An interesting conversion Jars, if you have any more pictures I would like to see them.

 

What are the dimensions of the mattress? I am guessing that it is a reduced length & wont suit the Dutch!

 

Once you start adding comfort features and luxuries the vehicles fast become large & heavy, I am a great fan of the split screen & bay window VW campers and also the tiny Romahome conversions on the Citroen C5 etc, all of these are also very practical vehicles for double use as a tradesman/builders van & dont have parked in secure storage all their life.

 

A pop-top VW conversion could sleep 2 adults, 2 teenagers (or adults at a push) and a young child at the rear above the engine but have a footprint no larger than a Volvo Estate, the split screen with the twin opening doors was the best packaging wise because the cooker & sink were often mounted on them giving you an outside kitchen or a sheltered awning if opened & locked at 90°

 

Tha bay window model not having the front bulkhead had the advantage of being able to pass from the rear seats to the front seats.

I had an Esterel folding caravan until a few years ago, I regret selling it now, that was superbly designed & could sleep 4 adults in 6m2.

 

One thing that struck me about it which is so different to modern caravans was the obsession with keeping the weight to a minimum, the cupboard doors & table were a honeycomb construction of formica over corrugated paper stiffening, the storage cupboards & shelves etc were thin plywood & wood frames, none of it would last 10 minutes against modern children but in their day they did not get damaged, to have a holiday was such a priveledge, to own your own caravan something really to cherish.

12 minutes ago, J.R. said:

An interesting conversion Jars, if you have any more pictures I would like to see them.

 

What are the dimensions of the mattress? I am guessing that it is a reduced length & wont suit the Dutch!

 

Once you start adding comfort features and luxuries the vehicles fast become large & heavy

Can’t find anymore pictures  What were you hoping to see??

 

The bed was a full double width wise, but maybe a few inches shorter. I am 5’11 and was able to stretch out a little. Far from cramped TBH. But no, won’t work well for Dutch people! Having the bed in that orientation allowed for loads of storage underneath, which was accessed via the rear doors. 
 

I agree with the additional weight being an issue, which is why the first conversion didn’t go well on the motorway. Also used cheap wood for the internals, which is much heavier than the much more expensive, but proper wood for the usage stuff we used in the Renault Master. 
 

Using a modern van and engine allows for a cheeky remap, which of course have much more power & torque than other older vans, hence looking at a Merc Sprinter as we speak. 

@Tech1e did a great thread on here when he converted a Renault/ Peugeot/ Citroen van into a camper. 
It's probably in the non Skoda projects section somewhere. IIRC he was selling it recently.

Edited 19 September, 20205 yr by Lee01

7 minutes ago, jars said:

For me, a SWB T5 or equivalent is no good for anything more than a weekend.
 

My father in law and I converted one a few years ago and took it to Glastonbury for a week and hated it. The pop up roof was like a greenhouse in the summer heat, the rock and roll bed was as hard as MDF and there was simply no room to swing a mouse in it. 
 

We’ve converted a few different vans over the years, and for me, the best has been the Renault Master MWB hightop; a good engine that will cruise at decent motorway speeds, has plenty of space for a decent and comfortable bed and was able to easily take a moped on the rear.

 

We’ve also had an old Hymer, which was awesome inside with the drop down bed and own shower, but it was simply too wide to navigate around Europe. 
 

Below pic; top left is the last one we did. Renault Master MWB hightop. Had all the usual cooking and washing facilities, a toilet and permanent double bed. By far the best all around one, for me. The father in law took this to the Alps in winter and had no issues with the temperature. Very happily spent a week working at Glastonbury in this van. 
 

Top right is obviously the T5. It went well in the motorway, small enough to get everywhere but felt very cramped. Again, took this to Glasto for the week and was not comfortable or happy with it. 
 

Bottom right was the first one I got involved in converting back in 2014. I didn’t really like this one as the bed had to be made each evening and would only cruise at around 50mph. Painfully slow using across Europe. This wasn’t too bad for the week. Just a PITA taking down and putting up the bed each night. 
 

Bottom left was the old Hymer motor home. As I said, awesome piece of kit inside but was simply far too wide for European roads. As a left hooker, my wife hated us using it in the UK on country roads as she felt she was in the middle of the road facing oncoming busses and the like when driving down b-roads. 

