Would these issues put you off buying a second hand car?

[theandywaite]

Looking for a used vRS 230 (the pre-facelift special model) and struggling to find one that's up to my standards.  I'm wondering if I'm expecting too much - interested in your opinions.

 

I went to see one today at a Skoda dealer that on the surface of it was immaculate, and the ideal spec, but on closer inspection a few things made me nervous.

 

• Panel gap between bonnet & wing on passenger side is too big. Looking under the bonnet the bolts holding the wing on have clearly been disturbed and bolted up in a different place.  Also the arch liner should be "tucked in" behind the edge of the wing but it's "tucked out" in one spot. It's definitely been taken off / adjusted for some reason. Weirdly it doesn't look like the wing has been painted to me.  If it has, it's a bloody good job - the orange peel matches the other wing which looks original, and there looks to be a similar amount of dirt on the back of the panel. The front bumper has had some kind of paint repair, but looks a tidy job. Front headlights are both date marked with the correct month / year which suggests to me they're original and there hasn't been heavy impact.
• The plastic trim around the rear seat release (where you pull to fold the seats flat) has come away (dealer said they'd fix, but I'll believe it when I see it)
• Rear park sensors are faulty but they're definitely fixing that
• Rear tyres are mismatched brands (Toyo Proxes one side, Pirelli P-Zero on the other)

 

Those faults aside it's got the tidiest interior I've seen by far - it's faultless and way ahead of the other 4 I've seen. The exterior is also immaculate and again far tidier than others I've seen. It looks stunning. Incredible to drive and it's straight and true, no weird noises.

 

Half of me is saying don't buy it, wait for a better one.  The other half of me is saying "be realistic, it's a used car" and I'm wondering if I'll actually ever find better...

 

What would you do?

 

Edited 5 June, 2019 by theandywaite

[theandywaite]

Just to add it's nearly 3 years old, 25k on the clock.

[Ootohere]

?

Is that car already prepared for sale? Or is the salesperson saying just in?

That is actually pathetic if that is how they present cars.

?

Is it a Skoda Approved Used car?     I would hope it is 'Much Cheapness' and they are going to have everything put right and do a 24 month warranty on it.

 

?

So what is the Service History, is it Fixed Service Intervals, so had 2 oil and filter changes, brake fluid changed, 

and any Warranty Work showing?

Edited 5 June, 2019 by Skoffski

[theandywaite]

1 minute ago, Skoffski said:

?

Is that car prepared for sale?

That is actually pathetic if that is how they present cars.

?

Is it a Skoda Approved Used car?     I would hope it is 'Much Cheapness' and they are going to have everything put right and do a 24 month warranty on it.

 

Prepped for sale, except for the park sensors which they have a part on order for. It's not especially cheap. Yes approved used so 12 month warranty with that.

 

To be fair it's easily the tidiest I've looked at (although the first I've seen at a Skoda dealer).

[theandywaite]

Gap difference pic.

[Ootohere]

So much for them to do.

 

Like a VW Approved Bodyshop correct the panel gaps if their technicians can not be bothered.

Full Alignment check carried out.

Matching Tyres on axles.   & a bit of spending money and doing the checks that they say will be done as vehicles come from many sources.

?

Who was this Registered to an individual, VW Finance or AN Other?

Edited 5 June, 2019 by Skoffski

[theandywaite]

Just now, Skoffski said:

So much for them to do.

 

Like a VW Approved Bodyshop correct the panel gaps if their technicians can not be bothered.

 Full Alignment check carried out.

Matching Tyres on axles.   & a bit of spending money and doing the checks that they say will be done as vehicles come from many sources.

?

Who was this Registered to an individual, VW Finance or AN Other?

 

VWFS first owner

[Ootohere]

So like all used cars, no idea who drove it, or how many, or if a car rejected at some point. 

It is all a gamble and good for you because you can have them turn out a perfect car.

