lumber support the seats were fine, when I added some I had pains. So for over 5 years I drove with no lumbar in perfect comfort.

 

 

 

 

Funnily enough I had the same experience with my M135. I specced Lumbar adjust and found that the M-Sport seats were best with the lumbar out. Never had any back pain with it like that, even after 6 hours of continuous driving. Mind you I could hardly move for 5 mins once I got out of the car  

So 2 years on and my findings?  Not great.....

 

The first hour's drive in the car the day it was delivered gave me aching upper back muscles.  I then spent a long time adjusting the seat position to mitigate this, with only partial success.  Like most drivers, the past 12 months has seen a dramatic reduction in mileage.   In the past 2 -3 weeks, normal business trips have resumed, with the result that I'm currently suffering a painful right buttock, pain in the tendons that are on the underside of the right upper leg, a painful neck and aching upper back muscles again.   I'll have a look at the seating position tomorrow and make some adjustments....

 

Glen

have you considered that maybe you have an underlying issue that the car exacerbates? sciatica for example? have you tried some daily yoga to stretch everything out?

 

im going to assume you have a desk based job youve been doing from home, so you may just need to make some time each day to counteract the effects of sitting for ages.

I injured my back in 1999 by a piece of stupid heavy lifting, physiotherapy corrected the initial injury but has left me with 24/7 sciaticia in my left leg from secondary nerve damage. Initially this needed strong pain killers (Co-Codamol), but I weaned myself off them as quickly as I could.

 

One thing the physiotherapist taught me was the importance of the angle between the seat squab and the back should be around 110 degrees to minimise the distortion on the spine. Following this advice I can drive all day in every car I've owned since without any extra discomfort - Audi A4, Audi S4, Audi RS4, Skoda Octavia III, Citroen C1 & Toyota Aygo. I wouldn't say some of those have expensive multi-adjustable seats but I would advise getting advice on correct seat positioning.

 

3 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

the angle between the seat squab and the back should be around 110 degrees to minimise the distortion on the spine.

Yeah, but that means you're leant too far back to be able to steer properly unless the car has a reach adjustable steering column, and maybe even when it does...

It all depends...   Many people sit far too upright which leads to the seat not actually supporting them and then having to effectively hold themselves upright putting strain on their back.  Others then sit too leaned back so they can't see out or control the vehicle properly.

 

I had a guide somewhere that showed how to set a seat properly and it does work...   From someone with a herniated disc, although some people I've shown it to have ignored it as it's not how they usually drive (Eg the boy racers and ladies that like to sit bolt upright with the shell in their chest)

4 hours ago, KenONeill said:

Yeah, but that means you're leant too far back to be able to steer properly unless the car has a reach adjustable steering column, and maybe even when it does...

Not necessarily, neither my C1 nor Aygo had/have reach adjustable steering columns and even with my long legs I have no problem - admittedly I don't sit laid flat like a racing driver

Wow, thank you all for your replies.  I downloaded a guide from Physiomed and sat in the car earlier and worked through the various adjustments.  I identified the following challenges:

 

• I'm a short a*** - I'm 5 feet 6 inches tall so need the seat quite near to the pedals for my legs to reach.  I also wanted to raise the manual seat higher that it would go
• The seat base can be inclined and previously I had wound it down until it was flat.  The Physiomed guide advises against inclining the front of the seat, if anything it is preferable to decline it, which is not possible with my seat.  I did realise however, that with the seat base flat I my upper legs were not in fact making contact with the seat base at its front edge and that may be the cause of the under leg pain.  I have inclined the front of the seat base so that my upper legs are better supported
• Offset pedals.  Being a manual gearbox and with the transmission tunnel being more intrusive into the right footwell then the left, one's right foot is in line with the clutch, not the accelerator.  Not much I can do about this one....

I did move the steering wheel nearer, raise the seat back to be less inclined and lowered the seat belt mounting.

 

Here's the result so far:

 

 

Looking at this photo, I feel the seat does actually need to lower slightly as my head is declined to see through the windscreen - ideally it needs to be level.

 

Generally I can suffer from lower back issues (hence the original concern that the seat had no lumbar support) but was not expecting aches and pains in the upper back, never mind the buttock!

 

Thanks for all your input.

 

Glen

 

 

 

 

@skomaz @PetrolDave Yeah, but I like to sit with my arms bent at the elbows like a saloon racer or rally driver, or indeed like @TheITGuy is demonstrating. In fact, his text describes a pretty similar position to I use except that I'm 5'10".