Currently looking at a LWB Mercedes to convert next.

 

I appreciate you have different desires and needs, such as it doubling up as your daily, and budget by the sounds of it! 
 

Like some have suggested, I would rent one and take it away to see how it fits you, how well you can use it, and

most importantly, how comfortable you are spending time in it. 
 

 

 

Hi Jars. Nice pics & Interesting info based on your experience. 

 

For me a SWB T6 / Transit / Traffic / Vivaro / Proace or similar size van was the size limit I set myself based on the fact that it needed to be a dual use low height daily driver & a camper. As such some compromises were  are inevitable. We were planning to add an awning or better still use our Air Beam tent to provide more living space. My sister has a T6 which she has travelled all over Europe in for 4-5 weeks at a time. I think its a Beach model so it doesn't even have a fitted sink / cooker. That said she & the brother in law are not adverse to roughing it & wild camping. Not really my thing.  

 

The only way I could consider a larger van for more useable practicality would be to keep my daily driver & only use the larger van for trips /holidays. The wife has a small Fiat 500 cos she won't drive my car (she says it's too big / powerful for her!) so we would need space for the van & 2 cars. Without moving house or paving over the front garden we only have space for 2 cars so 3 vehicles is not really an option for us unless we share her 500 & sell the Superb - & that ain't never going to happen on my watch!! I guess we could consider trading in both the Superb & her 500 for something else to share as a daily driver & get a van but I suspect that would work out too expensive overall. 

Finance is a factor as always. Having recently retired I have limited funds available & I have no plans to return to work to fund a campervan project. I've therefore come to the conclusion that which ever way I look at the whole van scenario I'm pretty much snookered so I guess we'll stick to tent camping during the summer & self catering / Airbnb / hotel  holidays at other times of the year - which of course is not really possible at the moment as we face a 2nd wave of Covid. I think it's a case of battening down the hatches & see how things develop over the next 6-12 months.    

 

 

54 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

I well remember sleeping in the roof bunk of a Commer Dormobile and waking up in the morning to see ice on the inside of the pop-up roof above my bunk!

 

For me good insulation (possibly double glazed windows), a fire, a hob, a chemical loo (with a separate waste tank not an all-in-one) and a solid roof (probably a high top) are the essentials in a camper van.

 

Ha ha. Slightly off topic but that reminds me of when I was a kid. Without central heating in the house & no separate room heating upstairs we often woke up to ice on the inside of our bedroom windows. Whoever was 1st to get up had to light the pot belly stove in the kitchen & the ground floor front / back room open fires. It was warmer in the school classrooms than at home! The big freeze during the winter of 1963 was brutal & lasted for 3 months. As kids we thought it was great fun playing in the snow & ice for such a long time. No snow days for schools & work in those days you just had to deal with it.   

God I hate compromising, but always necessary  We’re fortunate we have family in Devon where we can park it up when not in use. We certainly wouldn’t be able to keep it up here in Bristol, unless like you it was one of our daily. 

 

An awning will help create space for sitting around and eating, but still won’t ease the cramped feel when you’re trying to get ready for bed. Not enough room really for both of you to undress inside the van! 
 

Could you get away with a MWB? For comfort, I now also insist on at least a mid top van. 

 

That said, it sounds like you’ve already come to the realisation that having a camper won’t work for you, which I would agree on based on your above post. 
 

I’ve not been in a T6 yet, but don’t reckon the internal dimensions are too dissimilar to a T5 assuming it’s also a SWB?
 

I didn’t have anything to do with the below conversion, but even a professional one is still very limited in space, especially once the seat you can see is pulled out as the bed 

 

 

29 minutes ago, jars said:

God I hate compromising, but always necessary  We’re fortunate we have family in Devon where we can park it up when not in use. We certainly wouldn’t be able to keep it up here in Bristol, unless like you it was one of our daily. 

 

An awning will help create space for sitting around and eating, but still won’t ease the cramped feel when you’re trying to get ready for bed. Not enough room really for both of you to undress inside the van! 
 

Could you get away with a MWB? For comfort, I now also insist on at least a mid top van. 

 

That said, it sounds like you’ve already come to the realisation that having a camper won’t work for you, which I would agree on based on your above post. 
 