 

There is a sad Skoda Approved Used car thread in General Automotive chat.   Buyer beware with Skoda Approve Used.  Skoda Customer Services could not care less.

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/443226-skoda-approved-multi-point-check

 

Edited 5 June, 2019 by Skoffski

[theandywaite]

5 minutes ago, Skoffski said:

So like all used cars, no idea who drove it, or how many, or if a car rejected at some point. 

It is all a gamble and good for you because you can have them turn out a perfect car.

 

There is a sad Skoda Approved Used car thread in General Automotive chat.   Buyer beware with Skoda Approve Used.  Skoda Customer Services could not care less.

 

Thanks -  I really don't hold much regard for the approved schemes or the warranties. I've seen absolute rotters as "approved" used cars on main dealer forecourts of all brands, and I've had first hand experience of how bad Skoda warranty is with our old Rapid.

 

Obviously any used car is a gamble. Forgetting who is selling it, would you accept those flaws or stick it out for a perfect car? (I'm guessing the latter from what you're saying!)

[Ootohere]

I would maybe have this one if presented perfectly prepared.

 Now that they never got it away un-noticed.

 

You can find perfect cars that have been badly accident damaged and perfectly repaired, never claimed on the insurance so you are none the wiser.

This is not happening here, so if minor damage, so be it.

Have in writing what they will do including the Service with filters and brake fluid changed not just Oil & Filter. 

 

This one you have see the flaws so they can get their lazy butt in action and have pride in their job.

Buyer is king. 

[Gaz]

If it were me, I'd have walked away, purely on the panel gap.  The other bit's wouldn't be deal breakers.

 

I walked away from a Golf Clubsport recently.  Told them why at a VW main dealership and they weren't interested, their argument being Autotrader analytics showed real interest in the car, so they were confident it was bound to sell.  Like you, it didn't live up to my standards - I think you're right to listen to those doubts.

 

Gaz

Edited 6 June, 2019 by V6TDI
Typo (sighs)

[FatWolfie]

@Skoffski makes some good points about pre owned cars. Sometimes the immaculate ones are less “honest” than ones like the one you describe. You can’t polish a turd, but you can roll it in glitter...

 

But I think that if you’re having doubts/questions in your mind now like you are, are you going to be really happy with the car ever - or will you be thinking that maybe you should have waited a few weeks and found a better one? Buyers remorse is not a happy place to be (having been there myself on more than one occasion..)

 

Also I would always wonder about how well looked after that particular car had been when the previous owner was happy to run different tyre makes on the same axle. Not imho a good idea, even if identical sizes the tread patterns would differ leading to different tyre performance..

[Ootohere]

Arnold Clark, Evans Halshaw, & many others be that main dealers or car supermarkets, or cars that are bought at BCA and then prepared by them for the Dealers that bought them will fit odd tyres as they get a car in from auction, and lease cars into Kwikfit, City Tyres, ATS Eurocar ect etc get what ever tyre might be on the rack regardless of different from one on that axle or the others on the car.

[penguin17]

You half expect it with dealers though, or I do.  It must be part of their business model to do as little as possible to make a car 'sellable' and only rectify issues that the buyer picks up on.   Why spend hundreds on a car until you know you're costs are going to be covered shortly afterwards?! Pi55e5 me right off! 

 

@theandywaite the fact you've asked on here means that you have your doubts and your spidey senses are tingling about this car; go with your gut and just walk away.    Those few issues could be from a catalog of non-related incidents or could be from a low impact shunt of shorts.  e.g; rear end shunt, tyre goes pop, things in the boot move forward and snap the trim, rear bumper gets repaired but parking sensor doesn't and front bumper hits the car in front, knocking the bonnet alignment out.....or could just be several, unrelated and 'innocent' signs of a neglectful first owner.    

[theandywaite]

Thanks everyone, you're right.

 

Sorely tempted as it's my dream car and the 230 seems to be a bit rare, especially in meteor grey. But I think I'll sit it out and hopefully another will come up soon!

