The Old Fabia Door motor conundrum - switches control opposite windows

[Bazmcc]

So I have a 2006 fabia vrs here in which the door motor stopped working after being sat up for a while.

I got another motor (2 actually) with the same part numbers etc.

 

The first motor i fitted works as follows.

My pass switch up puts the drivers window down, pass switch down puts the drivers door window up.

My drivers switch up puts the passengers window up, drivers switch down puts the passengers door window down.

 

Second motor was installed to test.

Windows worked perfectly as normal, pass window up and down, drivers window up and down as normal.

Reinstalled door card, put drivers window down all the way no problem, window came up 6 inches and then just stopped and hasn't worked since.

 

First motor back in again, same issues as above.

 

Key in the door reset etc fixes nothing because one window goes up and the other goes down.

 

Any help would be great, I don't mind soldering or rewiring if needed. 

 

I have plenty of experience in wiring, have vcds, vag tacho, vag can commander etc etc etc.

[sepulchrave]

Sounds like one of those motors is for LHD and the other one is faulty.

Send 'em both back.

[Bazmcc]

So despite the main part number being the same they can be LHD and RHD?

Is it possible to rewire the switches?  I have a spare switch unit.  I wouldn't mind doing this if it got me by for a bit.

[Bazmcc]

And I know it appears to be a lhd vs rhd type of problem but I have seen this same problem appear on another couple of posts out of the blue with the original motor so I'm not sure if there's some way to do a reset of everything or if there's a problem elsewhere.

[Breezy_Pete]

I would be tempted to take the cover off the circuit board part of the one that worked briefly and see whether there's anything obviously burnt/cooked.

What is the full part number of all the units in question?

 

[Bazmcc]

6Y2959802

 

[Breezy_Pete]

Should be right, driver's door RHD, see item (3) here: https://skoda.7zap.com/en/cz/fabia/fab/2006-453/9/959-959010/

 

 

[Bazmcc]

I'll go and get the one that stopped and open it up.

[Bazmcc]

Checked out the board under magnification.  Nothing obvious wrong, no cracks, scorches or burned components.  One large relay on the board.  My initial thoughts are to test it but it's been a while since I worked with relays and without knowing how it's wired i'll need to do some research to fin out how it's operated.  I'm going to put a few volts to the brushes and just make sure the motor fires up first.

[Breezy_Pete]

I don't have one here to play with unfortunately. Presumably both of the recently tried ones were secondhand? 

I suspect that all the relay does is feed power to the whole module from the permanent supply when the unit is 'woken up', however that occurs.

[Bazmcc]

Yes both second hand.  The relay is on the motor side of the circuit so it would be switched by the controller and send power to the motor terminals.

 

[Breezy_Pete]

Makes sense.

Not sure why I was thinking what I said before about the relay.

Try to figure out which pins of the relay are the coil and measure its resistance.

 

 

[JWvrs25]

my windows do this sometimes, one switch controls the wrong window or they go up instead of down. 

[Bazmcc]

So here's the relay.  I'll have a look at the circuit and see if i can test it.  It would be great if it was as simple as a faulty relay

https://uk.farnell.com/panasonic-electric-works/act512/relay-automotive-spdt-14vdc-20a/dp/2292929

[Bazmcc]

Relay tested and working perfectly fine.

 

Back to the drawing board.  There's a QR code on one of the chips which i scanned and it just came up with the number 00421478 so probably some number relevant to Temic who make these boards.

[Bazmcc]

I took the wiring diagram from a 9n3 polo to get the pin outs of the 2 connectors that go into the top of the window motor.  I'm not sure it'll help much but worth having it here for reference.  If someone has elsawin for skoda to cross reference it would be good but i'm pretty sure the pins should be the same.

 

T6aa - 6 pin connector
1 - ro/ws - front left window switch (pin 4)
2 - sw/bl - LIN bus
3 - ro/gn - rear left door switch  pin 4 - not used
4 - ro/bl - rear right door switch pin 2 - not used
5 - li/gr - rear window reg isolator switch - not used
6 - nc

 

t8h - 8 pin connector
1 - br - earth on A pillar
2 - ro/ge - fuse 31 25A
3 - li/ws - LIN bus
4 - br/ge - drivers side lock module pin 8
5 - bl/ws - drivers side lock module pin 4
6 - br - earth in door loom
7 - ro/ge - front right window switch (pin 2)
8 - bl/ge - drivers side lock module pin 4

[Breezy_Pete]

There are some wire colour differences at least, and fuse number (46 or 58 on Fab, I think). Will try to come up with a Fabia list at lunchtime.

Circuits are confusing at first glance 'cos they only seem to refer to LHD vehicles, with driver's side being on the left.  Might be just that it's too early...

Edited 25 March, 2019 by Wino

[Breezy_Pete]

For Mk1 Fabia with just front electric windows, I see the following:

 

T6b/1 white/black to window switch (pin 6)

T6b/2 black/blue from fuse 11via pin 2 of blue 6-way connector at A-pillar

 

T8h/1 Brown (thick) earth to pin 1 of black 4-way conn at A-pillar

Pin 2 Red/white from fuse 58 via pin 2 of black 4-way conn at A-pillar

Pin 3 Grey/White LIN bus to pin 6 of brown 6-way connector at A-pillar

Pin 4 brown/yellow door contact switch, to pin 8 of door lock conn and pin 2 of brown 6-way connector at A-pillar

Pin 5 yellow/blue to pin 4 of door lock connector

Pin 6 Brown thin earth to connection in door loom

Pin 7 Black/green to window switch pin 5

Pin 8 black/blue to pin 5 of white 6-way connector at A-pillar

 

Please let me know if that ties up with what you see. A few differences from your list.

[LB123]

Few years back we had a MK3 golf TDI that started doing strange things with its windows, up and down by themselves but never crossed over controls that I remember. Local VW indy found a frayed wire in the A pillar boot that was presumably giving intermittent signal/earth. So I would suggest checking the wires in the rubber boot between door and A pillar for continuity/shorts/etc.

Thinking about it the driver window worked opposite to the other three when it had its spasms. It would close and the others open at the same time.

Edited 25 March, 2019 by LB123

[Bazmcc]

I'll hopefully get to check these pin numbers and colours out this evening to compare.

[YS53]

On 24/03/2019 at 20:08, JWvrs25 said:

my windows do this sometimes, one switch controls the wrong window or they go up instead of down. 

 

Ditto - our Polo 9n does this sometimes at random - works ok 98% of the time and then all of a sudden the wrong window moves LOL,usually sorts itself out fairly quickly so far.

Until it happened to me I used to take the pi55 out of my better half for using the wrong switch 

[Bazmcc]

@Wino

Your colours appear to match what I have in the door.  I want to go through each pin and check it out with a multimeter.  It may be the weekend before I get a chance to do that though.  I'm particularly interested in finding out if the earth connections are solid and reliable as dead earth lines can reverse signals in certain circuits.  We see this sometimes in tail lights in cars where the earth is dead and the wrong bulb starts flashing.  French cars are prime candidates for this.

 

My plan is to basically wire direct lines to each pin to where it should be connected elsewhere in the car to see if i can identify any suspect parts of the loom.  Because the fabia door cards are riveted it rules out me doing a proper test mid loom within the door without having to rebuild it.