I’ve not been in a T6 yet, but don’t reckon the internal dimensions are too dissimilar to a T5 assuming it’s also a SWB?
 

I didn’t have anything to do with the below conversion, but even a professional one is still very limited in space, especially once the seat you can see is pulled out as the bed 

 

 

 

Storage / parking is probable our main issue. If I lived on farm or had more space no problem but I don't & I wouldn't want to pay someone £12-£20 a week for secure storage either. 

 

I'm told the T6 & T5 are virtually the same dimensions just upgraded fittings, engines, tech etc. I must admit I'm not a fan of the Classic side kitchen layout especially if has a fixed position bed. If the bed is on adjustable runners then a side kitchen is ok as the bed can be moved back & forth for more flexible for storage when travelling. However, my preferred layout for any of these size vans is a rear side kitchen with two single beds which gives you access to the rear during the night & a separate lounge / kitchen area during the day.

Have a look at this one by Three Bridge who are near me in Wolverton / Milton Keynes. LWB T6 with rear kitchen

 

If needed the 2 single beds can be converted into a king double with infill panels between them or in the case of the example above, moved together on a slider mechanism to create a double - clever. I must admit most of these layouts normally use the larger / LWB vans which can then have a proper flush toilet as well as per the above example. That said I've seen a rear side kitchen layout done on a SWB van but without the fitted flush toilet - just a portable loo in a cupboard instead. This rear side kitchen layout also gives a long 3.5 - 4m corridor right down the middle of the van from the back doors to the front seats so longer items & even part broken bikes can be stored inside the van while travelling rather than having to hang them of the back or on the roof. With a pop top roof it can still sleep 4 & with a twin front passenger seat travel with 5 belted seats. As you say though it's a bit "cosy" for any more than 2 people unless you use awnings or tents for separate living / sleeping areas. 

 

Not sure why I'm still getting excited about all this as I have made my decision not to go down the van route, unless that is I win the £125,000 Planet Rock phone number draw competition which the wife has bought 3 tickets for. I figure there's more chance of winning this than the National Lottery so it was work a punt  

19 hours ago, Colin170CR said:

you never see the country when you visit on business. You only see the inside of a taxi, plane, hotel room, factory / office, restaurant & back home. The best way to see a country is to tour / travel in it & keep away from the tourist traps. I guess that's why getting a campervan was on my radar.

 

My situation exactly!  Although having read this thread so far I'm beginning also to wonder about the economics of the situation ...

5 hours ago, StickyMicky said:

 

My situation exactly!  Although having read this thread so far I'm beginning also to wonder about the economics of the situation ...

 

I don't think the economics were ever going to be great. That said campervans do hold their value way better than regular motors some of which depreciate at a horrendous rate. It is actually possible to buy a campervan, run it for a year or two & sell it for about the same price as originally paid. This would probably have to be a VW model as they have a big following & command a fair premium over the other makes. The biggest issue is stomping up the dosh to get one & get on the ladder - just like buying a house really! Financing is always an option & for some its the only option. For me at my time of life I do not want to be racking up any sizeable debts even if they are secured on the vehicle itself. 

Camping , Caravaning & Campervaning is a lifestyle choice so the economics are generally not a major consideration. You do it because you like & buy into the lifestyle. As for me, I can take it or leave it so it's not the be all & end all or a lifetime dream. I have decided to leave it - at least for the time being!! 

Maybe you've already got the best compromise? you have a large comfortable capable car in your Superb and maybe you should continue to invest in the best camping gear you can afford?

 

 

@Jars if you did all the conversion work on the interior pictures that's some outstanding work

On 19/09/2020 at 11:46, Lee01 said:

@Tech1e did a great thread on here when he converted a Renault/ Peugeot/ Citroen van into a camper. 
It's probably in the non Skoda projects section somewhere. IIRC he was selling it recently.

 

 

While its not as exciting as a new camper van, I think your new plan is probably sensible. We've thought about a camper ourselves and my parents even have a caravan we could borrow, but in the end we came to the conclusion that it was a lot less ballache and about the same cost to just rent a cottage for 3-4 weeks spread over the year. Bear in mind we are a 4-person family with 2 pre-tenage kids and also a springer spaniel so that would be less than fun in a camper.