[silver1011]

I'd say buy it.

 

You looked at four others before this one, and this one, despite the minor issues, is the best by far?

 

If the paint on the wings is original, as are the headlights, then chances are its had fresh paint on the front bumper and/or bonnet, no big deal. A minor parking scrape, debris off the road, vandalism etc. all normal for a 3 year / 30,000 mile car.

 

I've just bought an approved used Mercedes which has had a smart repair on one corner of the front bumper. Looks good enough to me, so didn't put me off.

 

The inner wheelarches are often removed to access the back of the headlights for bulb changes, and for cambelt, clutch and flywheel changes, so potentially nothing untoward there.

 

You're paying a premium by buying approved used though, so stand firm, present the dealer with a list of rectifications that are required for you to put down a deposit...

 

- Two new rear tyres

- Realignment of the bonnet

- New rear seat latch

- Fix the parking sensors

 

For what its worth, the Mercedes needed:

 

- Replacement USB port

- Tyre inflation kit

- Wing mirror repair

- Map updates

- Two new rear tyres

- Refit twisted rear seatbelt

- New boot seal

- Full third-party offsite valet

 

None of which the dealer would have touched had I not factored them into the negotiations.

 

If you're looking for a 100% perfect used car, you'll be looking for a long time.

 

By the way, here is the old and new, the old Superb has a brand new bonnet on it, fixed under Skoda's 12 year anti-perforation warranty @ 8 years old / 170,000 miles. It was done at a franchised Skoda dealer bodyshop. One side of the bonnet now sits lower than the other, panel gap variations, missing plastic clips on the underside etc. etc.

 

 

Buy the best car you can find (this one) and perfect it yourself.

 

Edited 6 June, 2019 by silver1011

[Ootohere]

As far as 3 year old Octavia vRS in Meteor Grey.

Like 3 year old Octavia vRS in any colour there will be more around soon as they are going back into trade at end of lease.

They will not be rare as hens teeth and worth a premium and what ever the supposed value is now, (asking prices) they will be worth less after September.

Plenty out of manufacturers warranty cars will be clogging up forecourts.

[SurreyJohn]

When you say nearly 3 years old, how many weeks or days factory warranty do you have remaining ?

 

As for getting tyres regularised, best to ask what type they are proposing to put on, might be worth agreeing a discount instead and choosing what you want afterwards, or paying a bit extra to cover the difference for your choice of tyre rather than their accountants choice of tyre.

 

Ask to see a print out of service schedule, for a car doing 9k per year was it on fixed or long life service,  would be suspicious if it had delayed servicing as that always suggests previous long term renter didn't really care

[Ootohere]

There are members here regularly asking what they can get away with doing in the way of a service before handing back a car.

1 service in the first year then a major service, or 2 minor and no 3rd service etc.

 

As to one Registered Keeper & VWFS,  the car could have been through many hands, been a courtesy car for a body shop or a loaner to those on 'black hole' waiting lists for vehicles.

You just never know unless you maybe put up a Registration Number and ask, 

that can sometimes get a response from a former driver of a 'Ex Management' used car or 'Skoda Approved Used Car'.

[theandywaite]

5 hours ago, silver1011 said:

I'd say buy it.

 

You looked at four others before this one, and this one, despite the minor issues, is the best by far?

 

If the paint on the wings is original, as are the headlights, then chances are its had fresh paint on the front bumper and/or bonnet, no big deal. A minor parking scrape, debris off the road, vandalism etc. all normal for a 3 year / 30,000 mile car.

  

I've just bought an approved used Mercedes which has had a smart repair on one corner of the front bumper. Looks good enough to me, so didn't put me off.

 

The inner wheelarches are often removed to access the back of the headlights for bulb changes, and for cambelt, clutch and flywheel changes, so potentially nothing untoward there.

  

You're paying a premium by buying approved used though, so stand firm, present the dealer with a list of rectifications that are required for you to put down a deposit...