 

I know its really not a financial decision at all, but by the time the depreciation (on a caravan probably £1k/year), insurance at £400, 'servicing' at £200 and then site fees of £30/night on average then I recon our cottage holidays aren't very different and we have a nice cottage and no setup/takedown/storage issues.

 

still, its a heart decision really.

 

4 hours ago, edwards said:

I know its really not a financial decision at all, but by the time the depreciation (on a caravan probably £1k/year), insurance at £400, 'servicing' at £200 and then site fees of £30/night on average then I recon our cottage holidays aren't very different and we have a nice cottage and no setup/takedown/storage issues.

Owning a camper van only makes some sort of financial sense if you use it at least once a month for weekends away, maybe alone or at a club (e.g. Caravan Club) meet, as well as for main holidays, half-terms, etc.

21 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

Owning a camper van only makes some sort of financial sense if you use it at least once a month for weekends away, maybe alone or at a club (e.g. Caravan Club) meet, as well as for main holidays, half-terms, etc.

 

I bought my Citroen Relay for £1600 six+ years ago. I spent around £2k on the conversion making a lot of the interior parts myself and trimming things up etc. We holidayed in it for that time, maybe every other month for weekends away and during school breaks. Less than £100 for a pitch for a long weekend. Had a great time with family, very relaxing indeed. I sold the camper a few weeks ago for £6500. In my view (and in my case) I would say that was pretty financially viable.

Hi Colin

 

I’m having the same head v heart musings about a campervan. I had hoped to camp occasionally in our Roomster but it became ‘poorly’ recently due to another driver/vehicle. (What to replace it with is another matter.)

 

If you haven’t already, you might like to see what a few YouTubers have decided to do when getting the campervan ‘twitch’:

Wee Broon Van have a Toyota Proace conversion.

Life is Too Short have one of those Sussex Nissans you mentioned but as they towed a fair-sized caravan for years they have been used to more space.

Cali Camper Family (I think that’s right) have recently been looking at the Ford Nugget.

I get my campervan ‘fix’ from these and a couple more every now and then.

Wheelhome’s website (as opposed to Wheelhouse) might be worth a look, too.

 

My original retirement heart’s desire was to tow a Go-Pod micro tourer - small enough for a garage/drive. I’ve bottled out of the hitching up part of it, if on my own, but it seemed to be good value.

 

I hope some of that helps!

Best wishes

Laura

 

 

8 hours ago, edwards said:

While its not as exciting as a new camper van, I think your new plan is probably sensible. We've thought about a camper ourselves and my parents even have a caravan we could borrow, but in the end we came to the conclusion that it was a lot less ballache and about the same cost to just rent a cottage for 3-4 weeks spread over the year. Bear in mind we are a 4-person family with 2 pre-tenage kids and also a springer spaniel so that would be less than fun in a camper.

 

I know its really not a financial decision at all, but by the time the depreciation (on a caravan probably £1k/year), insurance at £400, 'servicing' at £200 and then site fees of £30/night on average then I recon our cottage holidays aren't very different and we have a nice cottage and no setup/takedown/storage issues.

 

still, its a heart decision really.

 

 

It's like most things in life, if money was no object then I would move house for more outside space, buy a larger camper van & probably not use it because we would be away on planes to holiday in other far flung places

Reality is somewhat different. I'm with you on a holiday cottage. After years or camping under canvas when the kids were young if there is one thing that did not appeal was the  unpacking, setting up, tearing down & packing away for each stopover. Until my son was old enough to help on our camping trips muggins here had to most of the work & then I had to do all the the driving as well. I travelled a lot for work every week so it was like a busman's holiday when we went away. Now it's just me & the wife & I no longer work but I still have to all the driving as she wont drive my car or on the continent. 

 

I think hiring a camper is the best bet for us to see if it's for us before we even consider the subject any further.  

 

11 hours ago, Aspman said:

 

@Jars if you did all the conversion work on the interior pictures that's some outstanding work

Yup, that was all me and the in-law. No templates, kits or anything. He decides the layout and how he wants it to look, I’m just the “young’un” helping him realise his vision 

Edited 21 September, 20205 yr by jars

4 hours ago, Tech1e said:

 

I bought my Citroen Relay for £1600 six+ years ago. I spent around £2k on the conversion making a lot of the interior parts myself and trimming things up etc. We holidayed in it for that time, maybe every other month for weekends away and during school breaks. Less than £100 for a pitch for a long weekend. Had a great time with family, very relaxing indeed. I sold the camper a few weeks ago for £6500. In my view (and in my case) I would say that was pretty financially viable.

 

And some!!

 

The current situation has pushed up / inflated all leisure industry products & especially camper vans & camping gear as this type of family UK holiday is just about all that can be done at the moment while maintaining reasonable social distancing etc. Your £3.6k investment (excluding the time taken to do the work) turned into a £3k profit six year on proves my earlier thread statement that it is possible to buy & run a camper van for a couple of years & get you money back as a minimum. Since I do not want to do a van conversion myself, do I want to invest the sort of money needed (even for a few years) to get a camper with all the comforts of home? The answer to that conundrum I have decided is - no, so I'll sit tight & wait until the current situation sorts itself out before I decide what type of holiday we will end up taking & when.

 

2 hours ago, JellyK said:

Hi Colin

 

I’m having the same head v heart musings about a campervan. I had hoped to camp occasionally in our Roomster but it became ‘poorly’ recently due to another driver/vehicle. (What to replace it with is another matter.)

 

If you haven’t already, you might like to see what a few YouTubers have decided to do when getting the campervan ‘twitch’:

Wee Broon Van have a Toyota Proace conversion.

Life is Too Short have one of those Sussex Nissans you mentioned but as they towed a fair-sized caravan for years they have been used to more space.

Cali Camper Family (I think that’s right) have recently been looking at the Ford Nugget.

I get my campervan ‘fix’ from these and a couple more every now and then.

Wheelhome’s website (as opposed to Wheelhouse) might be worth a look, too.

 

My original retirement heart’s desire was to tow a Go-Pod micro tourer - small enough for a garage/drive. I’ve bottled out of the hitching up part of it, if on my own, but it seemed to be good value.

 

I hope some of that helps!

Best wishes

Laura

 

 

 

Hi Laura. 

 

Sorry to here about your Roomster.

 

I have seen some of the Wee Broon videos you mentioned. If I'm right that's a new Wellhouse Toyota Proace conversion which starts at around  £45k before extras. 

That Ford Transit Nugget thing is a semi official Ford Camper van (converted by Westfalia I think) & it ain't cheap either - from £55k! However, it is bigger than a VW Camper.

 

Alongside the imported Toyota Alphard / Nissan Elgrand mpv conversions (£circa £23k) I even looked at some of the Japanese K car based campers. These are really tiny compact campervans - but in reality they are just too small. 

Towing anything was a no go for me - even a quick pitch trailer tent. Just too much hassle towing anything off the beaten track & the 50mph speed restriction makes long trips (especially abroad) far too long. Storage was also a problem for me.  

 

No, I think after much deliberation & consideration, I have decided to put it all on hold for the time being. I might hire a camper van next year if possible to scratch the itch & see how I go from there. 

 

Good luck with finding a replacement for your Roomster - which won't be easy as they were a bit unique. 

Just seen this and I would say it depends on how you want to approach it from a capability point of view ie if you're handy with the spanners etc. 

 

A reasonable (after a lot of research and being picky) Mazda Bongo / Ford Freda can be had for as little as £4000.

On 18/09/2020 at 19:28, e-Roottoot said:

Not the best time obviously, just the lack of places for emptying chemical toilets is an issue.

Then those that are not aware that some septic tanks can not be used for emptying chemical toilets into.

 

16 hours ago, PaulCanning said:

Just seen this and I would say it depends on how you want to approach it from a capability point of view ie if you're handy with the spanners etc. 

 

A reasonable (after a lot of research and being picky) Mazda Bongo / Ford Freda can be had for as little as £4000.

 

I can wield spanner when needed (ex AC / elec / mech engineer) but tbh I'm past all that now. Even though I have more time than ever before I want to enjoy my retirement time & not give myself loads long term projects to do. The camper is on the back burner for the time being, at least until things return to some sort of normality. Will probably hire one first & see how I go from there. That said it does not stop me looking!!

At Aberdeen beach. Spotted on Facebook not in the flesh.

I saw the same one parked at a spot on Sheffield canal last year. They have a page on Facebook but couldn't tell you what it's called mind...