  

- Two new rear tyres

- Realignment of the bonnet

- New rear seat latch

- Fix the parking sensors

 

For what its worth, the Mercedes needed:

 

- Replacement USB port

- Tyre inflation kit

- Wing mirror repair

- Map updates

- Two new rear tyres

- Refit twisted rear seatbelt

- New boot seal

- Full third-party offsite valet

 

None of which the dealer would have touched had I not factored them into the negotiations.

 

If you're looking for a 100% perfect used car, you'll be looking for a long time.

  

By the way, here is the old and new, the old Superb has a brand new bonnet on it, fixed under Skoda's 12 year anti-perforation warranty @ 8 years old / 170,000 miles. It was done at a franchised Skoda dealer bodyshop. One side of the bonnet now sits lower than the other, panel gap variations, missing plastic clips on the underside etc. etc.

 

 

Buy the best car you can find (this one) and perfect it yourself.

 

 

Interesting counter opinion. Fairly sure the wing is original as there's very clear marks on it where the bolts used to fasten.  If it was a fresh wing then surely those wouldn't be there.

[silver1011]

Correct, get it bought and enjoy it, life's too short.

[Ootohere]

The Wing can be off another vehicle of the same colour.

 

A member here that went to collect a brand new car spotted damage to the front and rightly kicked off.

It would have been a simple 'Smart repair', but after posts here saying reject it, including from me that used to be a sprayer, the dealership said they were having the front of a car removed from another new car and transported to them to fit.

I took it with a pinch of salt, but these things do happen.

[Gaz]

7 hours ago, theandywaite said:

Sorely tempted as it's my dream car and the 230 seems to be a bit rare

 

What is it that draws you to a 230 in particular (as in over a 220 or 245)?

 

Gaz

[theandywaite]

Just now, V6TDI said:

 

What is it that draws you to a 230 in particular (as in over a 220 or 245)?

 

Gaz

 

I definitely want something a bit "special" and I'm keen on the extras (VAQ diff, heated seats, black pack, 19" xtremes etc) so that rules out the standard 220 / FL 230.

 

I would consider a FL 245 special edition if a nice one came up - and the wider track + quicker steering of that model does appeal. But really I prefer the look of the pre-facelift,  I like the leather instead of alcantara and the old stereo with physical buttons (touch buttons hack me off).

 

 

[ScoutCJB]

If your questioning yourself then walk away.  Personally I would ask them to adjust the (panel gap issue) then go back and review to see if it's suitable.

Are they going to put 2 new tyres on so it matches , probably not.  If you don't buy it someone else will (and maybe less fickle so they don't have to put money into rectification) ..... that's not a dig at you, that just business.  PArking sensors should be an easy fix.

 

On my current Scout it had 4 new tyres on when I viewed it (they were utter budget crap), history showed it had been to KwikFit previously for all tyre replacements and had decent ones so expect it was px'd with borderline tread.  I had just had 4 new Continental Wintercontacts fitted to my old Scout and they were same size so I got them to swap the tyres over as part of the deal (they picked up the cost for this).  Kessy didn't work but that was just a battery.  Job done.

 

Now my old Scout was a different story, brought it with a turbo noise which they said they would rectify before collection.  Upon collection it appeared to be fixed (they put a reckon turbo on) but noise returned after 30 miles or so.  The noise was rectified after 1st return visit (It was a DPF gasket) but then I started having cold start power issues.  It had a further 4 return visits, I was without the car for nearly 6 weeks in total, utter nightmare.  After a catalogue of turbo replacements finally a new VAG turbo was fitted - still the same issue.  They sent it for dials to a specialist (which I requested originally) and a faulty valve wad identified in the rocker cover.  New rocker cover fitted at £200 and a new battery hey presto, sorted.  I dread to think how much money and labour they threw at my old Scout.  The gen turbo, rocker, & battery all in I think was £2k let alone the refurbishing of original and all labour and dials.

 

Moral of story - if it ain't right on test drive, walk away.